RUTUS ALTER 71 THREAD

I will be out on a pasture field this Sunday where we found a hoard of Charles 1st hammered coins last year a lot of the coins were shillings so i will be trying out the large silver preset for sure.

"The best of luck with that!
Tried the "Big Silver Mode" and didn't get on with it but for your defined requirements, it might suit?"

Des D Wrote:
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> "The best of luck with that!
> Tried the "Big Silver Mode" and didn't get on with
> it but for your defined requirements, it might sui
> t?"

Haha Des from my air testing the big silver mode sounds ok but out in the field it will be another story, of course i will be trying other modes maybe coin preset @ 8Khz with the relic sound profile.

sanjuro Wrote:
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> Des D Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > "The best of luck with that!
> > Tried the "Big Silver Mode" and didn't get on wi
> th
> > it but for your defined requirements, it might s
> ui
> > t?"
>
> Haha Des from my air testing the big silver mode s
> ounds ok but out in the field it will be another s
> tory, of course i will be trying other modes maybe
> coin preset @ 8Khz with the relic sound profile.

"That sounds like a good set up?
On 'pasture', the Big Silver mode 'should be' OK provided you've a good ground balance and you aren't over driving it by too much Gain?
I've used the Big Silver on 'last year's stubble' only and it was a bit 'sing songy' meaning a bit fluttery and slightly unstable?"

I took Mr. Rutus to a different beach today. Mostly 1-6" diameter rocks, with a bit of sand and red clay sediment in between the rocks. About a 1/4 mile long. Lots of areas to search. I decided to use the basic mode as any digging is tough.I did not want to dig deep. 11DD coil. Was able to ground balance fine, was able to keep the sensitivity between 80 and max of 90. I'm paying more attention to the audio, and am noticing that coins have just a bit smoother sound to them. Also the number ID is usually tight on coins, only a 1-3 digit bounce. And the hodograph is a rather straight vertical line of dots.
I'm also learning to better pick out the bottlecaps. They sound awesome one way, turn 90 d and resweep, and either there is no audio, or, lousy audio. And the numbers drop 10 or more points. A lot of times the hodo also has a horizontal bias to it. There are still a few plated caps that are hard to distinguish,, but I'm still working on those .
Pulltabs are also getting easier to pass up. Some read higher than they should, but their numbers range is wider, more bounce. Also the hodo dots tend to go horizontal and curl around. I'm really liking that hodo a lot.
Now rings can show up all over the scale depending on what they are made of, but their numbers are very tight, usually only one or two numbers. And the hodo, goes vertical. I feel the way this detector shows the difference between pulltabs and rings, with A: the expanded numerical scale of 90 points given to non ferrous targets, spreading them out , and seeing the difference in the tightness of numbers , and B: the hodograph displaying aluminum in a mostly horizontal manner, vs rings tending to show a more vertical pattern , will result in a lot of rings being found amongst the tabs, to those operators who are paying attention.

I took a break from the 71, and for the last hour fired up the Sovereign GT. I use a Sunray ID meter which I really like. But here is the problem with finding rings within the alum tab zone...... You only see a number.
Many rings will read exactly as tabs. Last year I dug tabs by the bucket, and still no gold ring. Got sick of it. Finally , I ignored the tab range, dug just higher conductors. With the 71, and some patience , my ring count should go way up. I did find another ring with the 71 today, it was my first target , a silver 925 mens ring. So far 7 rings , on 4 beach hunts. I now have about 11 hours on the 71, battery indicater shows 2/3 remaining on alkaline batteries (6).
I'm liking the 71 more everytime I use it. And I still have a lot to learn from it.

These guys have a great test ''garden''

[www.youtube.com]

Here is a video I found on the tube, airtesting various American coins and some trash targets. Watch the Hodograph. The numbers do bounce a bit, and that's why I have not hit the parks yet. I want to get to know this machine well before digging on manicured lawns. [www.youtube.com]

Here is a salt beach test I found on the tube [www.youtube.com] I hope Mr Dunne doesn't mind posting the link here.

HH

Does anyone have a test garden with a buried US dime or quarter at 10 inches or more and be able to compare the Alter 71 with an F75 or FBS machine? Try to evaluate both the audio and ID if still possible. This thing is really interesting.

Hi Tab,
The soil I have here I get about 20% less detection depth than Keith Southerns dirt, using the same brand/ model. My 10" dime buried is about 5 years buried. When I first buried it my explorer se could not hit it. But Minelabs do not do well on fresh buried coins. 3 years ago my T2 could only hit the 8",in 3 tone, not the 9 or 10" dime. My red racer could hit the 9" dime in 3 tone, most of the time. The 71 nails the 10" with full audio and full VID.
I have only been hunting fresh water beaches so far, and its a few inches deeper than the Se, with 11"coil. I no longer have the se, but recently I sold my Sovereign GT,and red racer with big coil , as they were my beach machines , but are no longer needed.

With temps in the low 80's today, I took the day off and took Mr Rutus back to the beach in my last post. I used the 11" dd coil, basic mode, disc at 35 to knock out iron, sensitivity at 80. For the first hour I still dug a bit of trashy stuff, mainly lead weights and some aluminum. The round lead fishing weights fooled me , as they read the same from all directions. The oblong weights would read about 5 digits higher the long way, than the shorter side. I also dug a few pulltabs that were reading in the nickel range, the number spread was about 5-7 digits but I dug them anyway just to see. I dug 2 pulltab tabs , they were laying flat. Scanning one way , then scanning at a 90 degree angle produced a number that was 3- digits different from the first scan. Also the HODO showed a scattered pattern. I really like the expanded number scale on this detector. It really fine tunes or shows more detail whats under the coil. The only iron I dug was 2 small carpet tacks, and also a good size nail which was laying next to a quarter. It told me the quarter was there, but the nail was a surprise.
I did dig a few steel bottle caps the first hour also, just to check. They were reading near the quarter range, but the HODO was indicating an iron smear. After the first hour, I concentrated on just digging targets that sounded good, showed a tight number group, and watched the HODO. After 2 hours, I picked up 6 quarters, 6 dimes, 1 nickel, 9 pennies, and a sterling silver ring. I dug very few trash items during that period. But I did spend some time analyzing signals. It reminds me of the explorer I had. Kind of working the signals, and going at a slower pace. The numbers do tend to jump around a bit. Now the quarters were locking in at 107, but the corroded dimes and zinc pennies were jumping. The dimes were locking in sometimes in the low 90's, sometimes in the hi 90's. But the audio was telling me its a coin, and the HODO as well. The pennies were doing the same thing in the 80's. The ring read in the dime range, I thought it was going to be a dime. I have around 15 hours on it now ,Batteries are just above the halfway mark. I'm feeling very comfortable in the basic mode, I hope to hit a park or two after we get some rain. HH

Relic hunting with the rutus and deus

[www.youtube.com]

hi possum mo
i heard you saying the audio tapers off on the deeper targets .
have you tried using the audio gain yet ? most of programmes have it set to 20 out of 60 .
i tried it at 40 and noticed a good increase in volume on deeper signal .
its a weak signal boost by look of things , and though it impacts on you ability to judge depth as easy it gives you less chance of missing the whispers .

I have not played with the settings much. I've been concentrating on the VDI numbers, audio and HODO. I'm getting pretty comfortable with that now, but I need more time to use it. Busy season at work.

Wanted to apologize for not being active in this thread as a alter 71 owner my computer died and I just got a new one. I'm loving my alter 71 it's a all around great machine and the hodo is really accurate. I like it more than AKA's hodo. I also tend to prefer the 11' coil over the 9' concentric because the 11 is a DD so I get better readings in my soil. I have to say that the number scale did take a bit to get used to I'm not used to seeing a machine with above 100 scale.

Ill post more when I get more than 10 hours on the machine.

Just a few hours on mine as well, seems ok.

Been playing in my test garden, defo an interesting machine.
In comparison to the GM5+ it's a milder more sedate machine, the GM has a lot more raw power in 18khz and hits hard and deep on very small targets and it's hard to beat at that game on old pastures.
The Rutus hits better/deeper on big conductor coins than the GM and it's better at separation with similar size dd coils.
It doesn't lose too much depth in my soil, gets the 12" Victorian penny a silver sixpence and dime @8" in preset programs.
If the Impact is 30 something detectors, the Rutus is 71 detectors in one, so versatile, really looking forward to getting more time on it.

The Rutus looks like a good detector. Do they make a smaller coil than the 9''coil?

I think there's a sniper type coil coming and a receiver for the wirless headphones.
The concentric coil is very good though, i was trying to fool it with 2 rusty nails and a nickel but i couldn't, be different though if the nail was an inch or two above the coin.

Hard to fool this coil when the nails are on the same level.
[youtu.be]

ghound Wrote:
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> Hard to fool this coil when the nails are on the s
> ame level.
> [youtu.be]


That's impressive. How concerned should US buyers be that there isn't US based service?

>
> That's impressive. How concerned should US buyers
> be that there isn't US based service?

Along those lines I read there is some sort of software upgrade due in 2017 (Rutus thread, comments by Shelton on detectorprospector.com). But who really knows? Sometimes those things never happen or take years. As far as I have read it is not possible for the owner to upgrade the software. Couple that with shipping from the US back to Poland for service/upgrades (costs?) means it's deal killer for me for now. Plus I still only see demonstrations in pastures, driveways, beaches, etc. Nothing urban based where it has to face a variety of EMI sources and trash so it seems to be a niche machine.

TabWhisperer Wrote:
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>
> Along those lines I read there is some sort of sof
> tware upgrade due in 2017 (Rutus thread, comments
> by Shelton on detectorprospector.com). But who re
> ally knows? Sometimes those things never happen o
> r take years. As far as I have read it is not pos
> sible for the owner to upgrade the software. Coup
> le that with shipping from the US back to Poland f
> or service/upgrades (costs?) means it's deal kille
> r for me for now. Plus I still only see demonstra
> tions in pastures, driveways, beaches, etc. Nothi
> ng urban based where it has to face a variety of E
> MI sources and trash so it seems to be a niche mac
> hine.

I'm afraid it is for me too. I love the thought of this machine, but not without a way to get problems resolved.

I think a lot of these manufacturers are not targeting the US, they have a big enough market in europe to be getting on with, kinda has us UK detectorist a bit spoilt for choice.

Nokta seems to be doing it right. They've made arrangements to sell it through US distributors and have a service agreement with Kellyco. And I appreciate that their sales rep is so active on forums.

It puts the Impact in the mix for me.

Yes Nokta are defo going worldwide, the Alter looks 'plain Jane' sitting beside the Impact, but it boasts just as many or more features, also a lot lighter even with a bigger coil and 6 batteries, runs concentric and DD coils, longer battery life etc etc
i just couldn't justify the extra £200 for the Impact.

The Alter 71 looks like a great machine. It would probably be at the top of my list if it had a US service option. It's nothing against Rutus, I just like knowing how I'd deal with an issue if one arises. It's even cheaper than the Impact.

[youtu.be]

Mineralized brick test with DD coil, the brick is too much for the concentric coil though.
I can put 2 bricks side by side to take in the footprint of the coil and get the same result.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 04/07/2017 11:46AM by ghound.

I've been detecting 2 local parks. I've been running in basic mode, ( 7khz) sensitivity from 75-85, disc set at 40, to knock out iron. On the beaches I have been at, I have dug some iron, some of the steel bottle caps read close to coins, but by watching the VDI and hodograph, I have been able to not dig them. In the parks, with different soil, clay and rocks, I have dug no iron. No caps, no nails. I really love the target ID 's on this machine.
The soil is rather dry, and my joints are getting older, and digging everything above iron, just does not interest me any more. There is plenty of alum can slaw and tabs . I have been using the 11 dd coil , and detecting in fairly thick trash areas. Any good solid audio signals I investigate. Nickels bounce at 51,52.. Alum tabs read 54-78. A lot of tabs come in at 54-60, bouncing 4 numbers. I basically dig all signals in the aluminum range that bounce between 2 numbers. Sometimes I get fooled, and dig a round pullring with the tab wrapped around the ring, or a squaretab. Those 2 items show very tight numbers, and the hodograph shows a vertical "good" line. Most aluminum show at least a 4 number spread, and the hodograph line ends wag like a cats tail, when they twitch the end. Today I hit a 57-58 ,which is right in the heart of the pulltab zone, and dig up a junk ring.
Last year, I dug probably 2000 clad coins, and 5 rings, so far this year with the 71, I'm at 108 clad , and 9 rings. With the expanded target ID scale on this machine, It makes ring picking so much easier than any other detector I have used. I really like the tri-ID combo........, audio, VDI numbers and the hodograph.
Zincolns read in the 80's , and tend to bounce quite a bit if corroded, but the audio is good, as is the hodo. Dimes read in the 90's , if tarnished bad, sometimes they read in the low 90's, sometimes dimes read in the mid or high 90's, but again, good audio and hodo. If 2 out of 3 ID 's are good I dig. Quarters hit at 106-107, very consistently.
I hit one target, good audio, numbers bouncing from 70 to 95. It turned out to be 4 targets in a 6" radius, a nickel, pulltab, zinc and dime.
So far, its an excellent beach machine, ring machine, and excellent discriminator, I really need to work on going after deep signals. We need more rain, and I need more practice. The deepest coins I hit so far are 2 wheat cents at 5". In my test garden, much deeper of course. HH



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/15/2017 08:46PM by possum mo.

Very nice report. If I were in the market for another detector this would be on the short list along with the GM5+ lite.

Tom

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In a democracy, it is difficult to win fellow citizens over to your own side, or to build public support to remedy injustices that remain all too real when you fundamentally misunderstand how they see the world.

New soft update is ready for Alter 71. Few more improvements, but biggest for mixed mode. New VCO option and nice modulate audio.