Being 6'2" kills me in my choice of detectors.

Short arms cause me to bend to detect and after 48 years it's tough. Got a chance to try the Impact and love some of its features. But alas it's an inch to short for me. The Rutus Alter 71 shared the same fate!

Some tallman bottom rods may be able too be adapted so that you could use a wider variety of detectors,alot of coils use the same width lugs or certainly a minimum amount of spacers,Whites do tall man bottom rods,they could well be used and i would think that also other brands offer them as well,which a slight bit of modification you could produce your ideal detector for your height.

I have found that by ordering the MIDDLE section,which is sorta standard, I have been able to use the original lower shaft which will fit that coil.

Minelab has always been good about having more than enough!!

Keith

“I don't care that they stole my idea . . I care that they don't have any of their own”
-Nikola Tesla

I was going to bring this question up the other day. Anybody have a list of lower rods that are interchangeable with other brands? Like a compatibility list? Search rod and coil side.

Rich


Junk and Disorderly Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Some tallman bottom rods may be able too be adapte
> d so that you could use a wider variety of detecto
> rs,alot of coils use the same width lugs or certai
> nly a minimum amount of spacers,Whites do tall man
> bottom rods,they could well be used and i would th
> ink that also other brands offer them as well,whic
> h a slight bit of modification you could produce y
> our ideal detector for your height.

------------------------------------------------------------------

Just one more good target before I go.

The Deus may be right up your alley. You can fashion a custom rod for your specific dimensions since the wireless feature is a major plus.

Quote
Alpha Goat
Short arms cause me to bend to detect and after 48 years it's tough. Got a chance to try the Impact and love some of its features. But alas it's an inch to short for me. The Rutus Alter 71 shared the same fate!

Hello AG,

Your configuration illustrates a point I wanted to address and didn't cover in my post about machine fit and balance.

Machine Balance


Search "angle".

You, are a perfect example of, "we are not all the same".
The height of a metal detector user is not judged by their overall height.
It is judged by the distance from the ground to their elbow.

Your "search angle" is different than average.
You have the height that puts you above average, but, your having shorter arms throws off the search angle.
In your case the search angle is off by so much, (so steep), that you would be sweeping just ahead of your toes unless you change the geometry of the machine.
In this case by altering the length of the forward end of the machine.
Two choices here.
First choice is a longer lower. A quick fix, good value for the dollar.
"But", you have just the one.
Second choice, when it's possible, is an extended middle section.
Swap out the stock middle section for the extended one and you're good to go.
Friend wants to try your machine, adjust the lower for them and their off and running.
If they are of slight stature, swap the stock middle section back and you're good to go.

Body Geometry

I'll give you this in a nutshell.

The majority of people are "Square"
That is to say, when they stand and position their arms resembling a crucifix, palms facing forward.......
A measurement taken "finger tip to fingertip" will be very close to their overall height.

You for instance AG.
At 6'2" your fingertip to fingertip measurement should be very close to 74"

My own geometry is a good example of the opposite of AG.
I am 5'6", and fingertip to fingertip I measure right at 73"
Since I am not 6'1" obviously I have long arms.

Many years ago I called Paul Chen to order a sword.
He says, "how tall are you", I answer, 5'6", he says, "ok no problem"
I say, "Just a second", "I barely have to tilt my shoulders and I can pull up my socks"
He laughed and asked what my reach was,... he went from shipping his longest sword, to shipping his shortest sword.

The correct blade length of a sword is established by a measurement sometimes called the "swing length".
A person standing up straight, sword at their side tip down, the tip shall not touch the ground with the arm fully extended.
Up to one inch clearance is permissible, after that you should choose a longer sword.
My swing length is only 29", AG's would be "Much" longer.

To measure your swing length stand straight, shoulders square, hold a medium size tape measure in the palm of your hand.
Extend the tape measure until it touches the ground, back it up about a 1/2".
Add the reading on the tape and half the body of the tape measure together. the sum is your swing length.


You may have noticed when the statistics are shown for a boxer or martial artist there is their "Reach" in inches.
This is represented by the fingertip to fingertip measurement mentioned above.

Body geometry affects other aspects of a persons life other than metal detecting. Although it is a perfect example.

On a shotgun, or a rifle, the distance from the butt of the stock to the trigger is referred to as the "length of pull".
AG could likely use an off the shelf shotgun and do pretty well with it.
I have to use a longer stock because "my length of pull" is excessively long.

How do you establish what "your" length of pull is?
Easy.
Sit at a desk or table. Set your elbow on the table your arm at 90 degrees, fingers pointing at the ceiling.
Crook your trigger finger to simulate it's position when firing.
Measure from the inside crook of your elbow to the pad of your crooked trigger finger.
This measurement should be very close, if not equal, to the measured length of pull from your shotgun or rifle.

That these two measurements correspond is of great importance to performance on breaking clays or scoring birds in the field.

Gloves, pool cues, shoes, hats,... somethings just have to fit the user.


I took a look at the Impact.
Tricky, the lower is other than round.
Still possible, just a little tricky.

If you need an extended lower so you can try out one of these machines let me know.


SandMan

I would feel many units have tall man rods....perhaps mention what units you want to use and one of the forum member can help in modding a rod if company does not have them. Lots of info available in this forum...

Alpha Goat Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Short arms cause me to bend to detect and after 48
> years it's tough. Got a chance to try the Impact a
> nd love some of its features. But alas it's an inc
> h to short for me. The Rutus Alter 71 shared the
> same fate!

Being 6'6" kills me in my choice of EVERYTHING.

Shoes, socks, shirts, pants, cars, beds, RVs, sleeping bags, tents, etc.

But maybe my longish arms (and my willingness to swing the coil fairly
close to my feet) will let me use my incoming Impact. I'll know soon.

Buy a longer lower rod.

Add a second middle rod (depends on the machine)

Make a 'clevis extender', to go between the coil ears and the lower rod. You'll need a second coil-fixing bolt.

You may be able to re-fit the lower rod spring-pip closer to the end of the rod (by making a new hole) so the shaft extends more. Obviously you need to have a reasonable overlap of the rods, so this may not suit some machines, you're the judge.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/27/2017 01:02PM by Pimento.

Yep I'm 6'4" and use a xterra 705 which stock has more than enough. My etrac did not have the length I needed nor did most detectors. Tall man rods on my fishers and whites. But out of the box stock the 705 was only one that had the length.

Great post Sandman. Thanks for taking the time! SandMan Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>

Quote
Alpha Goat
> Short arms cause me to bend to detect and after 48
> years it's tough. Got a chance to try the Impact a
> nd love some of its features. But alas it's an inc
> h to short for me. The Rutus Alter 71 shared the s
> ame fate!

>
> Hello AG,
>
> Your configuration illustrates a point I wanted t
> o address and didn't cover in my post about machin
> e fit and balance.
>
> [url=http://www.dankowskidetectors.com/discussions
> /read.php?2,123251,123527#msg-123527]Machine Balan
> ce[/url]
>
>
> Search "angle".
>
> You, are a perfect example of, "we are not all the
> same".
> The height of a metal detector user is not judged
> by their overall height.
> It is judged by the distance from the ground to th
> eir elbow.
>
> Your "search angle" is different than average.
> You have the height that puts you above average, b
> ut, your having shorter arms throws off the search
> angle.
> In your case the search angle is off by so much, (
> so steep), that you would be sweeping just ahead o
> f your toes unless you change the geometry of the
> machine.
> In this case by altering the length of the forward
> end of the machine.
> Two choices here.
> First choice is a longer lower. A quick fix, good
> value for the dollar.
> "But", you have just the one.
> Second choice, when it's possible, is an extended
> middle section.
> Swap out the stock middle section for the extended
> one and you're good to go.
> Friend wants to try your machine, adjust the lower
> for them and their off and running.
> If they are of slight stature, swap the stock midd
> le section back and you're good to go.
>
> [b]Body Geometry[/b]
>
> I'll give you this in a nutshell.
>
> The majority of people are "Square"
> That is to say, when they stand and position their
> arms resembling a crucifix, palms facing forward..
> .....
> A measurement taken "finger tip to fingertip" will
> be very close to their overall height.
>
> You for instance AG.
> At 6'2" your fingertip to fingertip measurement sh
> ould be very close to 74"
>
> My own geometry is a good example of the opposite
> of AG.
> I am 5'6", and fingertip to fingertip I measure ri
> ght at 73"
> Since I am not 6'1" obviously I have long arms.
>
> Many years ago I called Paul Chen to order a sword
> .
> He says, "how tall are you", I answer, 5'6", he sa
> ys, "ok no problem"
> I say, "Just a second", "I barely have to tilt my
> shoulders and I can pull up my socks"
> He laughed and asked what my reach was,... he went
> from shipping his longest sword, to shipping his s
> hortest sword.
>
> The correct blade length of a sword is established
> by a measurement sometimes called the "swing lengt
> h".
> A person standing up straight, sword at their side
> tip down, the tip shall not touch the ground with
> the arm fully extended.
> Up to one inch clearance is permissible, after tha
> t you should choose a longer sword.
> My swing length is only 29", AG's would be "Much"
> longer.
>
> To measure your swing length stand straight, shoul
> ders square, hold a medium size tape measure in th
> e palm of your hand.
> Extend the tape measure until it touches the groun
> d, back it up about a 1/2".
> Add the reading on the tape and half the body of t
> he tape measure together. the sum is your swing le
> ngth.
>
>
> You may have noticed when the statistics are shown
> for a boxer or martial artist there is their "Reac
> h" in inches.
> This is represented by the fingertip to fingertip
> measurement mentioned above.
>
> Body geometry affects other aspects of a persons l
> ife other than metal detecting. Although it is a p
> erfect example.
>
> On a shotgun, or a rifle, the distance from the bu
> tt of the stock to the trigger is referred to as t
> he "length of pull".
> AG could likely use an off the shelf shotgun and d
> o pretty well with it.
> I have to use a longer stock because "my length of
> pull" is excessively long.
>
> How do you establish what "your" length of pull is
> ?
> Easy.
> Sit at a desk or table. Set your elbow on the tabl
> e your arm at 90 degrees, fingers pointing at the
> ceiling.
> Crook your trigger finger to simulate it's positio
> n when firing.
> Measure from the inside crook of your elbow to the
> pad of your crooked trigger finger.
> This measurement should be very close, if not equa
> l, to the measured length of pull from your shotgu
> n or rifle.
>
> That these two measurements correspond is of great
> importance to performance on breaking clays or sco
> ring birds in the field.
>
> Gloves, pool cues, shoes, hats,... somethings just
> have to fit the user.
>
>
> I took a look at the Impact.
> Tricky, the lower is other than round.
> Still possible, just a little tricky.
>
> If you need an extended lower so you can try out o
> ne of these machines let me know.
>
>
> SandMan

Alpha Goat Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Short arms cause me to bend to detect and after 48
> years it's tough. Got a chance to try the Impact a
> nd love some of its features. But alas it's an inc
> h to short for me. The Rutus Alter 71 shared the
> same fate!

I can supply Nexus with any stem length you need if you are interested in analogue detectors.

Quote
Alpha Goat
Great post Sandman. Thanks for taking the time!

Any time AG!
Happy to help.

I feel so bad for you all.

Many years ago I was at a broaching house.
They make broaching tools.
Like when you see internal splines,.... say the yoke for a transmission.

There was a small O.D. grinder there, about same as the one I used during my apprenticeship.
On it, a tall guy, maybe 6'4" or more.
"All hunched over like a question mark" carefully watching as he dressed the wheel, then back to grinding the broach he was grinding.
I even said to the owner of the place, "that guy should be on a different machine", "he is going to wind up crippled."

The owner could care less, he's a first class jerk.

I didn't mention in my post above, that years ago I helped "Tall" golfers by..........
In a nutshell:

Can a golfer get whatever length shaft he needs to play the game?
Yes, of course he can.
Are the "club heads" the same weight as the factory provides in every case?
Yes, yes they are.

Well, when you put the same weight head on a longer shaft things change.
First off, the club head punches way over it's body weight.
Second, the "velocity" changes.
Third, shaft flex during the swing and at impact are different.
Fourth, there is a tendency to "over swing", over twisting at the waist, over rotating, over working the players back.

That fourth one. That is how I got got pulled in.
The guy was not able to play any longer because he was having back problems.

On his own he bought one of those special "golf club scales"
He brought me the scale, and a list of numbers he had worked out.
One by one I altered each club head, still on the shaft, by removing material from the back of each club head.
Carefully checking on the club on the scale to get the exact number the guy had arrived at.



The scale he brought me was not like the one above, they didn't exist.
The work I did was over 20 years ago.
The scale he brought me was a manual, sliding weight, scale.

You see, all that has been done in the golf industry to deal with "swing weight", is sell you a roll of lead tape.

LOL

They "only look at Adding weight. (using lead tape).

Never once have they addressed the needs of tall players, using longer shafts, by reducing the weight of the club head.

Oh, please note................
By tournament rules, "No club may be altered in any way from the makers configuration"
"With the exception of the grip"

So, for professionals, no lead tape, no long haired machinist altering the weight of the club head to lighten up the swing weight.


So, add golf clubs to the list of things that should "fit" the user.

"Off the shelf golf clubs are designed to cover the average user"


Later we'll talk about bowling balls.
(just kidding)


For the best performance, in anything, the unit should fit the user.


SandMan


PS: Here is a Very good piece done up by a professional.
A real good read, even if you're not a golfer.

Swing Weight Explained

It is with great joy that, at 5'9", I now look down on all you tall guys with pity in my heart for your disability in metal detecting.

Past(or)Tom
Using a Legend, a Deus 2, an Equinox 800, a Tarsacci MDT 8000, & a few others...
with my beloved, fading Corgi, Sadie

Pasttom Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It is with great joy that, at 5'9", I now look dow
> n on all you tall guys with pity in my heart for y
> our disability in metal detecting.


Amen Pastor, Amen!

Yeah and I'm looking down at an 1849 O half dollar I dug last weekend with mint luster. Poor me!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/22/2017 07:05PM by Alpha Goat.

SandMan, thank you so much for putting up the info on detector ergonomics.

I absolutely appreciate it. Seeing other detectorists with rounded backs
or painful to look at postures made me aware of this situation.
Yes, I could feel the beginnings of such misalignments within myself.

I am lucky to have a girlfriend that likes detecting too.
We can observe each other detecting looking especially at gait & posture.
It can take quite some effort to change bad postures and needing
constant reminder/feedback at first. It's worth it, even if detecting speed is
slower at first.

Is there even more info about this topic anywhere (detecting related)?

I'm 6'3 so I have a even harder time whites machines with standard rods work for me. Tall man's are even better. Minelab are all too short. Except a sovereign or a excal on a straight. Which I have 2 excals that work.

Quote
Scoopy_Doo
SandMan, thank you so much for putting up the info on detector ergonomics.

I absolutely appreciate it. Seeing other detectorists with rounded backs
or painful to look at postures made me aware of this situation.
Yes, I could feel the beginnings of such misalignments within myself.

You're welcome, I'm happy to help.
You are 100% on it.
For me it was working with, and seeing, the old guys that had spent 30-40, or more, years, hunched over a Hardinge chucker.
The trade can leave you hunched over like a question mark.

Quote
Scoopy_Doo
I am lucky to have a girlfriend that likes detecting too.
We can observe each other detecting looking especially at gait & posture.
It can take quite some effort to change bad postures and needing
constant reminder/feedback at first. It's worth it, even if detecting speed is
slower at first.

Getting ahead of the the problem before you are miserable is hard.
For you, not as hard. Because you have someone to help you.
Like this........

"Sit up straight", "you're all hunched over, do you need more light?", "move your plate closer, sit up straight".
For a single guy to break the bad habits of poor posture,....probably harder than quitting smoking.

You two can help each other.
"Everything to gain, nothing to lose".

Quote
Scoopy_Doo
Is there even more info about this topic anywhere (detecting related)?

None that I have come across.

This is a mega search engine. It combines all the know search engines, and it's private.
Dig around and see what you find.
Startpage


I did a search for what I was taught and didn't see a bit of it.
Very good information.
I wish I had the pictures I had many moons ago.

Tomorrow I'll make a good post of I the all information I can.

Well, just to wrap up my portion of this thread...

I received my Nokta Impact on April 25 and assembled it.
I stretched the lower shaft to the maximum mark (the line
beyond "7"), and tried it out. The length is pretty much perfect
for me! I was VERY happy to discover this.

After a short test in my back yard, I took the Impact to my local
park for a couple of hours, and then to my favorite California beach.
The next day (April 26) I took it to the beach again. I'm having great fun
learning the different modes and settings, and I'm finding lots of stuff.

I like the balance with the standard coil. Three hours at a time detecting
on the beach did not cause any problems due to the Impact's weight,
balance, length, etc. Tomorrow I'm going to try the small coil. (Back to
the park for that.)

So for at least ONE tall guy with longish arms, the Impact fits well.
Good job, Nokta!

I passed it along to Dilek George about the rod...

maybe you can hope for a longer OPTIONAL middle or lower shaft at some point???

I know Whites does a longer lower and or longer middle as OPTIONS....

for you FTP guys a Bounty hunter lower shaft does wonders.there a few inches longer by design....and CHEAP..[www.kellycodetectors.com]

Keith

“I don't care that they stole my idea . . I care that they don't have any of their own”
-Nikola Tesla



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 04/27/2017 05:31PM by Keith Southern.