New Fisher Manta

paulie Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I think a price between $1800 - $2100 usd could p
> ossibly be a fair price. Fishers top of the line
> uw detectors the sar1 and pulse 8x are advertised
> as their commercial and professional detectors. t
> he pulse for about $2100 and the sar1 for about $1
> 900 usd. i think going over $2500 would eliminate
> the majority of detectorists. not saying its not w
> orth more, many just cant afford it. I think that
> at a price point of about $1999 they would fly off
> the shelves. I think that if Fishers prices this a
> s affordable to the majority. they will be at the
> top of the mountain #1 paul


First, like Kenne-Bill said, you're talking about the wrong company.

Secondly, I think the days of $2000 and up detectors are over. Modern computerized circuitry just doesn't cost that much to make anymore.

I expect the Fisher Manta will be priced right around $1000. Maybe less, depending on the complexity.

.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 06/25/2018 10:24AM by Badger in NH.

I think you are right..... even water guys wouldnt jump very fast on a water machine thats up around the $2500 mark. Yet we did with the CTX once it proved its self as a beach machine...... and we even know most water machines pay for themselves rather quickly. You also have to figure ......... this is a machine some are saying is BETTER than the AquaStar. A higher price will slow the purchases..... but no so much for the real water hunters looking for an edge. Some may ...... hold off to see what the machine is really capable of. If it lives up to the billing that $2500 price would still sell machines. It also depends on Fishers thought on just what is the size of the market for a PI just for water hunting...... and is there enough changes to make it desirable for the average hunter?

Dew

I think you are right..... even water guys wouldnt jump very fast on a water machine thats up around the $2500 mark. Yet we did with the CTX once it proved its self as a beach machine...... and we even know most water machines pay for themselves rather quickly. You also have to figure ......... this is a machine some are saying is BETTER than the AquaStar. A higher price will slow the purchases..... but no so much for the real water hunters looking for an edge. Some may ...... hold off to see what the machine is really capable of. If it lives up to the billing that $2500 price would still sell machines. It also depends on Fishers thought on just what is the size of the market for a PI just for water hunting...... and is there enough changes to make it desirable for the average hunter? Its not a machine for everyone........ but then neither is their deep ocean one.

Dew

I think they should make two models of the Manta. One for the water and one for the wet sand.

A wet sand detector doesn't need to be waterproof to so many feet. It just needs to be water resistant. That should help bring the price down a bit for those who don't water hunt.

and please don't put a speaker on it. They are useless. Speakers should be a plug-in accessory, not built in.

.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/25/2018 01:50PM by Badger in NH.

Lol..... ive been so criticized for saying an external speaker for a beach guy is just another area to leak. But its cheaper to do one model.... especially if the guys are the same.

Badger in NH Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I think they should make two models of the Manta.
> One for the water and one for the wet sand.
>
> A wet sand detector doesn't need to be waterproof
> to so many feet. It just needs to be water resista
> nt. That should help bring the price down a bit fo
> r those who don't water hunt.
>
> and please don't put a speaker on it. Speakers are
> useless. They should be a plug-in accessory, not b
> uilt in.


I like how the minelab machines are water proof to 10ft. This keeps them light but still able to take in the water for wading. I also like the speaker. I actually use it sometimes when its quiet on the beach and don't feel like putting the headphones on though its a feature I could easily live without.

_________________________________

Nox600, CTX, CZ21, Excal II and White's DF with 920i stealthscoop...I live and hunt at the beach in Wilm NC

dewcon4414 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
its cheaper to do one model.... especially if the guys are the same.
-

If it's cheaper to make one model, why does Fisher make eleven different F-series detectors?

Waterproofing is just a step in the assembly process that if omitted would save them some time and labor. The price of a non-waterproof model might be considerably less. I would go for that.

Beach waterhunting is almost non-existent in New England and many other places with fairly large tides where there is little or no advantage in submerging the detector.



Edited 5 time(s). Last edit at 06/25/2018 04:53PM by Badger in NH.

thanks for the correction thought they were related, paul

I understand they will be making one for dirt...... does that mean it wont be able to work yhe shallow water? I guess it depends on how they build it..... look at the Nox. Very compact and waterproof. ... why shouldnt a PI be? You thinking knobs and having to seal them. Maybe .... just maybe it can be fone with digital buttons.

I'm all for waterproof but if the waterproofing adds a lot to the cost then I can do without it.

I mainly hunt the wet sand and never go in water over knee deep.

Except for specialized high end gold detectors, the days of >$1K detectors should be over.... I suppose they are if people vote with their wallets.

Even though some may feel the CTX still reigns supreme, if you were shopping for a new detector, would you shell out $2500 for the CTX or pocket a $1600 savings, and drop $899 on the EQ800?

dewcon4414 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I understand they will be making one for dirt.....
> . does that mean it wont be able to work yhe shall
> ow water? I guess it depends on how they build i
> t..... look at the Nox. Very compact and waterpr
> oof. ... why shouldnt a PI be? You thinking knob
> s and having to seal them. Maybe .... just maybe
> it can be fone with digital buttons.


no, real knobs on the first version
the signal processing / all digital / request more works on a PI ....

about tightness / Manta will present a world first
something never seen / on any detector, waterproof



Cal_cobra Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Except for specialized high end gold detectors, th
> e days of >$1K detectors should be over.... I supp
> ose they are if people vote with their wallets.
>
> Even though some may feel the CTX still reigns sup
> reme, if you were shopping for a new detect
> or, would you shell out $2500 for the CTX or pocke
> t a $1600 savings, and drop $899 on the EQ800?

he will be a high-end gold detector
probably the best for the beach
on one condition: digging ..

for this kind of machine
and those who know the beach, the price is not really a problem

I remember paying 2000 $ my goldscan 5c // used !!!
refunded in gold in less than two months ...

whoever really seeks gold
will always want the best machine for gold

there is still a lot of high yield spot in the world
with the Manta / some will pick up 1000 $ a month
for some / it will be per day //////// but those there / in general does not speak ...

I dont disagree most beach hunters would pay the 2 grand for a gold magnet machine. Some would wait on reviews..... some wouldnt want to dig.....some dont like chasing small targets...... some like to cover more beach chasing recent drops..... some prefer to chase change in the dry sand..... BUT the serious hunter will watch this machine carefully or buy it straight out. I bought two AquaSounds.... new they were over $3000 each (i didnt pay that much).... 14khz single freq that were really only usable here in Fl for water hunting. Sometimes you just have to change it up and not follow the crowd.......never know what you might be missing.

NASA-Tom Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It'll surpass TDI.

In the depth category?
We all know you and Carl are involved, Carl for sure, but will there ever be a Manta version for inland hunting. Wish list is one that will ignore nails and still hit on the deep silver.
I tried the same gold experiment (gold ring with nails on top) with my TDI and it will detect a gold ring surrounded by nails.


Manta iron and nails

[www.youtube.com]


TDI iron and nails

[www.youtube.com]

Most will say it's not possible for a PI to ignore nails and hit silver, but many years ago people said we would never visit the moon.

The best gold I've ever recovered is with the TDI.

Wish list is one (PI) that will ignore nails and still hit on the deep silver.

Regardless of what people say, it's possible.

Ha..... Mark.... and i want one that passes on everything but Gold lol. However, ill settle on one that CAN find the gold to include micro yet ill be able to cleanly notch or disc targets... or at least know with some certainty it IRON.

This is one of my first built Mirage PI detectors 2013. [www.youtube.com]
With the calibration, it would pick up iron nails to about 7" depending upon the coil size, after that it simply ignored the nails. But, would still pick up a gold ring against the nail at deeper depths. The nail would actually enhance the gold ring signal a bit.
The Mirage was designed around finding small gold so it lacks in depth on silver compared to other general purpose PI's. But, respectable compared to many VLF's. The Mirage is not a processor controlled Pi, just an analog digital circuit. Originally based on Carl Morelands Hammerhead Pi base design with quite a few changes made to it. Not a miracle machine but, the Mirage works excellent in school yards and parks contrary to what most people think about a Pi usability in trashy areas.

Right now I don't see anything about the Manta that overly impresses me to make me want to run out and buy one. It is interesting to see an Eric Foster design enhanced with a computer processor and dedicated software to achieve the end results the videos show.
Its a step in the right direction moving the Pi detector to the forefront. Just wondering what could have happened to the White's Eric Foster TDi if Carl Moreland stayed with Whites, not sure what happened to the Pi project. Looks like Fisher is fast tracking and left White's in the dust regarding a better water hunting Pi.

Anyways, always interested in seeing the Manta improvements and the final production model. Who knows maybe it will be compact and housed in a cellphone type waterproof case.

DeepTech Vista X with 3 search coils.
Works for me

markg Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Most will say it's not possible for a PI to ignore
> nails and hit silver, but many years ago people sa
> id we would never visit the moon.
>
> The best gold I've ever recovered is with the TDI.
>
> Wish list is one (PI) that will ignore nails and s
> till hit on the deep silver.
>
> Regardless of what people say, it's possible.

We are all hoping for the best. Of course. But regarding the statement about the moon (and naysayers prior to the moon-landing): This does mean that "therefore, all things are possible". It merely means that the naysayers, regarding the moon, were wrong. Not that anything someone can think/dream of, is therefore possible. And that nothing is impossible.

There are some things that are logical contradictions, and impossible. (Eg.: making a square circle, etc....). Not saying that I'm not hoping for future dream machines too



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/07/2018 03:31PM by Tom_in_CA.

dewcon4414 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Ha..... Mark.... and i want one that passes on eve
> rything but Gold lol. However, ill settle on one
> that CAN find the gold to include micro yet ill be
> able to cleanly notch or disc targets... or at lea
> st know with some certainty it IRON.


yes, yes, yes

markg Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> dewcon4414 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Ha..... Mark.... and i want one that passes on e
> ve
> > rything but Gold lol. However, ill settle on o
> ne
> > that CAN find the gold to include micro yet ill
> be
> > able to cleanly notch or disc targets... or at l
> ea
> > st know with some certainty it IRON.
>
>
> yes, yes, yes

Correct. We need to invent a detector that doesn't differentiate based on CONDUCTIVITY. But instead differentiates on COMPOSITION. Then ... presto, ... set the knob for "gold only", haha

There is actually science that can do this, that I read about in the early 1990s. Westinghouse Co. had been commissioned by the military to develop something for purposes of detecting explosives, contaminants , etc.... But it was mounted on a bobcat tractor, and you had to wear lead suits to operate, and cost millions of dollars, and required reams of govt. permits to use/operate.

I talked to one of the engineers on that Westinghouse project. I explained the current metal detector ability of TID (based on conductivity). And how gold rings and pulltabs or foil wads can read EXACTLY THE SAME on the graph, screen, #'s, etc.... After hearing of the detector short-comings, he said that ... yes ... in a case such as this (the two objects reading exactly the same), that his team's machine would be able to tell you which one was aluminum, and which one was gold.

That was 25 or so years ago. Not sure how much smaller the package is now, and/or whether it still requires lead suits, or whether the technology was advanced or used any further. It was strictly for military purposes , and not intended to tell gold apart from aluminum (at least not for hobbyists purposes).

Hey,
some news from Fisher Aquamanta
just a photo, taken 15 days ago at EL PASO
under a blazing sun ..





a pre-series / to put the production line in place
has been realized

a second will follow for reliability tests and beta testers

no release date or price / sorry

just one last thing
all those who saw the first machines
had never seen a detector so powerful and so sensitive on gold

we obtained a perfect and homogeneous result
I tested 10 detectors
all took the ring from 2.5 gr / 18k to over 15 inch in the air
(should approach 20 inches in compact, wet sand / following mineralization)
= 2.5 gr = 18k !!!!

and the same ring among the iron nail
with a perfect sound on gold and a total cut of the iron (coil 12.5)

the machine is fully operational
now the ball is in the camp of the factory in EL PASO

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Detector used : Fisher Aquamanta /

Pulsepower Goldscan 5c / Aquastar / Goldquest SSV3 / Nexus Coronado / Vista Gold

COME ON 2020!!!

Thank you for the update
The dream is coming true.
I hope it will come soon, Christmas 2018 will be perfect

I hope gold and silver prices go up so I can afford one when they are available.

Past(or)Tom
Using a Legend, a Deus 2, an Equinox 800, a Tarsacci MDT 8000, & a few others...
with my beloved, fading Corgi, Sadie

PLEASE put a decent pair of dang headphones on it. Im really getting tired of having to make them for every water machine i have. Dont do us like ML did....... great machine and crappy water headphones..... now does that make sense?

With all the Red Tide around here running people off the beach..... its like winter hunting. No recent drops and no moving sand....... so we need this PI. Oh.... please have enough for us to actually buy one instead of waiting for months.

Hard to see the headphone connection when bo th the control box and the coil are invisible in the picture.

Pre-production hardware- best not to lock in too many expectations about exactly how it wil look.

but the BIG news is that it’s real. It’s coming...but not before it’s ready.

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold

lytle78 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hard to see the headphone connection when bo th th
> e control box and the coil are invisible in the pi
> cture.
>
> Pre-production hardware- best not to lock in too m
> any expectations about exactly how it wil look.
>
> but the BIG news is that it’s real. It’s coming..
> .but not before it’s ready.

no Rick,
this is the final version we have assembled
new coil / new fixation
new cane
new box circuit / new battery box
and headphone and battery connection

= everything is ready

just some sticker problem, a detail, so no photo ....

and the result is even better than on the prototypes

I still see Tom, pass the gold ring among the nails
wondering if there was a sleight of hand

abracadabra, I am a magician

I'm glad to see that FTP was able to at least acquire a new an innovative detecting platform. Bit of a shame they were unable to develop one on their own considering how long it's been since they released the F75....but the Manta should be a game changer for water hunters and those relic hunters back east with that Culpeper red dirt to deal with.

At the ghost towns and stage stops I detect, I couldn't really imagine using a PI machine, I'd never move.

I’m pretty sure the engineering staff in El Paso has been doing stuff to justify their paychecks. As far as new products out the door, time will tell. I have followed Apple pretty closely over the last years. Folks who know about their development cycle say that they are now working on what they will hope to release in five years time. That the technology and design objectives are clear that far out. Why 5 years - because that’s how long the most valuable company in the world with many hundreds of top engineers take to move from “this is what it will do and how it will do it” to - here’s the shipping date for the nw product.

Pity the poor MD makers. A few key designers, a dozen (if they are really lucky) good engineers and trying to move a very mature technology ahead against the iron bars of the cage of soil complexity, target diversity and the basic facts of physics regarding transmitting and receiving, then analyzing relative weak signals to react with often tiny targets in the ever changing soil matrix.

Rocket science is in some ways easier. I know, I worked with some really smart “rocket scientist” engineers in my days at Honeywell.

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold

How much does this rascal weigh???

And is Manta going to be the official name of unit?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/07/2018 03:23AM by tnsharpshooter.