The Perfect Detector - "will we ever see it?"

Will we ever get the perfect detector.

As technology increases people want more in their detectors.
Now this isn’t a bad thing but, just what are the things we might like and will everybody agree on them? Probably not.

First, there’s how it looks. Yes folks, we are driven by appearance.
Then, there’s weight followed by ergonomics, features, how it sounds, does it have a meter and does it work well, does it have one or more ‘new innovative features? What color is it?’ Preferably black. We don’t want them too shiny...non-reflective so we can skulk in the shadows without advertising our presence!

We can track the progress of the metal detector quite easily thru the years and it is easy enough to judge if a new model is substantially better than what went before? For many, they are unhappy with their present detector, expect a lot from it that the Manufacturer ‘s advertising promised and yet, we remain unhappy about it and want to move very quickly on to whatever promises to be ‘the next big thing!’

People want a detector that suits them as an individual - hence that is why no one detector model will suit everyone. We are all different.

Things progress. What seemed important last year doesn’t appear so important now!

What has changed in the last few years, and I am referring to just two or three years, manufacturer’s appear to be listening to us and try to address our needs.
Case in point, the “Nokta/Makro” company. Unheard of a few years ago they actually “speak to us” on our beloved Internet detector forums!
They listen: they respond: they make changes: they produce what we have asked for.
And you know what? Other companies are beginning to do the same?
Does that mean that we will get our perfect detector soon? Probably not.

But this is a tough act as some manufacturers see gaps in the market and try to push out equipment that just isn’t what we really want.
The performance might be poor on mineralised soils or over salt? The meter might be missing ‘vital’ information. The battery requirements might be old technology and the list goes on and on.
Sometimes features might be added just to differentiate from a rival product and these might come up short too?

Rapid changes in electronics and design innovation in detectors don’t go hand in hand and although the technology is there the innovations are not. If a development in technology comes about just as a detector has been launched, it can take more than a year and longer for them to re-release that model or bring out a new model entirely that addresses those shortcomings. If a new product is brought out then that takes considerably longer.
This, is what frustrates us the most!
Nokta and Makro have actually tried to minimise those frustrations and have delivered many new machines in double quick time. They appear to have just done it again as another new one has made an appearance on YouTube.

Speaking of YouTube: there are many people willing to stand up, make videos and provide suggestions to the watching manufacturers! Yes folks, they ARE watching!
But, for a manufacturer it can sometimes be difficult to differentiate ‘the wheat from the chaff’ here but highlighting a problem can be of benefit to the design teams.
Sometimes, this can come too late in the process and the product has gone out before the feedback was considered.
But, here too there’s a ‘silver lining’ because those shortcomings might be addressed in future software Updates?

What’s important to consider here is your choice of detector and what you intend to do with it 95% of the time. A wrong decision can be made from misleading advertising that will have you go off in the wrong direction and ‘imagining yourself’ in some situations that you will never be in! You'll want out of your current detector to quickly make way for 'this new miracle! You might even suffer a loss in value but that won't concern you...you just want to have the new one!
If you buy a detector that is waterproof, will you take it in the water? If you buy a detector with a Gold Mode, will you travel to the goldfields?
So, the detector you should have isn’t the one you should buy! Your ‘perfect detector’ might not be the detector that can deliver what’s required?

Will we ever get ‘the perfect detector?’

Good write up...

Nice piece Des.
The answer is No.

Just too many folks with too many different things they value more or less.

Divorce rates I think are high for owners and their detectors vs yesteryear.

This forum in a way is like a marriage counselor at times to some.

Knob job detectors are finished I think.

Tin can look is finished too.

Wireless headphones are in.

Symbols being used on menus, I think we’ll see more of. Helps with multi language users and keeps things simple.

BS treasure magazine articles giving phony kudos are out BIG time. Company makes a dud, Internet, you tube, detecting forums, Facebook will SMOKE out.

Good article again Des.

Some guys like blondes, brunettes, redheads etc. same goes for detectors so the answer is NO.....

No.

If the perfect detector for every need it would weigh 40 pounds, have 15 different circuit boards, 63 push-buttons, 3 separate displays and have an instruction manual filled with 425 pages of stuff that would take a Rhodes Scholar to decipher.
There are machines made now for just about every conceivable type of hunting. It can be narrowed down to maybe three detectors that will fill a persons needs and maybe three other detectors for the next guy. Micro electronics has yet to reach proper proportions of smallness to make a one size fits all detector.
Marvin

No---not now---not ever!

Perfect is a figment of ones imagination. HH jim tn

The perfect detector? That means all good targets found and no trash found. That means easy detecting and all reward. That means no work. That means everyone will have one and lazy people cash in. I HOPE NOT

I own 11 detectors and the perfect one is the one I have in my hand when I am hunting. No matter which one I am holding I am not going to have a bad day.

Of course not! It would take all the fun out of it!

Detector technology is NOT going to go-the-way of computers and cell-phones. Computers and cell-phones, as we all know, have increased in LIGHT-YEARS of advancements, for each decade. Heck, the cell-phones and 'puters of 20 yrs. ago. were dinosaurs, compared to what we carry around today.

But when you think of it, all those advancements were only a function of smaller & faster. And metal detectors are having to deal with a harsh reality: The laws of physics. There is only so much information you can glean from the signal being beamed into solid ground, and the information received back. No amount of "faster and smaller" is going to change that recipe

Hence notice that the evolution that occurred in the 1960s to 1970s to 1980s, etc.... In those years: If you had a machine that was a mere 5 yrs. old, you had a dinosaur ! But now ...... machines that are 10 or 20 yrs. old, can be just as competitive as whatever's being sold now.

So I fear we have hit the point of diminishing returns. Unless someone invents something completely new and different. But to simply add new whistles and bells (ie.: faster and smaller) is not going to cut it.

Tom.

You ain’t as dumb as I look.

Folks don’t realize that 10,000 of the worlds best electronic and computer engineers can move the ball in cell phones, etc. faster down field than a couple of tens of talent engineers working on metal detector can on the detecting front. Adding to that, you have pointed out that the physics of unscrambling multiplex returns from signal sent into the ground by wimpy transmitters and turning it into intelligence on coins, jewelry, relics, etc. is hugely tough.

Hell, thousands of poor folks across the globe loose limbs or their lives annually because of land mines and UX stuff. All the money military and humanitarian organizations have spent on electronic deming equipment still can’t always find that one metal part - the firing pin - in a land mine and save a mom’s or kid’s leg or life in some former frontline on the great pro/anti comminust wars of the late 20th century.

It ain’t easy folks. Any capable EE can make $100k/year plus working on defense stuff - many times that in truly hi-tech.

We should be amazingly thankful that a few folks - spread around the world - are still fascinated by discovering the unknown in the earth.

I salute them all!!!!

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/22/2018 08:16AM by lytle78.

Tom_in_CA Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Detector technology is NOT going to go-the-way of
> computers and cell-phones. Computers and cell-ph
> ones, as we all know, have increased in LIGHT-YEAR
> S of advancements, for each decade. Heck, the cel
> l-phones and 'puters of 20 yrs. ago. were dinosaur
> s, compared to what we carry around today.
>
> But when you think of it, all those advancements w
> ere only a function of smaller & faster. And met
> al detectors are having to deal with a harsh reali
> ty: The laws of physics. There is only so much i
> nformation you can glean from the signal being bea
> med into solid ground, and the information receive
> d back. No amount of "faster and smaller" is goin
> g to change that recipe
>
> Hence notice that the evolution that occurred in t
> he 1960s to 1970s to 1980s, etc.... In those yea
> rs: If you had a machine that was a mere 5 yrs. o
> ld, you had a dinosaur ! But now ...... machines
> that are 10 or 20 yrs. old, can be just as competi
> tive as whatever's being sold now.
>
> So I fear we have hit the point of diminishing ret
> urns. Unless someone invents something completel
> y new and different. But to simply add new whistl
> es and bells (ie.: faster and smaller) is not goin
> g to cut it.


I ain’t buying what you say about the older machine competing with the newer.
Sorry.
I have proof to support (eye witness).

Your statement could indeed mean Minelab engineers have been knitting vs engineering. And playing us like fools. NOT TRUE !!!
And if Mr Dankowski could talk about certain things, I think he will concur with me.

The Cobra Man might just show you in one of your sites. While using his you know what.



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 08/22/2018 02:54AM by tnsharpshooter.

tnsharpshooter Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

>
> The Cobra Man might just show you in one of your s
> ites. While using his you know what.

I'm using the now ~20 yr. old Minelab Explorer . This fall, Cal-Cobra and I will get out and compare some flagged signals @ some of our ghost-townsy sites. Am looking forward to it.

Des ...... its human nature not to be satisfied. Its in our DNA to build a better mouse trap.... especially if someone says it cant be done. For me i like having a multi use machine..... its not the best at anything...... but i dont fork out money for 4 or 5 other machines. Others arent satisfied....... they want just one machine ..... one perfect machine for their style of hunting. Well i want one of those also. Time, economics and passion.

That's what I keep tryin to tell you guys.-----Get the one(s) I got and you got the puuurfect detector!!!!-----Well, maybe not all at once--nah--not all at once---but mix 'em together & "look out Nellie"!!-----Aint'cha glad they make a bunch of 'em!----I'm havin fits (impossible) getting it all in one package though--nah--that ain't never gonna happen!

Thanks for your thoughts people!

Here is a List of what would be my 'near perfect' machines:

1. E Trac - but too heavy
2. X-Terra's 505 & 705 - just brilliant but not very deep-seeking.
3. The very first original Tesoro Silver Sabre - way ahead of it's time.
4. Fisher F 75 - flimsy build but staggering performance.
5. Teknetics T2 - better build than the F75, great performance but rarely got it above Sens 75 due to it being receptive to EMI

Des D

Quote
Des
2. X-Terra's 505 & 705 - just brilliant but not very deep-seeking

Just as deep as the F75 in my ground. Mars coils unlock the true potential of the 705. I agree with Craig (detectingmo) that the ML stock coils only cripple the ability of the 705.

Quote
Des
5. Teknetics T2 - better build than the F75, great performance but rarely got it above Sens 75 due to it being receptive to EMI

T2 Classic is much improved in both EMI resistance and improved audio intelligibility in iron and now there is the + model.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/22/2018 12:19PM by Jackpine.

THANKS for ruining my day/week/month/year----I thought all the hype: 300 years of testing/200years of field time Proved that we do indeed have the PERFECT detector, if this is Not true: "Emma,I'm come'in to meet you--this is the big one". Fred Sanford

I think that was Elizabeth .... liked ole Fred.

Learning curve and heavy.... but I still like an explorer. The ole 2s had that hot 10" coil

dewcon4414 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I think that was Elizabeth .... liked ole Fred.
>
> Learning curve and heavy.... but I still like an e
> xplorer. The ole 2s had that hot 10" coil


"Sanford & Son"-----A T.V. series of epic proportions!!!----Got "a scream" out of it.-----Yeah, it was Elizabeth (not Emma).-----What happened to all the good T.V. shows???-------------Oh yeah, the perfect detector---well, let's see now...…….



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/22/2018 04:48PM by D&P-OR.

Perfect Detector

Not in any particular order:

1. 1882 Silver dollar CZ-5

2. 1859 Seated Half B Coinstrike

3. Heavy 20K Band B ID Edge

4. Best gold day wading Oops forgot that one

5. Best Platinum G2

Most 1800's coins overall Bam! 1236-X2

Most fresh water gold found Ditto the 1236

It's the one you use!

Nox 5/21 thru 8/20/18 6 silver 5 gold



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 08/22/2018 08:02PM by Jackpine.

I don't think knob detectors are dead at all, I love my gpx4500 with switches and knobs, as well as my mxt pro, great machines. I think knobs and switches could be integrated into more new tech software driven machines and setup would be far easier.

If we were to believe what advertisers promote....yes a perfect metal detector Does exist. Guess what, our brand happens to produce it and you must have one. Its the only Swiss-army-like metal detector that will replace your entire arsenal ........at least until our next new model.....LOL. Its fun to look at old Treasure magazines and read the past hype. Time repeats itself...hype comes and goes. Some rookies actually succeed. Location is the key to success....research and more research. Whatever metal detector you click with....enjoy....you found your perfection. No worries, have fun.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/23/2018 01:40AM by Arkansas.

this is correct!..LEARN your detector!..know it well...
as in real estate,..location..location..location,and research,research,research.
there it is right in front of you!.your "perfect" detector!

(h.h.!)
j.t.

the state of the art always moves forward depending on other factors so never say never ,esp with AI kicking in in the future who knows what will appear..otherwise we would all still be watching valve TVs

MXT SNIPER Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I don't think knob detectors are dead at all, I lo
> ve my gpx4500 with switches and knobs, as well as
> my mxt pro, great machines. I think knobs and swit
> ches could be integrated into more new tech softwa
> re driven machines and setup would be far easier.

I agree, rotary knobs are 100% variable where as push pads have preset stages where every push of the pad moves it by a set distance which is totally useless if the perfect setting comes between two pushes of the pad where as rotary controls can be set with pin point accuracy and Rotary Controls have a much smaller failure rate that push pads.

auminesweeper Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> MXT SNIPER Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I don't think knob detectors are dead at all, I
> lo
> > ve my gpx4500 with switches and knobs, as well a
> s
> > my mxt pro, great machines. I think knobs and sw
> it
> > ches could be integrated into more new tech soft
> wa
> > re driven machines and setup would be far easier
> .
>
> I agree, rotary knobs are 100% variable where as p
> ush pads have preset stages where every push of th
> e pad moves it by a set distance which is totally
> useless if the perfect setting comes between two p
> ushes of the pad where as rotary controls can be s
> et with pin point accuracy and Rotary Controls hav
> e a much smaller failure rate that push pads.


Now John---that's just HOGWASH!!!-----Well, maybe not ALL hogwash---but ur jest tryin to hurt my little ole E800's feelins!!!!

D&P-OR Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> auminesweeper Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > MXT SNIPER Wrote:
> > ------------------------------------------------
> --
> > -----
> > > I don't think knob detectors are dead at all,
> I
> > lo
> > > ve my gpx4500 with switches and knobs, as well
> a
> > s
> > > my mxt pro, great machines. I think knobs and
> sw
> > it
> > > ches could be integrated into more new tech so
> ft
> > wa
> > > re driven machines and setup would be far easi
> er
> > .
> >
> > I agree, rotary knobs are 100% variable where as
> p
> > ush pads have preset stages where every push of
> th
> > e pad moves it by a set distance which is totall
> y
> > useless if the perfect setting comes between two
> p
> > ushes of the pad where as rotary controls can be
> s
> > et with pin point accuracy and Rotary Controls h
> av
> > e a much smaller failure rate that push pads.
>
>
> Now John---that's just HOGWASH!!!-----Well, maybe
> not ALL hogwash---but ur jest tryin to hurt my lit
> tle ole E800's feelins!!!!

There is nothing wrong with folks liking push pads either, I just prefer the finer adjustments of Rotary Controls, I was just wondering the same thing about Tyre Gauges but there really is nothing to compare,

Crazy part is some of the finest detectors ever made never had screens, But regarding the rotary controls, take a look at the Whites MX-S with it's preset SAT speed step of 6 then 8 with no in between settings , but Some of their other machines the SAT goes from 0 to 10 which is 100% variable giving 100+/- settings, trying to match the SAT to suit the Ground is a tad more accurate than those 8 pre set steps, To me that seems like they are wanting us to adopt a near enough is good enough type of attitude, accepting second best, So how would it be if they done away with tone ID and variable discrimination,

Now For the Serious Part.

I don't like how they are cutting corners when it comes to the design and function of most things, I will not be told by a detector company that something is good enough, We saw how that worked out 2 years ago and it wasn't pretty. And to some degree a few machines have not lived up to the pre production Hype,

After the last time I don't trust them, I don't believe them, And I have been Lied to by them And I won't be handing over any of my money Until I see proof, There was once a time when they would work hard to make sure their detectors were perfect before they hit the stores But now their near enough is good enough attitude is hurting the Hobby, I don't see why I should have to buy a Detector and then send it in to get it fixed so I can use it, not just once but 4 or 5 times, You would not see Rolex or Omega or Bentley or Rolls Royce release a product and have their customers do the QC work involved So why should we have to do it.

This Hobby Died 2 and a half years Ago when we allowed them to take the piss, I Will not hand over 1cent until they get things back on track, In fact I have spent money on every other thing I can think of but since that day I have not spent 1 cent on detecting in 2 and a half years, In fact I am So P'd off with them that I have given away all but 2 or 3 detectors,

As far as I am concerned there are better things to waste money on than detectors that don't work and if they want the public to do their QC testing then they better start paying wages.

RANT OVER, lol