ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000

Cal_cobra Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Badger in NH Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I have to laugh at some of the advice that has b
> een given on this thread from people who don't own
> an MDT and think it is just another metal detector
> .
> > Many don't understand that it is a completely di
> fferent technology than PI or VLF and different ru
> les apply to its operation.
>
>
> If that was directed at me, I completely understan
> d what the MDT is all about.


No, I was agreeing with Daniel where he said people think they know everything. It wasn't directed at anyone in particular.

There were a few posts a while back from people who showed up late to the thread and tried to offer advice on how to run the machine.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 04/15/2020 09:00PM by Badger in NH.

Coilpower……… FINALLY!
FINALLY, FINALLY, FINALLY!!!!
All of Wally's work/efforts has paid off! KUDO'S!

Teresa, we just simply hope to NOT chase you off...…… because SO many people (with tons of diversity background) have very serious passion...…. for what ever flavor brand detector they may have; subsequently, strong opinion and strong heart. I 'try' to allow the full spectrum of: Freedom-of-Speech...… so as to 'allow' FIRE to breathe.

You are one of the very first purchasers of a Tarsacci……..and...…..you are in New Zealand whereby: we are anxiously waiting to hear about your dirt...… and what local industry(s) use your dirt for! This is the biggest eye-opener..... that genuinely sets-the-stage for what you contend with..... on a daily basis. It is YOU...……. that launches US...……… to engineer the incomprehensible!!!
WELCOME! Welcome to the 'family'. Welcome BACK to the family!

Hello Teresa!!

Finally on!GREAT!!!

I'll start in the basement and work up teeter tottering as I go.THANK YOU!

Aaron nice vid's for sure!!

Keith

“I don't care that they stole my idea . . I care that they don't have any of their own”
-Nikola Tesla

sanjuro Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Aaron Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > There seems to be a lot of confusion regarding h
> ow
> > to do a proper ground and salinity balance. This
> s
> > hort video should clear up the confusion. Also n
> ot
> > e how the very unique Salinity Balance feature i
> s
> > used to actually eliminate nasty items such coke
> r
> > ocks.
> >
> >
> > [m.youtube.com]
>
> Thanks for the video can you do the test again wit
> h wet coke please

Here you go Sir!

[youtu.be]

TARSACCI - “Digging deeper, BEHIND the competition!”
[forums.tarsaccisales.com]

Aaron Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> sanjuro Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Aaron Wrote:
> > ------------------------------------------------
> --
> > -----
> > > There seems to be a lot of confusion regarding
> h
> > ow
> > > to do a proper ground and salinity balance. Th
> is
> > s
> > > hort video should clear up the confusion. Also
> n
> > ot
> > > e how the very unique Salinity Balance feature
> i
> > s
> > > used to actually eliminate nasty items such co
> ke
> > r
> > > ocks.
> > >
> > >
> > > [m.youtube.com]
> >
> > Thanks for the video can you do the test again w
> it
> > h wet coke please
>
> Here you go Sir!
>
> [youtu.be]

Thank you for that test Aaron although i would have liked the coke to have been soaked over night (should have said that to you sorry) as almost all of the coke we dig up in the UK is wet so it is important to know that the MDT does not pick up wet coke, the MDT is an expensive purchase for UK detectorists with the 20% VAT on top so making sure its going to suit my needs is a must.

Aaron, I seem to recall Nasa Tom confirming a few weeks back that it is not necessary to highlight the Ground Balance box before doing the auto Ground Balance procedure. All you need to do is push the GB button.

I tried to find the post about it but the forum search feature isn't working.

If you replay the video, you will see that you accidentally highlighted the Threshold box when you Ground Balanced which did not affect the balancing.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 04/15/2020 11:09PM by Badger in NH.

Hey Badger, yeah I’m still in the habit of doing that, old habits hard to break! Hey what’s the story behind those 2 GW buttons? Any pics?
Thanks

TARSACCI - “Digging deeper, BEHIND the competition!”
[forums.tarsaccisales.com]

Badger in NH Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Cal_cobra Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Badger in NH Wrote:
> > ------------------------------------------------
> --
> > -----
> > > I have to laugh at some of the advice that has
> b
> > een given on this thread from people who don't o
> wn
> > an MDT and think it is just another metal detect
> or
> > .
> > > Many don't understand that it is a completely
> di
> > fferent technology than PI or VLF and different
> ru
> > les apply to its operation.
> >
> >
> > If that was directed at me, I completely underst
> an
> > d what the MDT is all about.
>
>
> No, I was agreeing with Daniel where he said peopl
> e think they know everything. It wasn't directed a
> t anyone in particular.
>
> There were a few posts a while back from people wh
> o showed up late to the thread and tried to offer
> advice on how to run the machine.


Gotcha ya, that makes sense.

I've been following this detector from the beginning, was one of the first on the list to order one, but ultimately decided at the time that I wasn't really a beach hunter so I decided to let someone else who is a beach hunter have my machine. Now that I've followed this through what, 69 pages of posts, it's looking like it could also be one heck of a relic detector as well

Aaron Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
Hey what’s the story behind those 2 GW buttons? Any pics?

> Thanks

Not much of a story to tell. I dug them about ten years ago in a local farm field. They are both the same type but one is in better condition than the other.

Pics here, the top two are mine. - [www.nhmetaldetectingforum.com]

I know people who have dug over a dozen GW's.



Edited 5 time(s). Last edit at 04/16/2020 01:39AM by Badger in NH.

Here's a short video I did on a piece of red chalk local dirt.

Its light weight but rusty looking.Its all over my area.

Video shows the Tarsacci punching through it .

[www.youtube.com]


Keith

“I don't care that they stole my idea . . I care that they don't have any of their own”
-Nikola Tesla

Great demo Keith!
Gotta love the PUNCH on the 8000!
Wish I had chunks of nasty minerals like that to test with up here.
I like your SAFARI, I should have gotten one of those instead of that CTX, would’ve saved me a lot of money!

TARSACCI - “Digging deeper, BEHIND the competition!”
[forums.tarsaccisales.com]

Keith,

That's probably the most definitive...… clearest video.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,.,. for a comparison AND demonstration....of two different technologies.

(And that clump of dirt.....is probably fairly representative of Georgia, Kentucky, Tennessee soil).

Great video again Keith!. Now, before I lose all this, request was for....

BLACK IRON SAND

Formed 2.5 million years ago from volcanic activity in the Taranaki region of NZ, our black iron sands are predominantly Iron and magnetite, with small amounts of titanium, manganese, vanadium, calcium, silica and aluminium oxides which are swept up the coast as far as North Cape -a distance of about 400km –and beyond...... getting ground into finer and rounder grains as it travels. Wave energy is high to extreme and with prevailing wiinds it winnows out the less dense and lighter coloured quartz and feldspar sands, leaving behind the denser black iron sand.

In 1969, Glenbrook Steel Mill was the first smelter in the world to produce steel from these titanomagnetic sands and in 2010 ironsand and coal were being used to produce about 650,000 tonnes of steel a year, exporting to Australia, Japan and China. These iron sands provided raw material of relatively low grade, containing 58–60% iron by weight after they had been concentrated, then processed by the smelter. So......seriously black iron sand known to cause 3rd degree barefoot burns on a very hot day!

The West Coast beach profile varies from maximum concentration of approximently 58% titanomagnetic iron sand at top end to perhaps absolute minimum 40% to minimum can be attributed to natural erosion of coastal land, rock and shell sediment and also I have found weather conditions will vary this concentration of iron sand. Bands of varying iron concentrate may also be dispersed throughout the beach profile hence I run TRACK ON, which only affects GB, NOT depth.

ONLY a PI unit can handle these black sands, (and they too are limited) Most have given up detecting them. I gave up with a Tesoro Sandshark and sold it, my experienced hunting buddy couldnt get his GPX5000 to stabilise with either of his coils and my other buddy with a Sea Hunter Mk2 couldnt get the depth or targets I get. The Tarsacci....whilst not the Holy Grail...YET....out performed the others with the NZ coil which coped far better than the standard coil could. Not perfect but doable. Dont get me wrong....those detectors mentioned are VERY GOOD.

NZ East Coast beaches are more of a quartz composition along with a base of shell and rock sediments. Volcanic Hot Rocks are also encountered along with mud silt from land erosion and river deposition.The iron % content is also lower, but is intermingled with mud etc. The waves are also of a far lower energy than the west coast.
To date I have been impressed with being able to run the Tarsacci MDT 8000 with success (finding rings, jewellery etc and trash) under a variety of West and East Coast weather/beach conditions without a cacaphony of sounds through the headphones BUT you MUST get your GB and SALT balanced to run silent.

Sorry guys if post a bit long.

Teresa,

Your report is the most profound report.....to date. This is exactly the data I was looking for. In the US..... our (orange/red) dirt can be heavy iron oxide. In NZ.... your dirt is IRON. When the steel industries use your dirt to make iron products.... that makes a profound statement. Everything you said exemplifies (and validates) DanielTN statements, reports and encounterings. In your dirt...… I can see where proper Ground Balance becomes crucial. . . . . . . and rightfully so.
And...…. in your dirt/conditions...… the Tarsacci is performing better than a GPX...….. is yet; another profound discovery/statement. Bottom line is: Not much should ever trump the GPX series.
All of the videos/data that Keith has shared...…… clarifies these discoveries. I am trying to remain (mostly) reserved about these discoveries (and the Tarsacci performance)...……..as...…….I am wanting the public to 'discover' the Tarsacci.
Dimitar & I had lengthy talks about a $8000.00 price-tag for the Tarsacci. This was the original price/target. After heavy deliberations...…. we set the price at $1539.00...…..,,,,,,,,,,, knowing Dimitar may never recoup his 18-years of "blood" and financial outlay; yet, our target was to get the Tarsacci OUT...….. and 'make a name'.

Mission accomplished.

I tried the Tarsacci in some thick iron this morning hoping to see some magic happen. It's a colonial cellar hole that I found last week. The surrounding area is pretty devoid of targets so I wasn't the first to find it even though there was no visible evidence of it ever being detected. There is a 20' X 40' area that is loaded with iron. I thought it would be the perfect place to try the MDT because iron sites are never hunted out.

Keith's posts and videos made me optimistic that I would find targets to dig. I found a metal-free area to ground balance. After a few tries, it seemed to be happy around 720. Checking the site in all-metal confirmed the amount of iron in the ground. You could not swing the coil without hearing the machine gun with no spaces between the tones anywhere. I started in 18 kHz, Sense 7, Thresh 0, Disc 0, Salt and Black Sand off. I put it in Disc mode and it was surprisingly quiet. Just a few plinky tones here and there. I investigated every nice clear tone while walking around each target. Most of these would go silent when I turned 90 degrees to the target. That usually if not always means iron. I dug them just to be sure and that's what they were. Some of these tones would disappear once the target was out of the ground, further confirming that it was iron.

I dug a dozen or more of these iffy iron signals just to become familiar with them and to remove them from the site. Finally, I got a good clear repeatable tone that did not disappear as I walked around the target. It was obvious that this was not iron. It turned out to be a piece of melted lead about the size of a quarter.

I kept working the area listening for a good tone and investigating the 90-degree iron tones which I would dig now and then. I started playing with the settings. I tried raising and lowering the Sense. Salt and Black Sand modes didn't do anything. Didn't see any need to try Threshold or Disc. Tried the other frequencies ground balancing for each one. In 12 kHz I got another good 360-degree signal which turned out to be a nice little button. That was the best find of the day. All I found were those two targets. I worked the iron for over an hour, then searched away from the iron for a bit but found nothing more. Just for fun, I also tried ground balancing over the iron a few times but it didn't help.

So in conclusion, I didn't see anything from the Tarsacci that I would call amazing or magic. Next time I will go back with the Equinox and see if it can do any better.

The soil where I live is very clean and mineral-free. I'm thinking the magic that Kieth and others are experiencing has to do with their soil. It is probably the mineralization in the soil that is giving the MDT that performance edge. It's not the iron that the detector is seeing through but the minerals surrounding the iron. Take away the minerals and the performance may be nothing special. This is a theme that I've been noticing from the very beginning, both on the forum and the more I use it. The Tarsacci is superior in mineralization and salt but merely adequate at best in clean ground compared to other machines.



Edited 11 time(s). Last edit at 04/17/2020 08:44PM by Badger in NH.

Okay, here’s one more video testing the TARSACCI with coke rocks and the $1 gold coin. However, this time they had been soaked in water for 24hrs.
[youtu.be]

TARSACCI - “Digging deeper, BEHIND the competition!”
[forums.tarsaccisales.com]

Aaron Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Okay, here’s one more video testing the TARSACCI w
> ith coke rocks and the $1 gold coin. However, this
> time they had been soaked in water for 24hrs.
> [youtu.be]


Thanks Aaron really appreciate you taking time to do that test

Good report Bob.

Yes what I see in bad dirt and iron with Tarsacci is What I see in good dirt and iron with a VLF.


Can you saturate your coil with iron and get a say zinc penny..Like a large piece of iron fist sized and zinc penny.about 3 inches away.??

Keith

“I don't care that they stole my idea . . I care that they don't have any of their own”
-Nikola Tesla

That's a tough one Keith. My detectors hit on the horseshoe.

So I suppose I would dig the horseshoe and get the coin too lol.

Keith Southern Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Can you saturate your coil with iron and get a say
> zinc penny..Like a large piece of iron fist sized
> and zinc penny.about 3 inches away.??
>
> Keith


I have not been able to get my MDT to do that. Maybe there was too much iron in my lawn and I need to try it on a clean patch of pavement like you had in the video.

Does it have to be a zinc penny? Will the trick work just as well with silver and copper?



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 04/18/2020 05:22PM by Badger in NH.

(((Aaron...… in your latest video...…. I think your spade/shovel was still ...a bit too close to the coil. . . . . . altering end-resultant. And..... your 'just-feet-away' powerlines are playing havoc on everything you got!))).

Badger in NH Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Keith Southern Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Can you saturate your coil with iron and get a s
> ay
> > zinc penny..Like a large piece of iron fist size
> d
> > and zinc penny.about 3 inches away.??
> >
> > Keith
>
>
> I have not been able to get my MDT to do that. May
> be there was too much iron in my lawn and I need t
> o try it on a clean patch of pavement like you had
> in the video.
>
> Does it have to be a zinc penny? Will the trick w
> ork just as well with silver and copper?


Here's same piece of iron horseshoe with a small 14Kt gold ring.

[www.youtube.com]

Keith

“I don't care that they stole my idea . . I care that they don't have any of their own”
-Nikola Tesla

Keith...…… another VERY good video. Yes...… the amount of iron still under the coil.... is many, many times more mass...… than the low-conductor kids gold ring. And...…. you are in (about the strongest part) of the horseshoe ElectroMagnetic enveloped donut footprint...…. to boot!
What stood out the most in this particular video.... is...…… when you lowered the coil..... to the point of hitting/impacting the iron horseshoe with the coil..... and it still detected the small gold ring. . . . . . albeit....slightly more difficult. In terms of physics...… this is phenomenal. And...….. the low conductor (tiny gold ring)..... only dropped slightly lower..... on the MDT VDI.

Teresa: Do you happen to remember what your Ground Balance number is...….. on your average (terrible) beach...….. AND...….. what your Ground Balance number is...….. on your average (terribly) mineralized dirt?
(((If you bump your GB numbers up/down ….by just a couple of points...… is the detector far out of Ground Balance)))?

Tom you ask me a curly question! Short answer.....I have had ground balance from high 400s to lowish 700s and everything in between in dirt. Beaches OVL with GB to high 700s. The unit GB is tolerant of a few points up/down. As long as the GB and SALT balance are right, the MDT runs quiet. Other settings used as required which is why I am rather loathe to give settings in a way as this unit is "site particular" as far as GB etc goes. Teresa.

I did the MDT horseshoe test on some pavement this time and it worked just as it did in Keith's video. There must have been too much iron in my lawn when I tried it there the other times. I was beginning to think there might be something wrong with my machine.

I used a zinc penny, then tried a Barber Dime. The Tarsacci easily picked up the coin only two inches from the horseshoe as long as the coil was very low over the target. The test can also be done with an ox shoe.

So I thought, what the heck, I'll try the Equinox. To my surprise, the Equinox set at Recovery 8 performed just as well as the Tarsacci. It also picked up the coin at Recovery 6 and 7 but it sounded best at 8.

Now we have two detectors that can pass this test.



Edited 8 time(s). Last edit at 04/19/2020 04:22PM by Badger in NH.

Do you have a video of that?

TARSACCI - “Digging deeper, BEHIND the competition!”
[forums.tarsaccisales.com]

Aaron Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Do you have a video of that?

The video's I want to see are head to head with gold rings on a stick. NOX VS 8000. Saltwater beach! I get to pick the NOX settings!

Thanks Dave

midalake Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Aaron Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Do you have a video of that?
>
> The video's I want to see are head to head with go
> ld rings on a stick. NOX VS 8000. Saltwater beach
> ! I get to pick the NOX settings!
>
> Thanks Dave


I would like to see that too. The Tarsacci will beat the Nox by at least two inches.

Badger in NH Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> midalake Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Aaron Wrote:
> > ------------------------------------------------
> --
> > -----
> > > Do you have a video of that?
> >
> > The video's I want to see are head to head with
> go
> > ld rings on a stick. NOX VS 8000. Saltwater bea
> ch
> > ! I get to pick the NOX settings!
> >
> > Thanks Dave
>
>
> I would like to see that too. The Tarsacci will b
> eat the Nox by at least two inches.

Ya well??????
You think all of these people pumping the 8000 would of already done this? Rather showing me a video of a nickle on a stick where you can pick a specific frequency on the 8000 that hears it better.

In fact the only video on gold is the nice man from France. He states the 8000 loses in a head to head. So there is that.

Thanks Dave

We need to give Carter at Detector Comparisons an MDT. He makes great videos.