TDI Beach Hunter

My need for a pulse machine just can't be shaken. I was sorta gonna wait on the Fisher beach machine...Manta or whatever the new name might be for it. But who knows when it might be available. So I had been keeping an eye out on things. I haven't saw hardly anything posted on the waterproof TDI so I decided to bite the bullet and get one. I ordered it Monday morning and it came this afternoon...Tuesday. That was some fast shipping!

So now I have officially owned all of the TDI models.

The water is already too cold now for just swim trunks and t-shirt. Time to break the wet suit out. One little problem there...I've gained about 15 pounds since I was last in it and it fit tight then.

The Nox has a pulse companion now.

20181023_183143 by Daniel Teague, on Flickr



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/24/2018 12:26AM by Daniel Tn.

Nice! Good luck with it.

I was wondering how this new detector would perform. I look forward to the reports. After the Tesoro news I really would love to see Whites have a great detector in their line up. I grew up on their detectors.

Goodmore -- So far I really like it. I was half worried that they just threw this thing in a Beach Hunter ID box but it does seem like a quality build.

The weakest link for me in these wired in detectors, have always been the standard headphones that come with them. This does not seem to be the case on this unit. I like the fit and sound of these very well. I would say the closest I have used to compare them to would be Harold's headphones that he makes for the CTX 3030 if you have ever used those.

My testing thus far shows this particular unit to excel past a stock TDI SL in depth/target detecting distance. I would actually say it is very close to a regular big box TDI...which makes me very curious as to what it might do with an aftermarket lithium battery pack. I know several people that went to those for the SL and were able to get great battery life and performance out of the SL...but I can't seem to find those packs for sale any more. In researching this, I found a post by the Whites guy that use to post here, in which he said the performance jump and stability was a by product of the coil being hard wired in. I'm not sure as to the why but I can tell you it is really close to a big box TDI, and this is just running the AA battery pack in it.

The only minor things I do not like thus far are as follows:

1. I'm not a fan of the 12 inch dual field coil. I read where Whites may be offering this machine with the ability to send in and swap coils. If that be the case, I will have them put an aftermarket Miner John mono coil on it and that would take care of that for me.

2. This may actually be on my end and not the detector itself. The detector has a volume control but the headphones do not. Where I ran into an issue was with the tone volume. The machine gives a low tone for high conductors and a high tone for low conductors. I know...it's inverted from what we are used to with regular VLF machines. Anyway...when I set the machine volume to be comfortable to hear the high tones....I can barely hear the low ones. If I set it to comfortably hear the low tones...then the high tones about deafen me. This could simply be a issue with my hearing....but it's almost as if they designed it that way since it is a beach hunting machine, to be able to hear the low conductive tones clearly and focus on those.

Cool!!

Is there a switch inside to shut off the other tone like on regular TDI's??

you could probably add a inline water-poof connector and swap coils...this would be good for three coils..[www.ebay.com]


sounds good on the extra power over TDI SL Daniel!

Keith

“I don't care that they stole my idea . . I care that they don't have any of their own”
-Nikola Tesla

Keith,

This one is locked into what would be the ALL position on the other TDI models. I kinda wish it did have the switch, as that was handy some times.

I have tested most of my rings and things on it and some common beach trash items. One item that immediately stuck out to me was the crown style bottle caps. Those jokers give a lovely high tone just like rings, nickels, etc; there's gonna be a bunch of those dug with it. I was sorta hoping they would give a different tone but nope. I wonder what the Fisher pulse machine does on them? This is mostly going to be my relic machine for bad soil though...don't really run into those crown caps doing that. If I ever go back to a Diggin in VA hunt...it always seems to rain at least one day of the hunt, so no worries about rain now.

I never liked the big DF coil either. Lot of coil flip if you didnt add a control device on the coil that whites makes......or i almost had to step on it out there to get it back in place since the connector is so far back. Advantage was PPing. Harold made some good phones...... very much like the pro golds using audiosear speakers. You can add volume controls to the phones with multi tones thou it can change the tones a bit......... but with dual tones i dont see it doing that. Been awhile since i used a DF...... but didnt it have a volume adjustment INSIDE the box? Does the TDI?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/24/2018 10:07AM by dewcon4414.

Those steel caps off beer bottles, etc. are a serious PITA. They have pretty complex metallurgy apparently, with alloys to the base material and plating to resist corrosion. My Nox has its issues with them - just loves them.

No PI detector has the kind of phase shift based conductivity discrimination that all modern VLF IB detectors offfer.

Eric Foster in England came up with a kind of Iron ID which uses more than one channel of sampling of the target response and in the “time domain” can distinguish between targets with longer persisting returns from those with quick decaying returns. For convenience, we refer to these as high and low conductiors. In fact, the response depends on the target’s conductivity as well as its mass (and maybe it’s size). This is the system used in the TDI series of detectors since they are basically an Eric Foster platform. On the TDI, the two channels provide ground balance over mineralized ground (often not necessary at the beach) and the same two channels provide the variable tone response to various targets.

Alexandre Tartar, the developer of the Manta, studied Eric F’s detectors for a decade or so and made steady progress in developing an advanced beach machine. The Manta also has more than one channel of time domain analysis. In the Manta however, no ground balance function for high mineralization is provided. Instead the channels are used to provide a variable iron ID function. This is not discrimination as we are used to it and is not capable of fine gradations of conductivity based separation of targets.

the Manta apparently has 3 controls which have an effect on iron ID. The first control is the All Metal, Mute, Multitone selector - All Metal is just what it says - one tone for all targets.The last two positions each provide a different form of ferrous ID. The other two controls are variable controls. These are the “iron cut” and SAT (self adjusting threshold). The “iron cut” (I don’t know what it is really called) sets the level of “conductivity” where iron is “cut” and the SAT “sharpens” the response.

I suspect that those pesky caps will need high settings of the iron cut and SAT in order to prevent those caps sounding like a low conductor, Even then, they are tough.

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 10/24/2018 02:14PM by lytle78.

Ahh ok Daniel..

Seems a maybe different coil is in order for crown caps..That folded eight on a TDI to me alway's seemed to warble or talk more on iron/tin trash.

Good luck with it...yeah get a higher volt battery if available yet??

Keith

“I don't care that they stole my idea . . I care that they don't have any of their own”
-Nikola Tesla

I'm curious if it's as deep in wet salt sand as the (pro)

Daniel get on that New Keto diet and You will be able to fit into that wetsuit in No time.
And stay outta' them Golden Corrals. Ha!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/24/2018 10:24PM by Harold,ILL..

Harold -- My wife went on that diet in December 2017. She is 72 pounds down now and counting.

Rob -- It seems really critical to have the GB control set perfect. The Pro and big box TDI were more forgiving for sure.

Yep I lost 15 pounds in 3 weeks. It works for sure.

I was diagnosed type 2 last Oct. I went on a low carb diet and started bike riding. Carbs put sugar in your blood and exercise takes it out. I have lost 85 pounds. Yeah I had plenty to lose. A1C is now low 90s with one pill a day. Sleep apnea is gone. Digestive issues are gone. No more antacids. I have invested the time into me the last year. Will it pay off? I hope so.

Yep carbs and sugar are the killer. For years people were told it was fat and cholesterol. Meat and greens with some fat is the way to go. And only drink water is what I been doing. My Bp has went from 150/95 to 110/70.

Any chance anybody has something to add about the TDI or any other beach machine?

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold

I discovered 24 hour ration packs from the British Army this year.
Don’t go all “weirdo” on me because this stuff is low cost ingredients, but very high quality preparation and packaging.

You can eat it cold or in a camping situation heat it up for some extra “moral” boost.
Easily digestible, gives you a real energy boost and contains just the wright amount of slow carbs to keep you going.
Exactly what a soldier needs during deployment.

Any kind of outdoor activity, such a digging umpteen holes while beach detecting.
I just throw a single meal, spork and water in my backpack and I’m a happy camper.

Carbs, alcohol and red meat turn us into a sorry excuse of ourselves.
But who doesn’t enjoy a few brewskis with a dinosoar leg on the BBQ now and again.

Especially after a hefty day of beach detecting.

HH
Johnb

Forget food--people are trying to learn something about pulse induction metal detectors here. Why do people do that? Maybe self involved?
cjc

cjc Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Forget food--people are trying to learn something
> about pulse induction metal detectors here. Why d
> o people do that? Maybe self involved?
> cjc

Don’t get me wrong, but for all the waffle I’ve read and all the youtube vids I’ve seen.
Only a few astute people actually let your hear the responses a Metal Detector makes.

Bought a Whites Dual Field Surf PI and it just beeped at a target.
And I expect you’ll get a high and low tone beep out of a TDI.
About as much target discription in that tone as totally useless.

What is the use debating PI holes, GB point, high and low tone when it just goes Beep at a target.
Has this god awfull 12” coil thats attached to the back so it tilts up and is a pain to keep nice and parallel to the sand.

Might as well talk about hotdogs, because thats the quality equivalent.

Whites please go visit a seasoned beach detectorist and simply ask what they like and want!

HH
Johnb

So - John b

“Whites please go visit a seasoned beach detectorist and simply ask what they like and want!”

How about you tell Whites (and us) what you like and want. Share a bit - your beach experience is worth it.

By the way, some folks long ago decided who has the best combat rations (it’s the French - not surprisingly) this was the consensus I remember from folks swapping rations during Desert Shield when they were all sitting around in KSA waiting for the start.

I’m no beach expert - not by a long shot, but I have used my Nox, a CZ and a DFPI and a TDI at the beach. Pretty much all of them went beep. Everything except iron was worth digging. The PI’s weren’t so good at avoiding the iron of course.

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold

Hey we can talk defecting all day long every day and you know what will happen? The same questions will be asked and answered tomorrow. Simply waiting for anyone that has a TDI water unit to chime in.

I was able to find a lithium battery pack from Reidman, and have that ordered. He only builds them after ordered so it might take a few extra days to get it. I've only heard good things about his battery builds. It will be interesting to see if the Beach Hunter TDI picks up any extra umph like people say the TDI SL does when paired up with a lithium pack. I will post that data in here once I receive it and give it a go.

My plans are to take the Beachhunter freshwater hunting tomorrow. The bathing suits have been traded in for long sleeve shirts and hoodies here, so I should have it all to myself. I still haven't attempted to see if I can fit into my wetsuit haha. If not, I have a really nice pair of chest waders which I may end up wearing anyway just to stay dry. It depends on if the restroom facilities are locked up for the season at the beach. From the looks of it, I think I must be one of the few on the forum here that has the Beach TDI...which I know some of you guys are anxious to see what it can do on a saltwater beach. I'm sorry to say but I am a good 7.5 hour trip from the nearest saltwater beach. I don't have any plans to go there until the first weekend of December, so that's still a ways off. My intention for this machine was mostly for hunting highly mineralized soil for Civil War relics, with the bonus of it being waterproof. I have the Nox for most of my hunting but there are just some areas a pulse machine is champion.

As for the veering off topic, some of you are WAAAYYY too serious. Lighten up a little. Smile. Life is short and nobody gets out alive; no sense in being uptight.

The problem is the Beep on a PI unit.

You buy a PI because you want to go deep or simply cut through the salt. Most people want deep because the other multi frequency units catch the surface targets.
Depth needs a stable non intrusive threshold and you need to be able to hear the ground so you can keep that coil under control.

The threshold needs to be an adjustable tone, because some days the beach is roaring, other days it is flat calm.
The target tone needs to be adjustable as well, to suit the operators hearing.

Tone profile, preferably VCO. Because you want to paint a picture of your target in your mind.
A PI discriminating iron or trying to discriminate iron may be the holy grail. But far more important is audio modulation.
As Cjc puts it SSS: Size, Shape, Signal

At the beach anything that hasn’t been eaten away by the salt inherently is a more or less precious metal. Stainless Steel watches included.

Beach hunters wear gloves,... so they like knobs and decent triggers. Triggers that can be pulled while wearing gloves.

And what does that trigger do, switch between All Metal and ID circuit. Or simply do away with the trigger and give us an MXT type audio.
ID superimposed above the treshold and All Metal circuit. Less mechanical engineering more electronic engineering.

Or they can use a stock coil, stock housing, straight stick and make it BEEP.

The Nox is a great unit for digging the small stuff and this is where a BEEP is needed to catch your attention.
Because it can pick up non ferrous half the size of a pinky nail clipping.
Wait till a few storms blow away all the surface foil on the dry ridge and go prospecting,... you’ll be amazed.

Don’t know about the French rations, the ones I’ve seen look like they’ve been assembled by Auchan supermarket.
Tend to have canned food in them. I’ll give them a try next time round :-)

HH
Johnb

Go get em Daniel!

HH
Johnb

Not uptight, not complaining, just focused - just reminding - and smiling.

I drove 6.5 hours last weekend to San Diego. Played with ny Nox in black sand striped beaches. It didn’t like them much. Nickel on the surface 10” or so of air and a nice 13 vdi. Buried in the black sand at 7-8” - that’s the deepest it would hit it - VDI 3.

Now a nickel is a pretty good target to simulate a gold ring.

Not so many smiles about the Nox on the SD sand, but lots of smiles for a terrific lunch at the “Old Boathouse” restaurant in Coronado.

Here’s a nice off topic link - French MRE’s. These became a “thing” in Saudi in Desert Shield. Big buzz about them. I think I remember guys on BFBS (British Forces Braodcasting System) FM radio - locally broadcast in KSA during Desert Shield/Storm - going on about them.

[m.youtube.com]

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold

P.S. John B.

Thanks for the thoughtful and informative post.

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold

Looks great. Just wish Whites would have went with the 9.5 donut zero buoy coil. What batteries does this take?? Keep us updated.

12" Dual Field coil on the TDI BH is excellent for both larger and small items detectable on beaches ......... like ear stud size.

I use the same battery pack in the TDI BH as I use on my Super Pulse (SPP)

8 x AA Ni-MH .............. 8 x AA Alkaline ............. 4 x 18650 Li-ion in a modified AA battery case ............. or 3 x 18650 Li-ion.




ivanll

Those Miner John or even Nugget Finder mono coils are far superior to the 12 inch dual field. If I had to pick just one coil to match it with, it would be the folded 8x12 Miner John mono. That would be the best all rounder coil for it. For open field relic hunting and raw depth on the beach...a 14 inch mono coil is about peak for a TDI platform. I have used larger ones on the big box TDI....even going to the 12x15, 16" round and 18" round mono...but saw no depth gain on coin size objects beyond the 14" round size. My favorite for relic hunting with a TDI big box was actually a Nuggetfinder brand 14" elliptical. But on the TDI Beach Hunter, that is neither here nor there since it is hardwired in.

December will be my beach trip...and actually, that trip is for going red fishing with my dad for his birthday. I will be in the Pensacola area for that. I of course will bring the detector cause I'm sure I can find time to venture off. I like beach hunting but not enough to drive 14-15 hrs round trip just for a few hours of doing it. Now, driving that same distance and time to hunt Civil War relics in VA at a good spot....yep, no problem.

Thanks Daniel on the coil info. I had both the original purple Surfmaster PI with the 9.5 coil and the Whites TDI SL with the dual field 12 coil. Really disliked that 12". One other question....is a mono coil and concentric the same. Prefer mono over DD when it comes to a Pulse machine. Thanks