Minelab Equinox owners - Question

Went back to the same spot I have been pounding for months using Beach 1. Pulled a lot of silvers and other old coins using Beach 1. This time I used Park 1, speed 3, bias 0, 50 tones, 25 sens. all metal and did a GB. Pulled 6 silvers and 11 wheats. It was like hunting this spot for the first time. It is truly amazing how changing your settings can make a difference in unmasking and hitting deeper good targets. Every coin sounded good and one of the silver dimes was 11 inch deep. Can't wait to try this program and settings in some of my other sites. Thanks Tom D. for explaining how to get the most out of the Equinox.

Andrew...…… Is your -8 and -9 chatter ONLY WHEN you sweep the coil on the ground? Or..... is this with the coil in the air.... (and is EMI)?

Yes..... you can Disc out -8 & -9...… but this does NOT alleviate the problem. It just merely shunts the audio. Case-in-point: If the -8 & -9 audio chatter (interference) is of 'medium' strength...… then..... the only thing(s) the detector will detect.....will be targets that present signal strength(s) that are STRONGER than the 'medium-strength' chatter. In other words..... only shallow/strong targets.
Yes..... you can also keep Volume on 25..... and place Iron Volume on ….. say...… '2'. BUT...… once again; this merely lowers the volume of the inhibiting (crippling) culprit.
Higher frequency modes...…. such as Field Mode-1 & 2...…. may be more susceptible to ground noises …. and/or ..... EMI.

--->>> Kind of off-subject: You ever detect a field where (unknowingly)….. there was a turkey-shoot.... maybe Decades ago?

Ground Balance is important! Yes, perform a AUTO Grnd Balance with the EQX. . . . . as..... AUTO Ground Balance is different than manual Ground Balance.,.,.,.,.,. even if the Auto or manual Grnd Bal number turns out the same.

McCJ2 = Your most recent resultant.... is going to be the 'norm' (((most of the time)))...… with your 'newest-discovery settings'. Especially in Medium/Mild/Low/No mineralization dirt. (((EQX is going to feel like magic....now. Like a new upgrade....or completely different unit now. Very different from BBS or FBS))).

Something I DO need to say about all of my newest-publicized settings: There really is not that much "critical coil speed" requirements. On a subconscious level; you will (unknowingly) adjust coil velocity accordingly..... to varying site conditions..... without even knowing you are doing it. If the site is real trashy..... you will automatically (and involuntarily) sweep the coil at a slower speed. Coil speed is intuitive/self-teaching. Not to worry!

The EQX's peak/pinnacle performance is in areas of Medium/Medium-High/High trash areas. (((Not: Severe trash areas))). Use EQX accordingly.

Tom-only when sweeping the coil do I get the -8 -9 chatter it's perfectly quiet when not in motion. So in reading the above am I to assume the sensitivity should be lowered to minimize the chatter. Before this thread I normally ran about 20-21 sensitive with little or no chatter from the ground. Although even with the chatter I believe the Equinox is performing better at higher sensitivity

I guess after reading through those posts again the obvious answer is to run in park 1 all the time since there is no chatter

Andrew: So it's not EMI...….. it's your dirt. What I DON'T know is...…. is it mineralization...….. or dirt that has tons of decomposed iron flecks/flakes in it. Can you find a clean area..... and perform a Grnd Balance?...…. And..... did this correct some/all of the feedback?
But...……… if you run Park Mode-1 for a while.,.,.,.,.,. you will then get a 'feel' for it..... and possibly/probably figure out what is causing your resultant.

Tom D. we've been detecting a fairly epic demo site, all I can say about it is it's early California history, lots of gold rush era influence, but potentially goes back to the Spanish era, and thus far a silver cob (unheard of in California), large cents, rare gold rush era belt buckles, a trime, 20 cent piece, dozens of seateds, 1800's foreign coins, large and small silver, antique gold jewelry,so on and so forth have been found.

EMI has been an issue for me using the Equinox at this site, so much so that the last time there I immediately switched from the 11" coil to the 6"and that settled it down quite a bit, but not perfect. This site's about as EMI ridden as they can get without getting completely shut down. I mainly detect in F2 mode, 50 tones, ground grab, I go slow and low, and the two times I've been able to detect there I had the highest silver counts (not bad considering there were six of us detecting, which also doesn't help the EMI situation).

Unless they scrape more dirt, finds are dwindling, but I'm wondering if trying your settings at this site would make it come alive again? So far it's been Explorer2's, CTX's, and Equinoxes in there, all operated by skilled detectorists. I didn't get in on it until a few days after the demo started, but the first couple of hunts people were digging 18 silvers a piece I had a six silver and a nine silver hunt the two times I was fortunate enough to participate.

Tom-I ground balance every time I go out because my soil changes so much. The chatter at -8 -9 (sometimes higher) is present almost everywhere I hunt around here. I know my soil is conductive clay and alkaline for the most part. Could be small iron flakes but it's most likely just the minerals/salt in the dirt around here. I assume because Field 2 and Park 2 are weighted for low conductors, it's picking up those tiny minerals and salt in my soil. I'm going out this afternoon and I'll definitely have to use Park 1 more and see how it handles this soil. Even running the sensitivity down it will probably allow me to hear those deeper faint targets.

I already know it performs better in iron, as I pulled another good coin a few nights ago and Park 1 definitely grabbed onto it better. Had a weird signal when I hit it in Field 2, numbers were all over the place but could tell there was something there. Put it in Park ! and the numbers tighten up, so I scrapped some dirt off the top and found a square nail in it, past over the area again and the numbers got better. So at that point I started filming but I could still tell there was more than one target in the hole because I was getting numbers in the negative and occasional 26 but mostly a group of low numbers. After I recovered the coin I went back over the filled in hole and there was still iron in it................Maybe I'll post the video later.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/01/2019 05:15PM by Abenson.

Andrew...….Collectively, by everything that you have conveyed/imparted...….. it really sounds like your dirt is creating too much rejected feedback/blowback …. to the EQX higher frequencies. And In this case: the EQX's optional higher freq (grouping) Modes. This is a fairly common occurrence around the World. You're not alone! The lower group of frequencies of Park Mode-1 ….. is yet another clue as to the complexities of your mineralization...…. via: presenting a much better performance level with Park Mode-1. In many cases...… lower freq's can punch through bad dirt, more readily...….. and be (somewhat) less attenuated; whereas, higher freq's may be more resonant (tuned) to small low-conductors; yet, cannot see them in your bad dirt (and not even reach them......due to: too much EM energy attenuation)……… subsequently, giving the performance edge to the lower grouping of freq's utilized in Park Mode-1 (and probably Beach Mode-1).

VERY important engineering bench-data. , . , . , . , . for the forward-thinkers.

Thought I would go over the same spot I hunted one more time to see what I missed. Used Park 1 with Tom D. settings. Last time if you remember I pulled 6 silver and 11 wheats. Ended up digging 1 more silver and 7 wheats. It's amazing that 2 months ago I was ready to give up on this site because the finds was slim to non. I used to use Park 2 5 tones every place I hunted. After using Park 1 and Beach 1 in 50 tones this site has given up over 40 silvers and 150 wheats plus other old coins. And just in the last 2 hunts since using Tom D. settings of lowering the recovery speed and raising the sens. I have pulled 12 silver and 24 wheats. It's like starting all over again. Have lots of old sites to go back to. Thanks again Tom D and Neil Jones for opening my eyes to a different was of using the Equinox.

Tom D. and others. If you are at a spot hunting lets say with my Equinox and your detector is acting a little erratic even after noise canceling and GB is it okay to use it that way? I noticed it when trying to run my sens. at 23-25. Was power lines above me and around me. Does it hurt the performance of the detector running it that way? Was using Tom D. settings in Park 1. Was just trying to get more depth and more unmasking in iron and some trash.

I've been reading the posts on this thread regarding EMI problems, but none of them touch on what frequency the user is running at the time.

Are you guys running in Multi most of the time, or changing depending on what type of conductors you're targeting?

Reason I ask, I was at a site in Virginia about a year ago that had those big high tension power lines crossing the property, and there was a swath about 50-75 yards wide where EMI drove me NUTS----until another Equinox user came along and suggested I switch to 40 khz.

When I did, I could hunt directly UNDER those power lines with no problem, just the occasionally little tick here and there.

Anyway, hope this helps.

McCJ2 ……… Are you asking if you can use 'Ground Balance' to mitigate EMI? As long as dirt mineralization is not too bad; yes. You would be surprised at the performance gains that can be had..... even simply by mitigating only 1/2 the EMI. A 'bad' Ground Balance in medium/low/no mineralization dirt...…. is hardly a reduction in performance ……… especially if Grnd Bal is utilized/employed to mitigate EMI.

EMI is the largest inhibiting factor of the EQX (and with many detectors...… for that matter).
Mineralization is the largest inhibiting factor (exterior of the detector). (((and is out of our control))).

NASA-Tom --

The way you understood McCJ2's question was not the way I understood it, but, I'm glad you interpreted it the way you did, because -- if I understand what you are saying correctly -- your answer is quite eye-opening to me. You can use GROUND BALANCE to mitigate EMI?

HOW would one go about using ground balance to mitigate EMI? How, logically, does setting a ground balance on your machine have any effect on mitigating EMI? What would be the procedure as to how one would "employ" a ground balancing process to help mitigate EMI?

Am I understanding this correctly?

Steve

Steve...……….. "Usually" Ground Balance has little/no-effect on EMI; yet, I have performed Manual Ground Balance AFTER performing a auto Noise Cancel. There indeed has been a few times whereby..... changing the Grnd Bal numbers......had 'some' effect on EMI. It is not often...…. but...…. it can happen.
Staying in Park Mode-1..... performing a Noise Cancel...……..then...……… flipping through the available Freq's (and usually landing back on Multi)….can have a much more dramatic effect on mitigating EMI. ((( On the EQX platform...……… operating in Single Freq mode is notably self-defeating; yet, if this is the only methodology that mitigates EMI...… it may 'keep you in the game' ))).

McCJ2 = Yes..... if you have performed a Noise Cancel...… and you have performed a Ground Balance.,.,.,.,.,.,.,. and the unit is still somewhat 'chatty': yes, you can still hunt with it. You may then (also) be able to drop Sens by a couple of digits..... to rid the EMI.,.,.,.,.,.,.,. and for a less-fatiguing hunt.
Any time you have EMI...…………… and/or...………………… any time you must drop Sens (even just a few points): there is a fairly large/dramatic performance loss.

NASA-Tom,

Got it.

A couple of follow-up questions.

1. I know you have said in the past that we should perform "auto" ground balance, for some "unsuspecting" reasons. Since I don't think you ever elaborated on the "why," I assume that the "why" is part of what your NDA requires you "not to say," so that is fine. Thus, I've always just used the "auto" procedure, per your suggestion. BUT -- above, you noted that it is by performing the MANUAL ground balance procedure, where there could be some additional EMI mitigation benefit. Hmm...how would one know, in which scenario, whether the "benefit" of auto ground balancing might be "trumped" by the possible, extra EMI mitigation that a manual ground balance might offer? Any suggestions?

2. Along the lines of your answer to McCJ2 above, I have a specific, followup question, and I hope it isn't a dumb one, but... there have been times where I've encountered EMI, and simply can't mitigate it, BUT, due to the targets present, I try to fight through it, and continue to hunt. It is very fatiguing, audibly, but if you really concentrate, and work hard at it, I have had cases where it is possible to tease out repeatable "blips" that indicate a target present -- even relatively deep targets -- from amongst the overwhelming cacophony of "random, EMI blips" that prevail. So, my question is -- would it be correct to assume that the primary reason it is said that you "lose depth" due to EMI (in at least some situations) is NOT that the machine "cannot report" a deeper target, but instead that it DOES "report," but the target report simply becomes nearly impossible to DISCERN from amongst the droning of EMI chatter?

The reason I ask is, IF it IS correct that the "loss of depth" is primarily a case where any target signal simply becomes lost amongst the chatter, then it follows that EXTREME CONCENTRATION (i.e. doggedly working to apply a "mental filter" to the EMI chatter) can help to recover some of the "depth loss."

I suspect there is more to it than this, at least in some situations, because I know that you have noted that "silent EMI" can cripple performance as well, and clearly that would NOT be a case where it's just a matter of "losing" target signal within the drone of EMI chatter (as there obviously be no EMI chatter occurring, hence it being called "silent EMI"). So, apparently, silent EMI (and perhaps audible EMI as well) actually cripples the machine in some other way, rendering it unable to REPORT a deep target (as opposed to reporting it, but the report getting "lost" within the chatter)?

Steve

Something interesting I witnessed yesterday. I went to an old park nearby that has terrible EMI. I'm usually not a park hunter but my daughter wanted to go so I took her. In the past I would usually run Park 1 recovery 6 with sensitivity down to 18 to mitigate EMI. What was amazing was that when I dropped the recovery to 4 it was almost gone and at 2 it was completely gone. I was also able to increase the sensitivity to 22. Now I normally wouldn't hunt at speed 2 because of the depth loss in my mineralized ground, but since we were just looking for modern coins I left it.

How is the EQ compared to the f-75 as far as EMI....not as bad, equal or worse.

All you past (and present) f-75 users got a real taste of EMI and either dumped the unit or kept it and got use to it. Now, it's easier to put up with some EMI after becoming immune from running the 75. Like steveg said you learn the hit sounds verses the chatter....of course your coil travels further and zig zags more because of checking repeatable signals. It will always be a pain in the neck, but we live with it.

Steve...……. Overall...…. EMI kills depth. Yes...… as a secondary...… IF your ears can still tolerate it...… you can hunt with EMI chatter.,.,.,.,.,., fatiguing as it may be. . . . . . and may still find shallow and medium-depth targets. You can (fairly accurately) tell about the maximum depth that you will get whilst encountering EMI..... by looking at the depth LCD gauge. If EMI is averaging (on the LCD bargraph)…. a 'medium-depth' EMI target/chatter...……….then...………… the deepest targets that you will find is: medium depth (or shallower).

((( Where is my (fairly lengthy) forum post about EQX EMI examples, explanations, definitions? )))

Using Grnd Bal to mitigate EMI..... is a last-resort. Always perform auto Ground Balance (if you have fairly bad dirt). Then...… leave it alone. IF IF IF …… you are encountering EMI that can be mitigated no other way...… then you can invoke the Settings button....until you are on Ground Balance...… then manually adjust GB..... either up-or-down..... to see if altering Grnd Bal has any effect on EMI. If it has no effect with EMI...…. then re-auto Ground Balance.

Andrew...………… Sooooooooooooo …………. what were your results? How did it work out for you?

Ozzie...….. The F75 (without DSP) was a bit worse with EMI.

NASA-Tom --

Got it. All questions answered. Thank you very much!

Steve

Tom-Park hunt was the least noisy I've ever had it. If I ever want to go after deep silver I'll have to do further experimenting.

Tom and others-Found out yesterday these settings that open up the Equinox are not for beginners. My Sister-in-Law was in town over the weekend and wanted to go to one of my relic sites to hunt. We went to one we could drive to, because she didn't want to hike in. She's not new to detecting but only has about 50 hours on the Equinox. She also has an etrac and has used a GPX at DIV before, so she's not green. She always uses my Equinox when she comes and I use the Deus or GPX in this case I used the GPX.

6 hour hunt.......First thing she says to me after about 10 minutes of hunting is, what did you do to this thing. I told her about the new settings and she decided to just leave them. This site has a fair amount of iron but not carpet of nails, however she was having a real problem IDing iron vs good deep targets. After 3 hours she showed me her finds, mostly nails and a few modern shotgun and 22 brass. So at that point we started comparing signals. The GPX can discriminate down to about 6 inches but still has an issue with small wire and bent nails even shallower. A good 70% of the targets we compared were iron and it was falsing off the edge with the Equinox, I could clearly tell it was iron with the GPX centered over the target.

The second half of the hunt she evaluated each target better by approaching from multiple directions and looking for a centered target with consistent positive numbers in the other negative and higher positive numbers present. She didn't find any period relics but did start digging the deeper 22 lead, rifle slugs and other modern trash.

With the GPX I picked up 1 GS cuff button, 1 large pewter, 3 small pewters, 2 32 cal round balls, 6 p-caps and lots of 22 lead, nails and other junk.

So if any of you that have tried Tom's settings and are getting frustrated, keep at it, there is a learning curve if you've never ventured from the stock modes. I ventured from the stock modes from day one and for the first few months I was changing things constantly when a target was located to see how it improved the signal. I though I had the Equinox dialed in before this thread started but the few changes that were suggested throughout it have made it even better.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/05/2019 04:58PM by Abenson.

Been using Tom D. setting and doing great with it. Just wondering in a large area could one use the same settings but, use the 15 inch coil on the Equinox? Would it help or hurt trying to hit the deep and some what masked good targets? Have some large areas I want to hunt. Didn't know if using a high sens. combined with a low recovery speed and 0 iron bias with the 15 inch coil would hit harder on deeper coins in iron or some trash sites vs standard coil? I figure it would on cleaner sites. Tom D. or anyone



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/06/2019 02:15PM by Mccrorysjewelry2.

Steve it seems the Nox is working with a high gain...so even weak signals seems to come to life. You can learn to hunt with all the chatter....but having the ability to adjust the tones can clearly help. If you are a coin hunters most listen to the high tone....if you want to hunt small gold occasionally adjust it to be a high ton something your brain is used to hear.

Tom...... ive got to ask since im dealing more with salt water that soil.... would you still run IB at 0? Ive been running it at 2.... sensitivity 19 or 20. I tried 3 for RS, but to me you get that swoosh sound that you get from say the CTX running hot near the surf...... i think it picks up a bit more of the surface minerals/salt.

McCJ2 = The size of the coil does not make much difference...… as far as these settings go. A slow recovery ...coupled with a large coil.,.,.,.,., can be an attribute.....in many regards. But...… in most cases...… I find the stock 11" DD coil to be deeper on coin-sized targets.

Dew = I always run Iron Bias on '0' in the wet salt. Yes..... it does pose problems on Zinc plated steel bottlecaps. . . . . . . . but it also helps with the deep non-ferrous targets (especially encroaching fringe-depth) from ID'ing as 'iron'.

Tom, what about recovery speed at the beach (in the water vs dry / wet sand), assuming the beach doesn’t have black sand?

In nearly all cases...… I have Target Recovery Response on '2'. Only in the maximum trashiest locations.... do I place TRR on '3'. This is to include the wet-salt beach. A TRR of '2'..... will provide maximum depth ….. which is crucial. A TRR of '1' presents slightly greater depth; yet, targets are audibly too elongated/lengthy/nearly-unintelligible.

Went back to another old Park that I hunted earlier this year using Park 2 on the Equinox. This time I ran Park 1, recovery 3, bias 0 and sens. 25. Using Park 2 I pulled 1 silver and 2 wheats. This time I pulled 7 silvers and 9 wheats. Since using Tom D. settings along with a slower swing speed places I though weren't worth hunting have now become places I would happily hunt again. Every spot I have went back to since using Park 1 that I though was pretty much cleaned out has now produced silver and other old coins. It truly amazes me that thinking you know how to use a detector to get the most out of it and then finding out you really didn't know. Tom D. you have truly changed the way I now hunt a site and and the settings I use. It has truly been a eye opener. Thanks

One of the minute' reasons that I 'held-back' on providing EQX data..... was for: metrics. WANTING to see how fast/slow folks would learn. This data is critical for future projects. It also tells us/me … if folks have/use a test-garden. It also tells us/me..... just 'how much' folks deviate from Factory Preset Norm. If we ever …..dream-of/come-out with..... a EQX-3030...… these metrics could come-into-play.

Some folks still think the EQX is 'not quite' as hot/good as the CTX-3030.... or other FBS/BBS units.
NOW.....folks are "just starting" to see/think otherwise.
Important!

(((There's a ton of other EQX data that is..... still...….."held-in-reserve".

The Nox has been an impressive machine is so many ways. ML changed there thinking .... from here it is you get what we give you to listening to its customers and upgrading service is so many ways. We've got a reasonable priced machine with an excellent warranty. The manual was very very well written ..... made it difficult for those selling books. Those presets are very good as well....... but you cant account for conditions. The machine is fast..... sometimes it seems to fast. I also think some of the results are coming from changing our mindset...... seems people are hunting with more intensity and focus. Its brought detects a little more up to date as a multi use machine with some interesting electronics. couple of things ids still like to see as a beach hunter.....an adjustable salt setting and TRUE AM with a simple way to REVERSE disc.

(((Be careful what you wish for)))