Rick...

Im getting a sense of you arent thrilled about me asking questions Rick? And no i wasnt asking Tom since he doesnt have a machine. I assumed you had the answers and was willing to share. Thanks for you reply you answered some of them.

Tom D....... this question is for you. Ive often heard the term gold/targets sinks to their equal weight. At what point will depth no longer be of value compared to sensitivity to those gold targets currently already in that depth range? I guess it goes back to what we sometimes call the CHICKEN OR EGG in dirt hunting..... are targets being covered up more or sinking? We see it now on large gold......where those that are stopped are being found, in a gray mud or shell base though our best gain has been very little. So im guessing anything below that has been buried not sank. Just how deep might a 15 gram gold ring sink in the best of conditions in sand? I remember you one being shocked just how fast a ring on a string in the wash was buried..... i believe it got down 10" quickly. I guess we dont know what we dont know.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/03/2020 12:54PM by dewcon4414.

It has a circular mono coil, so the sweet spot has to be dead centre of the coil.

THATS what i was afraid of Pimento. It will take some relearning for in the water hunters knowing that coil isnt going to get into that scoop hole.... and will targets disappear? Im glad the Nox isnt as deep as the AQ may be...... because those targets routinely disappear. Our one salvation is .... dig the hole deep enough and everything moves into the middle.

dewcon4414 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
I remember you once being shoc
> ked just how fast a ring on a string in the wash w
> as buried..... i believe it got down 10" quickly.
> I guess we dont know what we dont know.


I read that just the other day and chuckled. Tom said the ring sank 23 inches while he was standing there watching it. I thought that had to be a misprint. He must have meant 2 to 3 inches.

.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 01/03/2020 01:04PM by Badger in NH.

Guess I am at a loss.
We have an American with the detector.
No videos yet period I can see.
How does this thing sound?
Go pro should be within the AQ owner’s budget. Lol
Cost far less than motorhome. Lol

So let’s see some video on this supposed production unit.
Talks cheap.

Mix in a gold ring with some iron and show how unit responds.

You have time.
Don’t take that long to do quick video.
And post.

Cheers.

Ps
Don’t make excuses.

Dont need a GO PRO these days ...use a cell phone!

He seemed to have an awfully lot on his plate Tenn. so i can understand. Im also sure hes going to have to choose what to show given his conditions that will somewhat benefit us beach guys. Hes not in it to be a tester..... besides we'd complain no matter what he shows. Like most of us you know you'd give you left .... you know what..... to have one to play with ALONE on a beach right now until this thing gets released. Soooo will we hear from the other two? Maybe they are on a beach and..... ALONE with the AQ. Enjoy it guys .... you are going to have company soon enough.

dewcon4414 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> He seemed to have an awfully lot on his plate Tenn
> . so i can understand. Im also sure hes going t
> o have to choose what to show given his conditions
> that will somewhat benefit us beach guys. Hes no
> t in it to be a tester..... besides we'd complain
> no matter what he shows. Like most of us you know
> you'd give you left .... you know what..... to hav
> e one to play with ALONE on a beach right now unti
> l this thing gets released. Soooo will we hear f
> rom the other two? Maybe they are on a beach and
> ..... ALONE with the AQ. Enjoy it guys .... you
> are going to have company soon enough.


Yeah.
Like Calabash said. Use a cell phone.
Imo this release the way it is being handled is half azz at best.

Lame as all get out.
Person claims to have bought production unit model.
I don’t see it listed here.
[www.fisherlab.com]

No videos or pics from First Texas period.
No comments from company leadership or marketing rep.

If I had a product that was REAL good at finding gold rings in salt water /black sand.
And final product complete.
I think I would be showing off the unit.
And give target date for numbers of units ready for release to public by month/year.

Crazy how this thing is rolling out.

And just think some folks gave Minelab crap for dropping a non production unit out of aircraft.
Here we have it seems final product.
And notta.

Reminds of the the childhood game - pin the tail on the donkey.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/03/2020 02:01PM by tnsharpshooter.

What a joke! All these bold claims about what this detector will do and no videos by the owners or First Texas....Something is OFF and I think it is the performance! Guy shows us a pile of rings and everybody goes wild...show it hitting one of those rings at the 20 inch mark in black sand that they claim it will hit it. Lets see it against some iron....tones, etc !

I cant wait to see how this detector plays out ….If it is a performance issue then all the fan boys credibility will be ruined . Of course if I am wrong and it is the best thing since white loaf bread I will buy one...

BTW RICK I was thinking about this.. you have promoted this machine for 2 yrs and First Texas SOLD you one for over a grand if I read your post correctly.... My friend you got ripped off!!! Should have been FREE !

Badger in NH Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> dewcon4414 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> I remember you once being shoc
> > ked just how fast a ring on a string in the wash
> w
> > as buried..... i believe it got down 10" quickly
> .
> > I guess we dont know what we dont know.
>
>
> I read that just the other day and chuckled. Tom s
> aid the ring sank 23 inches while he was standing
> there watching it. I thought that had to be a mis
> rint. He must have meant 2 to 3 inches.
>
> .

No misprint Badger, 20 some inches....good thing he had dental floss tied to it.

I learned to be forgiving when it comes to Fisher's announcement and release of new detectors. Still patiently waiting for the last one to come out. Y'all remember the next best unit to supposedly show up after the F-75? Don't remember it being a pulse unit, either. Very little sarcasm in my statement, fellers.

ozzie Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Badger in NH Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > dewcon4414 Wrote:
> > ------------------------------------------------
> --
> > -----
> > I remember you once being shoc
> > > ked just how fast a ring on a string in the wa
> sh
> > w
> > > as buried..... i believe it got down 10" quick
> ly
> > .
> > > I guess we dont know what we dont know.
> >
> >
> > I read that just the other day and chuckled. Tom
> s
> > aid the ring sank 23 inches while he was standin
> g
> > there watching it. I thought that had to be a mi
> s
> > rint. He must have meant 2 to 3 inches.
> >
> > .
>
> No misprint Badger, 20 some inches....good thing h
> e had dental floss tied to it.


The sand would have to be extremely saturated. If he was dropping the ring into a 2 foot deep hole full of very loose watery sand it might be possible.

.



Edited 7 time(s). Last edit at 01/03/2020 02:48PM by Badger in NH.

I’m inpatient but I won’t knock someone who scored what seems like a good machine for my neck of the woods. Heck I’d pay for one ....and go pick it up lol. JAG ... who I believe is a Fisher tester has been given good information and I’ve seen a few videos from him and the designer. I believe they do work for fisher. Not sure I’d be doing many videos right off the bat if I got a new relic machine.... here in Fl. I’m certain he will do as promised.... we may have to hold the criticism down a bit and look at the meat of them. Rick wasn’t a tester .....and doubt he’s trying to be. Just excited about new equipment. Just thinking what I could do with that machine 3 months at least before the other guys.... I wouldn’t tell ya nada lol



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 01/03/2020 04:27PM by dewcon4414.

Reminder: the unit Rick got was a pilot-run unit, merely to satisfy a trademark first-sell date. It is not in full production, ergo no official release info. We are still hammering out some minor glitches so that when it is released it's solid.

Got it.
Man bought a glitched machine.
So some fake news spread here seems.
He says here it’s a production version unit. Copied post below comes from the following thread. This thread posted below was edited last on Dec 28, 2019. [www.dankowskidetectors.com]
lytle78 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Minelab’s excellent Equinox was Publicly introduce
> d with the parachute drop and all kinds of folks h
> ad access to “marketing test” Nox’s AFTER that.
>
> Lots of folks including Tom and Steve Herschbach w
> ere testers for engineering prototypes. None of th
> em, I believe have publicized their experiences of
> this testing in any detail - probably because of N
> DA’s which bind them.
>
> Likewise AQ prototype testers were under NDA and s
> o none of them have detailed their own experiences
> with it except my brief comments in October 2018.
>
> Marketing testers will no doubt be around AFTER th
> e AQ’s public release, with specifications, pricin
> g, availability date, etc. That day is not here ye
> t. When it is you will be able to judge whether it
> meets your needs and expectations or not.
>
> I am unlikely to comment on any performance aspect
> s of my unit since, although it is a production ve
> rsion, the AQ has not been launched as a product.
>
> This will doubtless not satisfy Mr. C or Mr. BB, b
> ut so be it.



Edited 7 time(s). Last edit at 01/03/2020 06:31PM by tnsharpshooter.

Perfect answer Carl. Pssss sounds like you should have taken those offers Rich lol. I know i ask a lot of stupid questions that people get tired of reading or responding to. But in some way im just trying to let the powers that be what id like to see for beach hunting. Over time ..... you have to admit changes have occurred. We have seen the designers make some real improvements..... focusing on the intent of the machine. It doesnt appear we are getting a powered down multi use one here...... this could be the real deal for GOLD hunter on the beach. Another benefit.......you ever hunt near someone with a PI? We maybe hunting buddy poor.... lol. Thanks guys.....



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/03/2020 07:46PM by dewcon4414.

Geotech is Carl Moreland - Engineering Manager of First Texas (Fisher). Pilot-run unit - not in full production. I’m fine with that.

Pilot run hardware IS production hardware, Carl said it was “not in FULL production.

Here’s some background for anyone who hasn’t been through production qualification.

[www.sofeast.com]

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/03/2020 07:25PM by lytle78.

lytle78 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Geotech is Carl Moreland - Engineering Manager of
> First Texas (Fisher). Pilot-run unit - not in full
> production. I’m fine with that.
>
> I am touched by the sympathy from Mr. C and Mr. TN
> SS. I had no idea that they cared.


Glad I complained like I did. Now we are all less ignorant (except for Carl).
I do pay attention and can remember what I have read.
Nothing like an honest forum. Lol
Need to train your fingers Rick to tell the truth. Lol

“Tell the truth”??? Exactly what lie are you accusing me of TNSS.

I stated that it was “a production version”. I did not state that it was in full production. As Carl has explained, it is not. I was well aware of that when I agreed to buy it. As the article I linked to above makes clear, pilot production involves

Since most folks like links without some indication of the contents, here’s a quote from the article...

“ This test production run is implemented at the start of a new production with the objective of identifying issues with not only how the product is assembled and tested but also the layout of the production line. You may find that some of the workstations need to be switched around as the assembly sequence is better or that the test stations need to be repositioned in order to optimize the throughput time (takt time) of the product.

One important aspect of the test run is making sure that the conditions are identical to those used in mass production. This includes using the same dedicated staff, test equipment, and work instructions.
In this way, issues can be flushed out as if the product were being produced in mass production. You will find out in advance if additional training is required for certain staff, or if work instructions need updating.

It is also a good idea to push the throughput limits during a pilot run so the system is put under pressure. This will identify additional problems that may not be identified at normal takt time.

Once the run is completed it is important to compile a failure mode list and create a corrective action plan for implementation before mass production starts. This will be the best time to make changes, improve the layout, and provide additional training because once mass productions start, any issues left unresolved will be included in the production. This could result in additional product cost, increased rejection rates, longer lead-times and delays.

This is why a pilot run is so important when launching a new product.”

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/03/2020 07:41PM by lytle78.

Listen Rick.
Real simple.
Who told you your unit was a production unit?
Next.
The unit is not released. Not yet.
So how would you or anyone else know if no changes had been made to the unit?
Without asking.
Did you ask anyone?
Seems not.
Dec not that long ago either. Actually last of Dec.
Naturally now that Geo-Tech has chimed in. It all makes sense to me now.
Why the unit not being talked about on manufacturers site and or by marketing rep of First Texas.
So it seem release not yet deemed imminent. Not yet.
Cheers.

Ps
Sounds like you are mixed up and don’t know what you bought exaclty. According to your posts.

[www.lawinsider.com]



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 01/03/2020 07:55PM by tnsharpshooter.

Tim Mallory, the Vice President of Sales and Marketing told me that in a phone call.AT 10:46 on the 20TH of December

Here’s an email I sent to some folks who I invited subscribe to a mailing list I have on the Impulse.

“ The good news is that production hardware exists. The even better news is that for reasons of protection of copyright protection for the name Fisher Impulse AQ, they needed to sell exactly one unit this calendar year. I was asked if I wanted to be the purchaser. Tough decision - not. I expect shipment on Monday!!

The only “OK” news is that although the production hardware and software is ready to go, they have hit a snag with EU certification of some of the materials. This will take some time to work through. I got no details, but my guess is that early spring is a realistic launch date.”

I never said that release was imminent - it is clearly not imminent. Could changes be made at some point in production? Of course, it happens all the time. Am I concerned that the machine i have may not be identical to those made after a thousand have been built? No.

Other than calling me a liar, I fail to see the whole point of your quite personal attacks.

I am not responsible for the plans and decisions of First Texas Product - when to launch, how many production standard units to build prior to launch - these are their business. I don’t recall such detail being divulged by any other metal detector manufacturer previously.

I have absolutely no obligation to comment in any way on the machine I have and frankly, until I had another one which I obtained after realest, I would have nothing truly comparable. Heck, although I have owned two TDI’s an ATX an SDC and several other PI’s I don’t have any of them now.

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold

Oh boy.

I just took a trip down memory lane. I went to the old FM forum Tech section in March 2014. We were discussing the Goldscan, White's TDI, HHPI, low power and Hi Power pulses. It was Rick, Tony, Mr. Bill, Reg, Eric Foster a fellow named Le Jag and a project called the Manta.

We were so innocent back then.

Hitting the Treasure coast this weekend, cold snap is coming thru.

Gonna use my vanilla detectors: HHPI with a custom Eric foster coil and the big box original TDI.

Rick I was mislead at the very least by your comments.
I think Calabash was too.

Now, if your unit was infact a production unit.
What else could be holding up mass production?
Well it could be contracts for parts, spares, etc.
Just common sense.

I thought the detector was a go by your remarks with maybe some logistical things First Texas was working on.
Now we know different.
Could still be some logistics being worked on, no doubt with a new model detector. Par for the course.

Btw Rick.
I take it this detector software not updatable by owner.
If it were I would be tempted to give you a break here.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/03/2020 08:09PM by tnsharpshooter.

You must be really excited about this crusade you have launched against me - I can’t type fast enough to outrun your successive posts.

Your last one was useful however - here is some text from the link you provided.

“ Production Units means product manufactured after Prototype Approval and Release to Production. Production Units do not include Prototypes or Risk Product.”

The unit I have is not a Prototype nor is it Risk Product. I tested prototypes in October 2018 and in May 2019.

You might have had a look at a link like the one I provided which explain what pilot production run is. The link you chose is entirely reputable, but is a link having to do with contracts law. Having spent 35 years or so as a contracts administrator in various companies producing hardware, it is perfectly clear that the intent of the Lawfare link is to furnish a definition of what is owed by the supplier to a purchaser who has specified the delivery of production hardware.

This buyer is well satisfied that the unit which Fisher sold me is a production unit.

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold

lytle78 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You must be really excited about this crusade you
> have launched against me - I can’t type fast enoug
> h to outrun your successive posts.
>
> Your last one was useful however - here is some te
> xt from the link you provided.
>
> “ Production Units means product manufactured afte
> r Prototype Approval and Release to Production. Pr
> oduction Units do not include Prototypes or Risk P
> roduct.”
>
> The unit I have is not a Prototype nor is it Risk
> Product. I tested prototypes in October 2018 and i
> n May 2019.
>
> You might have had a look at a link like the one I
> provided which explain what pilot production run i
> s. The link you chose is entirely reputable, but i
> s a link having to do with contracts law. Having s
> pent 35 years or so as a contracts administrator i
> n various companies producing hardware, it is perf
> ectly clear that the intent of the Lawfare link is
> to furnish a definition of what is owed by the sup
> plier to a purchaser who has specified the deliver
> y of production hardware.
>
> This buyer is well satisfied that the unit which F
> isher sold me is a production unit.


Rick you are trying to justify your error with semantics.
Keith Southern when talking of a test unit always warned his unit he is showing(unit that was worked (setup) later in the cycle) folks and talking about might not be a production unit. There could be changes!!
GOOD on him.

Not a crusade Rick.
Just getting to the facts. True facts.
I know more truth now about this detector than when I woke up this morning.
Dew has some time to wait it seems.



Edited 5 time(s). Last edit at 01/03/2020 08:28PM by tnsharpshooter.

One thing specifically mentioned by Tim was various international certifications for all the materials used in its construction. Until all this is complete, no international shipment can take place and the results may required substitution of different bit parts in the mechanical package. This alone would preclude full scale production and product launch - especially since the Manta’s homeland - France is expected to be a major customer.

I am dismayed to hear they you and Calabash feel you were “misled” by something I wrote. Perhaps a more careful reading of what I have actually written would help resolve your situation.

Meanwhile, your direct accusation of lying on my part stands in print.

This forum has a “free-and-easy” approach to moderation which sometimes leads some of us - myself included - to intemperate speech. It is a tendency we should all fight against.

For this reason I will be more careful in the future with my choice of words. Also for this reason you may find the bulk of any future comments or reports regarding my unit - if any - on Steve Herschbach’s Detector Prospector forum. Steve runs a tight ship and nips personal attacks in the bud. Since both you and Calabash post there, you should have ample scope to comment or question - responsibly.

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/03/2020 08:34PM by lytle78.

lytle78 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> One thing specifically mentioned by Tim was variou
> s international certifications for all the materia
> ls used in its construction. Until all this is com
> plete, no international shipment can take place an
> d the results may required substitution of differe
> nt bit parts in the mechanical package. This alone
> would preclude full scale production and product l
> aunch - especially since the Manta’s homeland - Fr
> ance is expected to be a major customer.
>
> I am dismayed to hear they you and Calabash feel y
> ou were “misled” by something I wrote. Perhaps a m
> ore careful reading of what I have actually writte
> n would help resolve your situation.
>
> Meanwhile, your direct accusation of lying on my p
> art stands in print.
>
> This forum has a “free-and-easy” approach to moder
> ation which sometimes leads some of us - myself in
> cluded - to intemperate speech. It is a tendency w
> e should all fight against.
>
> For this reason I will be more careful in the futu
> re with my choice of words. Also for this reason y
> ou may find the bulk of any future comments or rep
> orts regarding my unit - if any - on Steve Herschb
> ach’s Detector Prospector forum. Steve runs a tigh
> t ship and nips personal attacks in the bud. Since
> both you and Calabash post there, you should have
> ample scope to comment or question - responsibly.


I get along with Steve just fine.
Post there too.
Challenge questionable info there too if I see it.
Production unit to me means unit is complete. Fully operational and meets all manufacturer’s desires they care to obtain or can obtain.
That’s all.
Not rocket science.
Test unit or pilot unit is a unit that is not complete in one way or another. Sounds like what you have.

Cheers Rick.

OK, one last time - this is not a test unit. It was built on the factory production line with factory labor and processes. I have no obligation to report my satisfaction or lack thereof to anyone. Keith was talking about test hardware, often built by engineeering and he recovered it under NDA with an obligation to furnish his report.

Now that we have both had a back and forth shot at self justification, I am done with this discussion.

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold

lytle78 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> OK, one last time - this is not a test unit. It wa
> s built on the factory production line with factor
> y labor and processes. I have no obligation to rep
> ort my satisfaction or lack thereof to anyone. Kei
> th was talking about test hardware, often built by
> engineeering and he recovered it under NDA with an
> obligation to furnish his report.
>
> Now that we have both had a back and forth shot at
> self justification, I am done with this discussion
> .

Keith was referring to both hardware and software changes that could have taken place.
I remember he had suggested he said a few hardware changes ( physical things to alter slightly on some models) and he didn’t know if they were infact incorporated.
Also one detector Nokta-Makro gave him to test. I think Keith stated the detector was made hotter version than he had and even recommended. Via software change. Can’t remember which model. There was one though at least.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/03/2020 09:01PM by tnsharpshooter.