THE END GAME?

As we're watching COVID-19 unfold, you can't help but think, and I don't really see anyone talking about it, what's the end game?

As I see it there's the following scenarios:

1) Everyone stays at home, those that are infected either recover or die, and in a month with the inability to travel, the virus dies out, in the United States.
2) A vaccine is released, but who knows when, could be six weeks, six months, or two years, nobody really knows at this point.

If scenario one actually occurred, what about other countries that are just starting to see this break out? Do we ban all inbound/outbound travel until a vaccine is released? Perhaps we wear wristbands to indicate you've had it and are now immune, or are were tested and not infected.

It's certainly not going to be business as usual by Easter as was previous suggested that's for damn sure.

What I'm driving at here, is that until COVID-19 is eradicated, or you've had it and survived (making you immune to it), or a vaccine is released, it will just continue to circulate, so what is the end game?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/04/2020 06:37PM by Cal_cobra.

I think they are hoping it is going to be seasonal like the regular flu, when the heat and humidity come this summer it may halt the transmission of it. But at this point they don't know for sure. My business is shut right now because of this pandemic.

My hope is that there will be a vaccine similar to what helped with polio and the measles. One time and immune. I can remember us kids all across the nation lining up for shots at schools . They didn't have all the clinics, hospitals, etc. they have now.

El

Sure is scary stuff.

They're just pushing us now to see how much more that they can get away with.

I am Amazed at how well the media has managed to stampede the sheep. I hope the bas-turds are happy with the damage they are doing to the economy.

Fear is a powerful motivator, and people are willing to give up all sorts of liberties in times of crisis, in a desperate attempt to achieve safety. There's nothing wrong with that per se; I am voluntarily staying home as much as possible (ceding my "liberty") in an attempt to reduce the spread of the virus for the benefit of both myself, and others. The PROBLEM, of course, enters when folks in positions of power or authority seek to exploit fear -- or worse, foment it -- taking advantage of our willingness to cede our liberties with an eye toward the advancement of their own agenda. And that is what I hope that we as a country are aware of. Short term "soft martial law" or whatever you want to call it, makes some degree of sense, during this pandemic. But governments RARELY look to return to the citizens the liberties that were curtailed during times of crisis. Instead, they often see it as an opportunity to further consolidate power, to their own benefit. I've already heard rumblings in that regard, from some of our own congressfolks' mouths; let's hope "we the people" don't accept that outcome, if that's what it has come to once this pandemic has abated.

Steve

Cal_cobra Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> As we're watching COVID-19 unfold, you can't help
> but think, and I don't really see anyone talking a
> bout it, what's the end game?
>
> As I see it there's the following scenarios:
>
> 1) Everyone stays at home, those that are infected
> either recover or die, and in a month with the ina
> bility to travel, the virus dies out, in the Unite
> d States.
> 2) A vaccine is released, but who knows when, coul
> d be six weeks, six months, or two years, nobody r
> eally knows at this point.
>
> If scenario one actually occurred, what about oth
> er countries that are just starting to see this br
> eak out? Do we ban all inbound/outbound travel unt
> il a vaccine is released? Perhaps we wear wristba
> nds to indicate you've had it and are now immune,
> or are were tested and not infected.
>
> It's certainly not going to be business as usual
> by Easter as was previous suggested that's for dam
> n sure.
>
> What I'm driving at here, is that until COVID-19 i
> s eradicated, or you've had it and survived (makin
> g you immune to it), or a vaccine is released, it
> will just continue to circulate, so what is the en
> d game?


Your thoughts are ALL wrong. The goal is to flatten the curve....PERIOD.

HOW is it even possible you have not seen anyone talking about it???????

Please listen to what the experts are talking about. This virus WILL NOT "die out" There is already 8 different strains. In November we will ALL be talking about the next Flu season.

Dave



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/04/2020 09:11PM by midalake.

Cal_C definitely has his timeframes way out.
If we did NOTHING, it may be all over in two months ... much like your typical 'flu season'.
Because governments are trying to slow the spread down, so the healthcare system can vaguely cope, the rise in cases will go on MUCH LONGER, and the drop down in number of cases to a tolerable level will go on MUCH LONGER.

Staying at home WON'T make it die out quicker - it will make it die out MUCH more slowly.

Die out more slowly is EXACTLY the desired result - and rightly so.

If we exceed the capacity of our healthcare system, like would occur by doing nothing - untold thousands more will die because they will never get care. If it is stretched out, there will be hope of saving many of the seriously ill.

The other reason for spreading it out is to give time to explore medical treatments which might make the outcome of severe cases less fatal.

A vaccine will have to go through extensive trials to ensure that it is effective and safe. This will take time - you can’t make a baby in a month by getting 9 pregnant women to cooperate.

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold

The other reason for spreading it out is ...
* to allow time for temporary emergency hospitals to be built
* to allow time for essential equipment [eg. ventilators] to be manufactured/purchased
* to organise refrigerated mortuary facilities, so that cremations/burials can be done in a dignified manner. The public don't want mass graves, communal cremations or other 'war scenario' outcomes.
* to allow heathcare workers to give as many people as possible the opportunity to receive decent treatment. Without 'spreading it out' , doctors would have to implement triage ... everyone old/frail/compromised would be allowed to die untreated, and the facilities/equipment would be saved for those with the best chance of recovery, like younger healthy folk.

That's scary getting a wrist band. It could instead be a chip injecting in you like Revelation.

Revelation 13:16-17 King James Version (KJV)
16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:

17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.

I won't receive that mark.

End game....

I suspect the end game is to discover a viable, reliable treatment regime for it that our primary care physician can prescribe until a vaccine can be added to our regular flu shot and then life goes on as normal until the next virus pops out of some bush meat wet market and we do this all over again.

What disturbs me most is the national mainstream media's promotion of conflict in all aspects of our lives. They are so clearly agenda driven that they can't be trusted as an information source anymore and that makes it much more difficult to get actionable intelligence. That is what we are really losing, trusted information sources.

HH
Mike

midalake Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Cal_cobra Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > As we're watching COVID-19 unfold, you can't help but think, and I don't really see anyone talking about it, what's the end game?
> >
> > As I see it there's the following scenarios:
> >
> > 1) Everyone stays at home, those that are infected either recover or die, and in a month with the inability to travel, the virus dies out, in the United States.
> > 2) A vaccine is released, but who knows when, could be six weeks, six months, or two years, nobody really knows at this point.
> >
> > If scenario one actually occurred, what about other countries that are just starting to see this break out? Do we ban all inbound/outbound travel until a vaccine is released? Perhaps we wear wrist bands to indicate you've had it and are now immune,
> > or are were tested and not infected.
> >
> > It's certainly not going to be business as usual by Easter as was previous suggested that's for damn sure.
> >
> > What I'm driving at here, is that until COVID-19 is eradicated, or you've had it and survived (making you immune to it), or a vaccine is released, it will just continue to circulate, so what is the end game?
>
>
> Your thoughts are ALL wrong. The goal is to flatten the curve....PERIOD.
>
> HOW is it even possible you have not seen anyone talking about it???????
>
> Please listen to what the experts are talking about. This virus WILL NOT "die out" There is already> 8 different strains. In November we will ALL be talking about the next Flu season.
>
> Dave

All wrong? Okay. Flatten the curve, absolutely agree, but flattening the curve is more about controlling the virus spread in an orderly fashion via social distancing so the health care system can deal with treating people. It doesn't cure the virus.

Here's what happens when you don't follow social distancing: [www.nationalgeographic.com]

Next flu season, sure but this isn't the flu, and there's no vaccine for it unlike the flu, so not sure what your point is exactly?

My point is, yes their talking all about "flattening the curve" and that's great so we can keep out health care system functioning, but what about after that? This all started with one person, so until the virus is eradicated or a vaccine is released, it can start all over again just as the link above illustrates.

Pimento Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Cal_C definitely has his timeframes way out.
> If we did NOTHING, it may be all over in two month
> s ... much like your typical 'flu season'.
> Because governments are trying to slow the spread
> down, so the healthcare system can vaguely cope, t
> he rise in cases will go on MUCH LONGER, and the d
> rop down in number of cases to a tolerable level w
> ill go on MUCH LONGER.
>
> Staying at home WON'T make it die out quicker - it will make it die out MUCH more slowly.

That's the point, if the health care system is over capacitated, more people will die.

Sure we could do nothing but it still wouldn't be over in two months because that doesn't solve the problem, and unlike the flu which has a vaccine and an infectious ratio of 1:1, COVID-19 has an infectious ratio of 1:3-1:5 and no vaccine.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 04/05/2020 03:24PM by Cal_cobra.

Cal_cobra Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> midalake Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Cal_cobra Wrote:
> > ------------------------------------------------
> --
> > -----
> > > As we're watching COVID-19 unfold, you can't h
> elp but think, and I don't really see anyone talki
> ng about it, what's the end game?
> > >
> > > As I see it there's the following scenarios:
> > >
> > > 1) Everyone stays at home, those that are infe
> cted either recover or die, and in a month with th
> e inability to travel, the virus dies out, in the
> United States.
> > > 2) A vaccine is released, but who knows when,
> could be six weeks, six months, or two years, nobo
> dy really knows at this point.
> > >
> > > If scenario one actually occurred, what about
> other countries that are just starting to see this
> break out? Do we ban all inbound/outbound travel u
> ntil a vaccine is released? Perhaps we wear wrist
> bands to indicate you've had it and are now immune
> ,
> > > or are were tested and not infected.
> > >
> > > It's certainly not going to be business as usu
> al by Easter as was previous suggested that's for
> damn sure.
> > >
> > > What I'm driving at here, is that until COVID-
> 19 is eradicated, or you've had it and survived (m
> aking you immune to it), or a vaccine is released,
> it will just continue to circulate, so what is the
> end game?
> >
> >
> > Your thoughts are ALL wrong. The goal is to f
> latten the curve....PERIOD.
> >
> > HOW is it even possible you have not seen any
> one talking about it???????
> >
> > Please listen to what the experts are talking ab
> out. This virus WILL NOT "die out" There is alread
> y> 8 different strains. In November we will ALL be
> talking about the next Flu season.
> >
> > Dave
>
> All wrong? Okay. Flatten the curve, absolutely a
> gree, but flattening the curve is more about contr
> olling the virus spread in an orderly fashion via
> social distancing so the health care system can de
> al with treating people. It doesn't cure the viru
> s.
>
> Here's what happens when you don't follow social d
> istancing: [www.nationalgeographic.com]
> tory/2020/03/how-cities-flattened-curve-1918-spani
> sh-flu-pandemic-coronavirus/
>
> Next flu season, sure but this isn't the flu, and
> there's no vaccine for it unlike the flu, so not s
> ure what your point is exactly?
>
> My point is, yes their talking all about "flatteni
> ng the curve" and that's great so we can keep out
> health care system functioning, but what about aft
> er that? This all started with one person, so unt
> il the virus is eradicated or a vaccine is release
> d, it can start all over again just as the link ab
> ove illustrates.

OK, I can see you are thinking. One article I read claims 8 different strains of COVID19. Since they have been working on a vaccine for SARS for about 15 years I would not hold my breath about a vaccine for COVID. Starting all over again???? How, since one has immunity once they contract and recover.

This is going to be the long game, nothing short about it. Hopefully the most brilliant minds in the world are working tirelessly on a solution. But none of this will come without great cost first. Whatever advantage we had in January and February was squandered.

Also my point about "next Flu" season is: there is good research this virus lives longer on surfaces when the temperature is between 41 and 51 degrees. Thus able to spread better, maybe.

Dave



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/05/2020 03:33PM by midalake.

I said:"The public don't want mass graves, communal cremations or other 'war scenario' outcomes."
... but even with lockdown/social distancing/better hygiene/facemasks etc, to slow the spread, the death rate is still high enough that mass burials ARE taking place in NY:
[www.bbc.co.uk]

The COVID-19 virus is bad all over, although we have nowhere near the population here in northern New York as they do in New York City, the rate where I live (St. Lawrence County) is spreading faster than anywhere in the state. Be safe everyone.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/10/2020 01:36PM by SkiWhiz.

Mike Hillis Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> End game....
>
> I suspect the end game is to discover a viable, re
> liable treatment regime for it that our primary ca
> re physician can prescribe until a vaccine can be
> added to our regular flu shot and then life goes o
> n as normal until the next virus pops out of some
> bush meat wet market and we do this all over again
> .
>
> What disturbs me most is the national mainstream m
> edia's promotion of conflict in all aspects of our
> lives. They are so clearly agenda driven that the
> y can't be trusted as an information source anymor
> e and that makes it much more difficult to get act
> ionable intelligence. That is what we are really
> losing, trusted information sources.
>
> HH
> Mike

+1

Ski

I live in NW Michigan near Traverse City the entire area is a popular vacation destination. Whitmer finally locked down people coming up to their second homes and others using short term rentals such as B&B's to escape the harder hit downstate areas.. The other day I saw 2 summer homes in my neighborhood with out of state plates in the driveway and a bunch of Luxury SUV's uptown. Our areas limited healthcare resources would have a hard time handling a large outbreak.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/10/2020 05:28PM by Jackpine.

Jackpine Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Ski
>
> I live in NW Michigan near Traverse City the entir
> e area is a popular vacation destination. Whitmer
> finally locked down people coming up to their seco
> nd homes and others using short term rentals such
> as B&B's to escape the harder hit downstate areas.
> . The other day I saw 2 summer homes in my neighb
> orhood with out of state plates in the driveway an
> d a bunch of Luxury SUV's uptown. Our areas limi
> ted healthcare resources would have a hard time ha
> ndling a large outbreak.

U R correct Jackpine. Here in the UP of Michigan we have seen the same thing in the last two weeks.

A friend of mine in northern WI actually received a call from the heath Dept. because someone from Illinois he had contact with was positive with the virus. Two weeks have passed and thank god they did not get it!!! I really fear for Wisconsin with the forced election.. Will see what the next two weeks brings there.

Dave

Some of us that have retired get a monthly military email. The last one suggests they are following a very similar process based on a war game scenario played out by the war college before this took place. I highly suspect there will be a ton of info gathered from this and that there is disinformation taking place since we won’t be the only ones watching and trying to gather vital info on other countries as well.

Field Hospital just built in London Ontario. Inside the Agriplex fairgrounds building, parking lot once the sight of a massive (over 8000 graves) 1800's cemetery from those that died from Cholera and other diseases. To handle up to 500 people before they die.

"O’Neil also points to graves discovered when the Agriplex was built in the Western Fair District in 2004.

“We had the past experience when they were building the Agriplex, they found all kinds of undocumented graves and bones,” O’Neil said. “There might be a lot of unrecorded burials such as pauper’s burials or people who died from a disease.”

O’Neil said the back of the cemetery, where the poor, homeless and diseased were likely buried without properly being recorded, would have bordered Florence Street.

The grave diggers of the era also believed they needed to be fortified by alcohol to protect them from disease, he said.

“This was work nobody wanted to do,” O’Neil said. “People thought you could get diseases from the dead bodies.”"

DeepTech Vista X with 3 search coils.
Works for me



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/11/2020 12:11PM by Sven1.

!8 months for a vaccine at the earliest.
So I hear.

Know that vaccines can be done fairly quickly, even mass doses. What takes a long time is the trials/approval and gov insistence that the faster methods of production not be used for US products. Hopefully, this wont be the case with Wuhan. 18 months of crippled economy will radically transform this country..... in many ways.

At this point it’s not about a cure..... more about meds that will allow more to survive it.

pray everyone, and do what is needed to get through it!
god bless!

(h.h.!)
j.t.

One quote used is we are at the end of the beginning.

Miles to go before we sleep.

You're probably one-third the way through, similar to how we are in the UK. If lockdowns etc continued 'forever', you would probably be halfway ( the peak of the death-rate curve ) , but obviously some slackening of restrictions will be allowed, allowing the virus to spread more easily, thus 'fattening' the right-hand side of the curve.
We've got a death total about 11000, I can see 30 - 40000 being reached by end of June.

That number just like the one initially given us seems crazy with us only in the 12000 range. It’s just unthinkable to the point people don’t believe it that aren’t in a high death area.

At the start i though it's was gonna be just a little flu, china lied so much but nevertheless intel from all country probably knew what was going on here, they all are to blame not only the oms , are you kidding me.

A new harvard paper came out recently, and said we will have to altern lockdown period till 2022 , if we dont find a vacine and the virus will probably come back.

[science.sciencemag.org]

There is no proven global immunity ( Harvard said it could be a one year immunity till the new strain show up), i even read somewhere that people got infected two time by the virus in china.
The virus is not only infecting humain, at the start there was a case with a dog infected , and feline got infected in ny if i remember.

Harvard is right , because they is already a second wave on china.
Only south korea managed the crisis really well from what i've seen and read, but they will have probably as well another wave too and lockdown.

If you are interested by the amount of mutation and the propagation of the virus check [nextstrain.org]
.

Keep in mind, most of the modern country want you to work , they dont care if you die , economy is more important, instead of rethinking the way we work... but we will see how this think pan out.

Btw in september 2019, all financial market got shaken and we were waiting for a recession, we are in recession and the covid just made thing worst.

Protect yourself and your familly. good luck too all of you.