Very interesting unmasking post/threads lately.......

Can we center on four detector/coil combos for a bit?------The At Gold (w/6X8 coil)---AT Pro (w/6X8 coil)---GB Pro/G2 (with 5x10coil) & lastly, the MXT (w/SEF 6X8 coil).------For ferrous unmasking in mineralized ground, which of these FOUR detector/coil combos do you feel would do the best job as to the unmasking factor (not withstanding the depth issue).------Which of these four combos is going to be the best at seeing/unmasking non-ferrous items (and coins)?-----You guys are a sharp bunch----opinions/knowledge please!------------Thanks, Del

D&P-OR Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Can we center on four detector/coil combos for a
> bit?------The At Gold (w/6X8 coil)---AT Pro (w/6X8
> coil)---GB Pro/G2 (with 5x10coil) & lastly, the
> MXT (w/SEF 6X8 coil).------For ferrous unmasking
> in mineralized ground, which of these FOUR
> detector/coil combos do you feel would do the best
> job as to the unmasking factor (not withstanding
> the depth issue).------Which of these four combos
> is going to be the best at seeing/unmasking
> non-ferrous items (and coins)?-----You guys are a
> sharp bunch----opinions/knowledge
> please!------------Thanks, Del

Seems to me the G2 would be the best....................But you know a E-trac...with 6x8 .......could find the land of Lilliput !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Out of those 4 combo's - my vote is for the G2/Gold Bug too

I've had/used all of your listed machines/coils except the 6x8 coil on the Mxt --- I did have the MXT (just not that specific coil).



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/19/2013 03:17AM by MichiganRelicHunter.

I'll be interested to hear the opinions on this, as well. I know that I have asked NASA-Tom specifically about the Gold Bug Pro/G2 capabilities, in this regard, and his answer was basically "good, but not as good as the F75 SE." I'm interested to hear more detailed thoughts, as the machines you have listed are all pretty capable units overall...

Thanks for the intriguing question!

Steve

Now, the MXT with the eclipse DD 6x10 would be better choice.

Yes, F75SE with 5" DD coil and boost process invoked.

Then the GB-Pro/G2. (Be careful with the smaller coils on the GB & G2 units..... as a fairly large amount of depth is lost.
Not so with the 'boost process' capable units).

The MXT is not the best at unmasking in iron though it has the ability to split tone to your liking...

One you see a PROPER BOOST PROCESS you will realize just how hard it is to go backward's...

the BP is the best thing to happen to the T2/F75 since the T2 was invented...

its that good...

use the 5 inch coil and in BP mode it is deeper than most machiens with a 10 inch coil...LOL!!

I like the G2 but its not going to hunt like the BP mode...

the BP mode is a true iron site unlocker if you find one that is running right...

couple that with a DEUS or GMP or DTVG for certain target's and the site will be hunted the best it can be right now...

I find stuff with the 5 inch coil BP mode that the GMP does not hear and vice a versa... but you can rest assured they are really pulling behind all else in iron .

I do wish everyone could see a proper BP mode.

Keith

Del,
Out of the four you mention, I'd have to go with the AT Pro with the 5x8 coil. More tunable, fast responder combined with a sweep speed that can be swept slower than an Explorer. Truly a 'crawler' when you need slow, with fast recovery.

HH
Mike

Personally (and if you're talking about using these 4 machines in iron more than anything)

I like the iron resolution, and tone break on the GB/G2 not to mention the speed at which it works in iron and the absolute precise laser like cutting thru iron capability compared to the other 3 units. It's almost too easy. Set your tone break, pump to ground bal - turn to disc mode and go - listen for high tone and dig!

AT series is too stumble bumble type audio for me (and weak in iron when trying to hear the high tone above all the LOUD iron coming thru). On the G2/GB there's no mistake - it's very distinct and precise.

MXT is a diff animal --- too slow in iron for me and I don't like the audio on it either ---

Don't you think the soil comes into play I was in Virginia and was digging three ringers at 13 inches in tons of iron with the At Gold. But In Calif not sure and want to test the G2 and At same size coil in iron and see what each can do. I think this winter after one good rain storm will tell me more.

LowBoy

TAKE A LITTLE TIME KICKBACK AND WATCH SOME OF MY DETECTING VIDEO'S BELOW ON YouTube

[www.youtube.com]

If you don’t dig it, then how are you going to know what you’re missing!
How can you have your pudding if you don’t eat your meat!

Wow, you guys are ALL giving excellent responses.----I didn't think I would get this many responses to my post---it's great!!----It's sure giving me something to think about & digest! (grin)----Keep 'em coming---I (we) are all ears!!--------Thanks & really appreciate it.-----------Del

I'm with Wayne on this.

This seems to be where new designs are going. I think it is all about unmasking becasue we all know that there is a ton of good stuff hiding in a ton of bad stuff. Depth and unmasking, better ID, more stable when the sens is pushed all the way. That is what I think the wave of the future is and a better way for money to be put into new software and hardware design. Where I was hunting there was about four inches of decayed leaves before you hit the dirt. So depth is very important. 13 inces on a bullet with the At Gold blew me away.

I could run the sens all the way up and the break point on the iron was at about 28-30. With the small coil I had to check to make sure the machine was running it was so quite. Then I would hit iron and it would sound like a chain saw with iron audio on but I just waited for the tone that was not iron to come through and bang found a few good finds that way. If they put a iron volume on that machine it maybe all I need. But of course now I have to check the G2 and do one of my back to back tests.

LowBoy

TAKE A LITTLE TIME KICKBACK AND WATCH SOME OF MY DETECTING VIDEO'S BELOW ON YouTube

[www.youtube.com]

If you don’t dig it, then how are you going to know what you’re missing!
How can you have your pudding if you don’t eat your meat!

Lawrenzo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> This seems to be where new designs are going. I
> think it is all about unmasking becasue we all
> know that there is a ton of good stuff hiding in a
> ton of bad stuff. Depth and unmasking, better ID,
> more stable when the sens is pushed all the way.
> That is what I think the wave of the future is and
> a better way for money to be put into new software
> and hardware design. Where I was hunting there was
> about four inches of decayed leaves before you hit
> the dirt. So depth is very important. 13 inces on
> a bullet with the At Gold blew me away.
>
> I could run the sens all the way up and the break
> point on the iron was at about 28-30. With the
> small coil I had to check to make sure the machine
> was running it was so quite. Then I would hit iron
> and it would sound like a chain saw with iron
> audio on but I just waited for the tone that was
> not iron to come through and bang found a few good
> finds that way. If they put a iron volume on that
> machine it maybe all I need. But of course now I
> have to check the G2 and do one of my back to back
> tests.


Let us know the results of those tests Lawrenzo (AT Gold & G2).-----I for one would be VERY interested in hearing them.

So Keith, What is the PROPER BOOST PROCESS Please explain................Mark





Keith Southern Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The MXT is not the best at unmasking in iron
> though it has the ability to split tone to your
> liking...
>
> One you see a PROPER BOOST PROCESS you will
> realize just how hard it is to go backward's...
>
> the BP is the best thing to happen to the T2/F75
> since the T2 was invented...
>
> its that good...
>
> use the 5 inch coil and in BP mode it is deeper
> than most machiens with a 10 inch coil...LOL!!
>
> I like the G2 but its not going to hunt like the
> BP mode...
>
> the BP mode is a true iron site unlocker if you
> find one that is running right...
>
> couple that with a DEUS or GMP or DTVG for certain
> target's and the site will be hunted the best it
> can be right now...
>
> I find stuff with the 5 inch coil BP mode that the
> GMP does not hear and vice a versa... but you can
> rest assured they are really pulling behind all
> else in iron .
>
> I do wish everyone could see a proper BP mode.
>
> Keith

I keep noticing where Keith refers to PROPER BP mode. I have owned 2 F75 SE's and one T2 SE. Both, of course, with Boost Process. In my test garden and with air test results, and with real word usage, (by finding a button or bullet and then switching between DE and BP on the selector) I could not tell one bit of difference. Wait, hold on, I ain't done yet. I ain't dissin anybody's F75 or T2. Continuing in the real world scenarios, I tried the Boost Process (bP) compared to the default mode (dE) on all the above mentioned machines. I would find a target....or at least, a piece of something non-ferrous, and then raise the coil a couple of inches off the ground. For me, or rather, for my machines, there was ZERO additional depth , or air gap ability, when I held the coil up one inch off the ground while swinging over the target. Because I was told that the Boost Process really shines when you are in high grass and the boost process gives the added "OOMPH!" to sound off on targets not otherwise attainable. But i switched between DE and BP and gained no extra air gap distance.
I kept hoping that I got a DUD machine. That is why I sold the first and ordered a second. The same thing. So I accepted that I was just not adept enough at figuring out how to set up the F75SE and T2 SE to achieve this extra power. So I sold them all. By then, I had talked my hunting buddy into buying one. He brought it to my house when he got it , still in box, and we assembled and headed to my test garden. In disc mode, boost process, 7 inch three ringer.......iron grunt half the time. My friend said: that's not good. Since I had repeated everything that I had seen on the forums.....I had started taking for granted that my set up was flawed. But I researched, read NasaTom's long instructional write up, pored over the Fisher-F series -specific forums looking for help. So he just hunts with it totally in All Metal mode now and is quite happy with the depth. We went to a site the other day. In Mississippi. A huge camp. Hunted to death, and by folks who flat refuse to fill in their holes or carry out their trash finds. (I turned my ankle in one moron's hole.) They had dug pits and shards of green glass where up on the side of the half filled in hole. Went back the other day......NO TRESPASSING! signs surrounded the perimeter. Anyway.....I carried an AT Pro, large coil. He carried his F75 SE. I found a few bullets that others had missed. A button back. A rivet. He found nothing. At all. Now....I want to steer my post back to what Keith has referred to, several times......a PROPER BP mode. Keith, am I describing an IMPROPER BP mode??.......since I got absolutely NO additional air gap depth (holding the coil off the ground and bit while swinging and switching between DE and BP modes.....no difference at all). I have never mentioned this before because I didn't want flamed. For some reason, now, I don't really mind a good flamin. IN SHORT...(which is impossible for me)......Keith, what do you mean when you say PROPER BP mode??????
(and for those that will say that I didn't have it set right to take advantage of teh BP mode, I followed directions to the Tee. But still, I am willing to believe that I could have been misusing. And so was my friend.)....personally.....I think something is lost when each unit is not calibrated as it comes rolling off the assembly line. (I'm a Fisher fan......not foe)

Please let me add.....I am NOT an anti-F75 SE guy. Not at all. But I'll buy my next one from NasaTom. One that he has checked to make sure that Boost Process does indeed BOOST! I really think that I have yet to use an F75 SE with a proper BOOST mode.

You will know when you have a Proper Boost Process mode when you can run it in BP mode 99 Sens with little or at times No EMI...

Just this weekend I was hunting where I dug the Script I confederate Button last week... its right next to the road with power lines and I stayed on BP 99 sens all weekend...there was a little more EMI since I was about 20 yeards for the power lines and at about level with them since I was on a hill... but I hunted perfectly like this..

The 5 inch coil was actually picking up my digging tool so I had to keep it hanging on my shoulder as I usually do when walking,...but when hunting iron I usually keep it cocked and ready in my hand...I cant do that with the 5 inch coil boosted on 99.. it picks it up as I sweep to that side of my body...that's how hot the maxed out 99 sens runs with a tiny 5 inch coil...

once you dig some foot deep buttons in red clay in the BP mode Disc. you will see how powerful the mode really is...

but it takes 99 sens to see the best result's....just like on the standard T2 I run it on 99 sens for optimum depth.


one thing you will notice on the T2 BP mode is check a target in 99 sens standard that it reading iron and check it on 99 sens BP and if its still grunts its usually iron upon digging to be sure, but if it goes high or even high low you better check it out...I am not saying its that much deeper if you have an airgap...but it is more exact if you have in ground target's and fringe depth of maxed out standard mode...Modify sweep speeds between mode's also.....

The problems many have in the BP modes is they cant be ran Hot they are too noisy to see the differences...so you turn them back and that is counter productive is it not?..

The BP also slows down and looks a bit longer at a target for more accurate report...Adjust sweep speed for this also...

I have actually went into iron and dug non ferrous targets interminged with iron at the 10 inch range...Never done this consistantly till a EMI quite BP mode came into my posession...

I can honestly say in iron with BP mode on 99 sens I can make finds at depth intermingled with iron regularly, and I find this to be exceptional perfomance.....

To address your question Kevin about do you have nonproper F75 .....I dont know....

But I will tell you this ...On the T2/F75 platform if you dont get your sweep speed exactly right alot of in ground targets that are good will id iron if the dirt is funky... and its not a slow sweep like you would expect...its actually a medium sweep speed...

not sure why but in bad dirt if you creep looking for depth on the T2/f75 alot of the good target's at depth will go iron...People who use explorers will be at the most hinderance trying to adapt...good dirt this does not show like bad dirt...the BP mode can go a bit slower but at the same time is not as slow a sweeper as you might think...I am talking about the 8-9-10 inch and beyond stuff....

Even in iron once you get a peep isolated I like to work a bit faster over the target till the tell tale signal reports I am looking for...

Some like to check the target form different angles but I have found theres a sweet spot in the sweep speed and when that different tone comes into my headphones I only need a east,west report to dig not a north,south,east and hopefully west...with proper sweep speed the tone will come in and it may only be a one way tone but the tone is there to let you know...

So while the settings and all are critical dont forget the sweet spot for sweep speed...and it really shows on isolated target's...give it a check some time on a bullet see if it's grunting to start with, then speed it up till it goes to a high tone....

Actually do this...watch your meter on a slow sweep speed on a 10 inch bullet...it may not even show up on the meter and/or grunt's or not even that...Now speed up till the grunt goes high and also you will see the meter start to work too...I have dug some deep brass and lead in hunted out spots before in disc mode that was reading iron tone till I played around with the sweep speed....

But back to the Proper Boost ...Once you get one that runs 99 sens BP mode wiht out erratic falsing you will see awesome result's...

Keith



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/19/2013 11:53PM by Keith Southern.

Hi Del...How mineralized is the ground you will be hunting???? I take it that you are talking about hunting a park etc.????...JJ

jimmyjiver Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hi Del...How mineralized is the ground you will be
> hunting???? I take it that you are talking about
> hunting a park etc.????...JJ

Hi JJ-----Well, actually a lot of the ground we hunt is pretty mineralized.---My wife & I are both retired & live in eastern OR (gold country)---but--we are both still blessed with good health & able to travel (which we do)---so we are able to pretty much detect year around & have for years (mainly west of the Rockies & in the SW).----When I made this post regarding these four detectors, I was actually thinking more along the lines of iron plaqued ghost towns, old, long forgotten military encampments, logging camps (even gold nuggie hunting in the gold fields, which I haven't done for several years) & a few other similar situations with heavy iron/mineralization.------As to park etc. hunting (for the deep, difficult silver & coppers)---we own/use the Etrac & CTX for that type of hunt scenario.----Del

Getting a proper BP, non EMI Detector is like a crapshoot huh??? Are you saying that yours is dead quiet without the usual chatter the T2 normaly has at max out?
If that's the case, ya better hang on to that one!!!!...........Mark

Yes Mark Mine is very quite...

Not like the Norm...I can runitn maxed out with jsut a bit of pop and crack coming in above 90 sens but it goes away upon sweeping..So 99 sens BP is doable and very quite at that...

With large coil or small..

I have had Green non boosted t2's I could not run on 99 sens so EMI is the culprit on the Boosted or the Normal one's...

I can run this one stock 99 sens noise free and 99 BP mode is spitty but not rackety ...

Keith

Hi Del,,,,I think your best choice would be a GB Pro/G2 (with 5x10coil)....There is a slight difference between the two machines so check into them more....It sounds like you have some enjoyable hunts planed out in the future...Good luck in any or all of your endeavors....JJ

Very good answer Keith!!!!!! Thank you. Yes, at 99 sens.....even deep in the woods.......the F75 SE....(the one my friend bought and the ones I had) would NOT let you go anywhere above 80 IN DE (normal mode) mode!!!! And if BP was initiated, the sensitivity would have to be lowered to 70. So ya know......that proves that bP was working....because the sensitivity had to be lowered. Crap.....I never saw that!!!!!

As keith says you have to listen to what the detector is saying to you and slight zip and a higher VDI may mean a good target or a target that you have to dig depending where you hunt. For me when relic hunting I am going to be hunting a lot of trash mixed in with iron and good targets. But in Virginia it was casing and shot gun shells that were trash there was iron and then if I was lucky a relic. I would sometimes swing for tenty minutes till I got a sound. That is way different for me but was more fun and less digging. So yes at the GRD a lot of guys had F75 LTD and G2 and T2 a few of us had the At Gold...The boos mode does make a difference I have had one of the LTD that helped me hear the target better. But for some reason I never really took to the LTD. I met a few guys that could maz that machine out and it was quite and stable and that was very cool for me to see. But you can have the best machine in your hands and unless you are like Keith S you have to really know what it can do and if you can understand what it is telling you. Relic hunting in iron is not easy and throw in iron and it is not for the faint at heart. So a better faster machine may not always be the best match for someone.

LowBoy

TAKE A LITTLE TIME KICKBACK AND WATCH SOME OF MY DETECTING VIDEO'S BELOW ON YouTube

[www.youtube.com]

If you don’t dig it, then how are you going to know what you’re missing!
How can you have your pudding if you don’t eat your meat!