XP Deus ground balance observation/question

First, I would like to thank Tom for providing this forum, where members freely share information to help others increase their knowledge and skills to become more successful. Now, on to my question. First, I am curious what XP Deus users here are seeing as far as the ground balance when using the pumping method or by following what the detector is seeing as the ground mineralization index when sweeping , then adjusting manually. The preset programs of the Deus all have the GB at 90...top end is 99. So it seems to me that the preset programs have a GB that is set for high mineralization. If the operator is not in a area of high mineralization and using the preset GB, then he has quite a bit of positive ground offset which will keep the detector stable but have a negative effect on depth. The reason I ask is that in my limited time with my Deus so far, in 3 different locations (100-200 miles apart from each other) when using pumping or sweeping the coil my Deus is always at 77-78. The soil in two of these locations is very mild (as a comparison my G2 with 11" coil will GB in these spots at about 60...in the third spot around 70). Everything I have read and heard indicates that a GB of 77 or below will usually result in very unstable operation and falsing, and this is what I experience by going with what the detector is seeing for the GB. So, I find myself raising the GB to higher numbers to calm it down (usually 85-87)...this is fine, but being that I like to know I am not leaving a good target in the ground at depth...it would seem that I am sacrificing depth. Ground balancing every detector I have used up to this point was to provide a stable machine. I have to admit this is the area of the Deus that really has me befuddled...perhaps it's just my Deus?? I am curious to hear if anybody else sees ground balance numbers in the high 70's also. Many thanks! Bill

I have the same problem with falsing in tall grass..xp staff said that i must rise the GB to 88..there is also the ground notch which can be activated

Liaso

In your soil, what does your Deus GB at? So far, I have not heard of anybody who has theirs ground balance where mine is (77-78) ...all I hear is that when pumping they get 80's.

Usually in 75-80 sometimes more..

paleo...

You cant use the ground bal numbers from another detector to judge where the DEUS should be.....

The DEUS Ground Bal or as a matter of fact the XP line and the Deeptech line the Golden mask the nokta etc as examples dont really ground bal like the American machines....

Im not a engineer so I dont ave all the right phrasing to use...but att he same time the machines will be noisy if they are in the lowers 80's...brush contact.. wet grass,unevrn ground etc....I get plent deep and I hang around the upper 80's.....if you get too low on the Ground like 70s and such iron will beocme hard to handle.. very falsey...

rest assured the machien works well in the upper 80's.....extreme depth in mineral can be gained by just doing a 80 ...but noisy as all get out..if your dirt grabs at say 75 and runs fine it will be becasue theres no FE bars or few....but if your dirt grabs at 75 and the FE bars ar halfway or more you may find yourself runnign it above 85 or so to quiten it down...Ground bal does not seem to take into effect the FE strength .. and this may be how the unit unlocks iron so well and punches bad dirt so well...its almost that the ground is just an extended range for the discriminator...notice the machines dont go into mineral on the I.D.. a nail is 1 or 2...on a T2 below 10 on the I.D. is mineral..

I think maybe the ground circuit on the DEUS when in disc mode is balancing the machine after the signal is ran through the 2 channel disc instead of on most machines of it being before the disc in an all metal single channel mode...

just a stab but they are different technolgies used for the Ground bal on most of the Euros I have used... more of power balancing than anything else...

Keith

According to the User's Manual, pg 16, "If the ground is not mineralized, (see below the bargraph: Mineralisation strength) there is no need to adjust your ground balance to a level other than 90: since the ground does not send back any significant spurious echo, the performance will be optimal even at level 90 and you will reduce interference resulting from knocks to the coil."

What this is saying, I believe, is that a setting of "90" is for non mineralized ground, not "high mineralization" as you state, Bill.

Further, I believe they are saying there is no benefit in areas of no mineralization in adjusting ground balance below 90 (even if the ground index is lower, as obtained by manual or pumping methods.
Coming from the horse's mouth, I tend to believe them when they say a ground balance setting of 90 still provides optimum performance in areas of low to no mineralization.

Of course optimum performance can be more than just greatest depth.

I have manually ground balanced to the high 70s without loss of stability swinging through tall grass and occasionally stubbing the coil. Did it increase my depth attainment? I don't know.

Pleasant Garden, NC
AT Max, Nokta Impact, MX Sport, Nokta FORS Relic, GPX 4800, Infinium, Racer, Deus, F75SE, Nautilus DMC II (order of acquisition, last to first)

Does an archeologist argue with a plow? A bureaucrat with a bulldozer?

Mine always balances out at around 84/85/86 for an avg.

I don't see it too much lower or higher too often

I noticed that if you run the Deus in tracking that it will track lower in the iron infestation. Also setting the detector down to dig it continues to track "out" sometimes. I usually pump a few times during the hunt. If I notice that the detector is becoming erratic (usually I just wiggle the coil) then I pump again. But I will check into the ground notch thing.

75 to 79 SW Pa. mine runs pretty quiet

Thanks for the replies guys! Gonna have to retrain my brain to think like a Deus!

It begs the question of why, if the ground balance is optimal when set for 90, it would grab or track to a lower number.

When I had mine I could never get it to stabilize by pumping. I had to let it track for a bit and then set it to a average number. When I did use manual/pumping it would false so bad Icould not hunt at all. Keith told me the GB was to low and he was right.

Pac Man

Ground balance is the only thing that really confuses me about the Deus...and Steve brings up a good point. Would be great to hear some type of clarification/explanation on how the ground balance works. I have always associated high numbers as heavy mineralization. I would be VERY interested to know what the Deus registers when pumping in the red hot soil of Culpepper.

Deus/GMP is not "Ground Balance" as we know it.

NASA-Tom Wrote:
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> Deus/GMP is not "Ground Balance" as we know it.

could you elaborate please....

Then there is the issue of the the non-motion modes (or other pinpoint modes) where XP claims a correct ground balance is mandatory.

I have owned the Deus numerous times and have never been able to figure out if the other pinpoint modes or non motion modes offered anything exciting.

You might want to try pumping the coil, even in Manual or Tracking mode. When you pump the coil a few times it seems to reset/update the GB. I suspect 'optimal performance' means optimal stability, not depth. I had no real depth when I left the GB at the preset of 90. When ground balanced properly the machine is surprisingly deep and the VDI is much more accurate at depths up to 7". 
I have been hunting an old ball field the past few evenings using Tracking GB. The GMI readings ranged from 70 to 84, averaged around 76. 

Duke



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/18/2014 03:07PM by tnduke.

Re. this: "why, if the ground balance is optimal when set for 90, it would grab or track to a lower number."
The GB number is very sensitive to small changes in ground phase angle. No ground is completely neutral, the slightest amount of ground pickup will likely cause some tracking lower, evn if it's just two or three points.

I just got mine 3 days ago. I Took mine for a 30 minute play at a tot lot yesterday.

I pinged a squashed aluminium screw cap at 8" with a nice load tone and ground balance was around 88 and the Deus ran smooth.

To be honest I was surprised. Very happy with that short test though as expected the ground was trashy.

I am going to test it here in Victoria, Australia in orange high mineralised dirt with ironstone thrown in the mix detecting for gold nuggets.

wolfau Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I just got mine 3 days ago. I Took mine for a 30
> minute play at a tot lot yesterday.
>
> I pinged a squashed aluminium screw cap at 8" with
> a nice load tone and ground balance was around 88
> and the Deus ran smooth.
>
> To be honest I was surprised. Very happy with that
> short test though as expected the ground was
> trashy.
>
> I am going to test it here in Victoria, Australia
> in orange high mineralised dirt with ironstone
> thrown in the mix detecting for gold nuggets.

Let us know how it does in those conditions!

HH