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Anyone Know anything about the Whites V4

Posted by Keith Southern 
Anyone Know anything about the Whites V4
February 03, 2015 01:51AM
its a V3i upgraded==== Included in the software upgrade may be two added frequencies, the ability to hunt in one or any combination including just two frequencies, and a pi mode..

Sounds Awesome if a P.I. mode is included in a V3i type unit..

Available April 15th...

not sure if its true but I saw it on another forum

Keith
Re: Anyone Know anything about the Whites V4
February 03, 2015 01:59AM
Wow sounds very cool. I really like that company and want them to be sucessful. Ive honestly started to get a little concerned about them down the road w/all these foreign machines coming in.
Re: Anyone Know anything about the Whites V4
February 03, 2015 03:04AM
Will find out..........

=======================================
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Re: Anyone Know anything about the Whites V4
February 03, 2015 04:11AM
Sounds interesting. I heard Whites has new engineers eager to change things up. Hope they can deliver.
Re: Anyone Know anything about the Whites V4
February 03, 2015 04:21AM
Looks like they were/are trying to fill 1 position.
[www.linkedin.com]
Re: Anyone Know anything about the Whites V4
February 03, 2015 06:02AM
Interesting in light of your earlier post about Whites employment.

Past(or)Tom
Using a Tarsacci MDT 8000, an Equinox 800, Deus/ORX & others...
with my brilliant Corgi, Sadie
Re: Anyone Know anything about the Whites V4
February 03, 2015 08:34AM
P.I mode takes it from kind of interesting into ....Gotta have it!!
Re: Anyone Know anything about the Whites V4
February 03, 2015 10:00AM
I hope it is true. What a great wet sand hunting machine. But I hate
complicated detectors. We'll just have to wait and see. Or we could go to the white's forum and get booted for asking questions about a future machine.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/03/2015 10:03AM by goodmore.
Re: Anyone Know anything about the Whites V4
February 03, 2015 10:37AM
james1969 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> P.I mode takes it from kind of interesting into
> ....Gotta have it!!


Make it "waterproof" and now it's BEYOND "must have"! lol
Re: Anyone Know anything about the Whites V4
February 03, 2015 10:46AM
a game changer if it works ,nokta and makro will be worried +))

but can they come up with a telescopic stem like the deus and golden mask ??
or will they stick with assorted bits of tubing with spring loaded catches and wired in phones



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/03/2015 10:48AM by diggers.
Re: Anyone Know anything about the Whites V4
February 03, 2015 11:03AM
The v3i is an awesome detector but it lacks the ability in choosing 2 frequencies you want to hunt with.

I just sold mine yesterday and kept the Deus.

Why is it important to be able to choose 2 frequencies?

Well most of our silver coins in Australia and the $1 and $2 coins fall in the 2.5khz range.

Normal size and small gold rings and pulltabs and small gold jewellery fall in the higher frequency which is around 20khz..

Some other targets such as larger gold rings may fall in the 7.5khz and the dreaded aluminium screw caps fall
in the 7.5kz.

Yes I hear you dig everything you say but if you want don't want to dig the pesky aluminium screw caps just
don't dig the targets that fall in the 7.5khz range. What could help as well is a fine discriminator or notch
where you can tune it in to avoid the aluminium pull tabs in the 7.5khz range. WIth a bit of work I think Whites
can get the new release spot on.

The v3i is a great machine but a few more changes will make it super.

It will be very interesting to see the new one in PI mode and its capability and whether it could have some
sort of target id or discrimination. Just wondering out load if the PI feature would work in the our Gold Fields here
in Aus.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/03/2015 11:06AM by wolfau.
wjs
Re: Anyone Know anything about the Whites V4
February 03, 2015 12:13PM
I would like to see the ability to run in single frequency but pinpoint in three frequency or whatever you choose.
Re: Anyone Know anything about the Whites V4
February 03, 2015 12:18PM
That ad was posted 255 days ago.. How many days did it take to hire someone.. Then how long will it take to get out new product?? Dont sound good.. I would imagine the engineer that left last year and went to fisher maybe had an issue with the new machines that were supposedly being produced...
Re: Anyone Know anything about the Whites V4
February 03, 2015 01:05PM
I wish White's the very best. I always thought they missed the boat with the freq selection on V3i. Interesting to note the V3i freq started at 2.5khz and then progressed in multilpes of 3X (2.5khz), then 3x (7.5khz) then3x (22.5khz). Were these freq selections to save on electronics/engineering, etc??? Also, to me it seemed White's coils for the V3i missed the boat for depth also, i.e the 6x10 was shallower than say a 6x8sef coil on etrac. Ergonomics needs work big time. I know this because last week I swung my V3i after swinging FORS CoRe unit. Big difference to me. White's detectors aren't known for their power efficiency. Color screen, good idea, but uses/requires extra juice meaning bigger power supply vs LCD, which translates into more weight. You want to be a leader in the modern world when it comes to flagship detector manufacture and sales here's the path to follow IMO:
Keep weight at 3lbs -+ a few ounces.
Have tight coils (separation) with good depth.
Have good EMI handling capabilities.
Look modern in design-skip the tin can look.
If menus are employed-ensure they are simple yet easy to follow/access
Design only to provide useful information-skip the fluff (unnecessary icons, readings, graphs-keep KISS principle throughout)
Be power efficient-should strongly consider 4 aa battery operation-skip the rechargeable pack idea.
Target identification at depth, or as deep or deeper than competition.
Have detector engineered to run with top performance to near top performance with minimum settings /adjustments.
Provide a super detailed yet easy to follow users manual-consider using online versus hardcopy (provide start-up manual hardcopy).
Detector should be engineered to have internet software update capabilities.
Have wireless headphone capability
Have wireless headphone adapter available-gives customer options of using different headsets.
Offer detector with coil package, at least a stock and small coil.
Have bleeding/blending audio
Have adjustable back light
Have a superior disc circuit for hunting in heavy iron-tied to bleeding/blending audio.
Have both auto ground tracking and manual tracking-these need to work superbly-top notch.
Control box if under the handle needs to be narrow, not wide-helps with detector position while sweeping.
Be weather resistant at minimum- not necessarily waterproof, but be able to hold up in rainstorm for short period
5 year warranty on entire package should at least be offered to original purchaser-be a leader in the warranty offering department
Detector package should be shipped in ready to use bag/case-much like Nokta does with FORS CoRe pro package---offers extra protection during shipping and is very nice accessory to keep gear together in the field- also offers additional protection in field during carry/vehicle transport
Open up your forum for comparison post info/concerns/performance without censure-your product if great will do the talking not the few folks who always seem to find fault or be disatisified no matter what
Don't be afraid to talk about your new detector releases coming down the pike (just general info)-detectorists like to be in the know, maybe for planning purposes if nothing else


Good luck White's



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/04/2015 12:54AM by tnsharpshooter.
Re: Anyone Know anything about the Whites V4
February 03, 2015 02:53PM
The problem I always had with the V3i is that although there are an incredible amount of settings to adjust ....the performance never seems to be any better than far more simple detectors , for example my Explorer 2 only requires to press the ON button to get great depth......I'd be willing to spend hours fiddling with settings as long as it would result in better performance than my other detectors......but it does not.

I hope the V4 can up the performance......not just the settings!
Re: Anyone Know anything about the Whites V4
February 03, 2015 03:49PM
Does anyone know if it is possible to run a pulse circuit and a VLF circuit at the same time through the same coils.

If it is we could have a stereo pulse/vlf mixed mode detector.

I have my doubts but as batteries get better and cheaper that should not be a problem anymore.
Re: Anyone Know anything about the Whites V4
February 03, 2015 04:45PM
If they could make a V3i that swept and communicated to the users ear like an MXT w/a good DD coil, it might be the only machine I own. Features and fluff are nice, but the coil movement to my ear just doesn't click. You have to have perfect rythmn or super deep fringe items disapear in disc mode. Mine would also give sketchy ID and false unless centered. Having to constantly pinpoint targets to reasonably accurate ID got old. This isn't uncommon for some machines but minelabs sure got it pretty figured out.
Re: Anyone Know anything about the Whites V4
February 03, 2015 08:12PM
wjs Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I would like to see the ability to run in single
> frequency but pinpoint in three frequency or
> whatever you choose.


yes please!
Re: Anyone Know anything about the Whites V4
February 03, 2015 08:53PM
I owned a DFX so many settings yet really never felt it was that deep Purchased a Safari with minimal settings and got great depth with no drama. I am a techie so I like to tweek but if tweeking does not really make significant changes in overall performance why tweek. But - I think Whites was close to being a game changer. The graphical displays can tell you more then just a VDI number about your target especially when we have data from multiple frequencies. What the V3 lacked was intelligence - it demanded the detector owner to be the brain. Take all that data and all the adjustability and add some in detector intelligence so it can look at the polar plot and recognize a pull tab vs nickels - it could dynamically change settings when sweeping a target to find the best combination. I am talking about fuzzy logic and Pattern recognition. Computing power is cheap now days add some really good software engineering and extensive field testing and unmasking, target ID, and Depth could make a quantum leap.

Back in the 1970s Nikon introduced a camera that divided the picture into five different areas. It took light meter readings of each area compared those results to a database that was created based on evaluating many thousand pictures so it could tell a sunset from a backlit shot. Prior to this the camera had spot(if you where lucky) and center weighted metering. The photographer had to compensate for the meters lack of intelligences. The new technology dramatically increased the accuracy of exposure. Move forward to today and every Digital camera made uses a form of Nikons evaluative metering system. Now days poor exposure is rare(not to be confused with poor pictures still got plenty of those).

Let's call it evaluative detecting - the next big thing in my opinion.

Bryanna - Nebraska

Current - New to me but not new MXT Pro and T2 SE2 - Previous Minelab Sovereign GT, Minelab Safari, Whites DFX, Whites Eagle Spectrum
Smile its a good for you!
Re: Anyone Know anything about the Whites V4
February 03, 2015 11:36PM
They offer a lot too much for me, it's too much to programing, but that is their nitch. Now if they can change their image and make it so we can program it but not have to go to school to learn it then it could be cool. I hunted in South Carolina with the Deus and was digging mini balls at ten inches and that is deep. So it will be hard to make me want to get one when I did so well with the Deus. But good luck Whites

LowBoy

TAKE A LITTLE TIME KICKBACK AND WATCH SOME OF MY DETECTING VIDEO'S BELOW ON YouTube

[www.youtube.com]

If you don’t dig it, then how are you going to know what you’re missing!
How can you have your pudding if you don’t eat your meat!
Re: Anyone Know anything about the Whites V4
February 04, 2015 04:26AM
Lawrenzo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> They offer a lot too much for me, it's too much to
> programing, but that is their nitch. Now if they
> can change their image and make it so we can
> program it but not have to go to school to learn
> it then it could be cool. I hunted in South
> Carolina with the Deus and was digging mini balls
> at ten inches and that is deep. So it will be hard
> to make me want to get one when I did so well with
> the Deus. But good luck Whites

They are pretty simple. You have to Want to learn it. Called putting effort into something
Re: Anyone Know anything about the Whites V4
February 04, 2015 04:58AM
Be intesting to see what it is, if the rumor is true. Hope they don't screw up the good stuff in the V3i in the process though. Not everyone wants to build their own detector, but for those that do, the current V3i is at the top of the heap. If they just add some more versatility without subtracting anything else, that would be sweet.

HH
Mike
Re: Anyone Know anything about the Whites V4
February 04, 2015 09:57AM
O&B,

Whites does have a patent (from a couple of years ago) for a hybrid circuit that uses half the input wave for pulse and the other half for VLF. I'm pretty sure Steve H. has mentioned it before.
Sounds promising. The pulse generates the 'find' signal, and the vlf 'identifies'.

I know I'd certaily like to see some new tech.
smiling smiley
mike


OldandBold Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Does anyone know if it is possible to run a pulse
> circuit and a VLF circuit at the same time through
> the same coils.
>
Re: Anyone Know anything about the Whites V4
February 04, 2015 02:22PM
lets hope they can push the envelope to better things ,xp did it so why not them
Re: Anyone Know anything about the Whites V4
February 04, 2015 03:39PM
Mike.

VLF in a constant field and pulse is just that, a pulsing signal. The VLF can not read ID from the pulse side but must use its own field to read from.

Maybe it is possible to run a pulse on the same coils as the VLF signal operates on but maybe not.

Possibly they can be so different that they dont interact with eachother. Then we will have something to look foreward to for sure.
Re: Anyone Know anything about the Whites V4
February 04, 2015 05:12PM
Half Sine Technology [www.detectorprospector.com]

Constant Current [www.detectorprospector.com]
Re: Anyone Know anything about the Whites V4
February 04, 2015 07:37PM
O&B

Quote from the patent:

"Hybrid Induction Balance/Pulse Induction Metal Detector

A new hybrid metal detector combines induction balance and pulse induction technologies. Target signals are generated from a transmitted wave that has both induction balance and pulse current inducing characteristics and uses pertinent sampling of the receive data. Combining the two data sources provides eddy current target identification while excluding ground permeability and remanence obscuration."

No VLF is truly a constant field in the sense that the field is generated by an AC wave that (by definition) is constantly changing. There is a constantly generated AC waveform(usually sine, sometimes square, sometimes with harmonics) at the detectors operating frequency, that is inductively coupled at the coil. The measurement of the dynamic shift of the phase and amplitude of this AC signal gives us our target info. (And then we dig...hopefully for big gold and silver.)

In the modern VLF the target 'existence' info is obtained by measuring the zero-crossing phase shift of the GEB channel, and the target 'i.d.' is obtained by the disc/ampliture shift direction of the disc channel. Those are then combined (cross coupled through a comparator) to determine final signal.

What it sounds like White's might be doing, is to get the 'existence' info from a pulse, and 'i.d.' from the GEB side, and to share the waveform by sending only half of a sine wave for the GEB side, and fit a pulse in the missing gap.

But I could be wrong...

Either way it's new tech, and I hope it's released soon.

smiling smiley
mike



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/04/2015 07:56PM by Mike in CO.
Re: Anyone Know anything about the Whites V4
February 04, 2015 07:42PM
Steve,

Thanks for the links! (And great forum/blog articles BTW...)

I was somehow not aware of the 'constant current' patent.

Big advances in the MD world are exciting...like big gold finds, they occur far too infrequently.

smiling smiley
mike


Steve Herschbach Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Half Sine Technology
> [www.detectorprospector.com]-
> half-sine-metal-detector-technology-hybrid-inducti
> on-balance-pulse-induction-metal-detector/
>
> Constant Current
> [www.detectorprospector.com]-
> new-whites-patent-constant-current-metal-detector/



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/04/2015 07:46PM by Mike in CO.
Re: Anyone Know anything about the Whites V4
February 04, 2015 08:28PM
Steve: Thx for the links and your very good write up as always.

Mike :

Would be insane cool if it works. The V3 is a definitive winner as it is with its stereo mixed mode. Enough use and you get addicted.

May be a game changer for some people. Relic and beachunters will love it.,
Re: Anyone Know anything about the Whites V4
February 06, 2015 12:10AM
Id be happy with a MXT Hybrid...

Keith
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