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My just learned lessons on hunting in hot southern mineralized soil...
Posted by diggwr27
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My just learned lessons on hunting in hot southern mineralized soil... August 29, 2015 07:48PM |
This is about something I just learned so I will post this long thing in case some other Fisher owner, specifically the newer ones, might read it and maybe take something from it that they can use to find that next great thing.
Not saying I am an expert, I just observe things and report back if they are helpful to me.
For me, in this soil with my equipment this is a lesson I will use well in the future.
Some soil background and info...
Kansas soil I usually ground balanced at numbers from mid 40's to mid 50's...1 bar on the dirt meter...if that.
Alabama soil is usually mid 60's to the mid 70's with 2 or 3 bars on the dirt meter every time.
I have only been to a few sites...it could get way worse than that as I widen my travel area.
Here in Birmingham we not only have the normal heavy red dirt mineralization problems the south is known for but we have the extra bonus of all the minerals necessary in the ground to make iron and steel.
This town is nicknamed "Steel City" because of the history of steel and iron manufacturing we were known so well for in the past.
There are small nodules of naturally occurring iron infused into a lot of the dirt around here, run a magnet though it and you can easily pick them up and see.
Is it any wonder depth is usually worse than pitiful using most brands of detectors in this wonderful area of the country?
Recently I moved from Kansas back to Bama.
Went from rich dark beautiful soil to red mineralized iron infused garbage.
I lived here before and started my career here so I knew what I was in for, still it is hard to go from Hades to heaven and then back again.
In the good stuff I found I could zero in on most good targets with my F2 and narrow the signal down to good tones with only a 3 number jump or less.
Those were the type of signals I chose to dig most of the time, anyway, and did extraordinarily well.
When I switch to the F70 I tried to do the same but the much greater power this thing had made it difficult at first.
I had stuff jumping all over the place and dug a ton of everything even with 10 number and section jumps as I learned.
Slowly I got better and was able to get that down to more like a 5 number jump or less...usually less, so I was back to using my 3 number rule most of the time on the shallow stuff unless the signal sounded extra good.
Deeper stuff the rules were different but most targets I came across were 5" or less.
This worked well in that good soil with 3 different coils and usually no matter what tone settings I was using from all metal to mono tone to multiple tones.
Challenging sites with tons of iron were different and that 3 number rule didn't work at all in that situation but I figured out 2 ways to be successful in that stuff one using disc and another using all metal.
Now I am back in this devil dirt and I am doing pretty well just bopping around but I notice even using the small sniper coil it is really difficult to get a stable non jumpy number on my screen over good targets in the soil unless it is very shallow like an inch or less.
I have been hunting some pretty trashy areas including one with a bunch of iron and I have done pretty good in disc but eventually found all metal works better.
Even with my sense and thresh maxed out I still might get some noise from EMI and all the little bits and pieces of metal in the ground but the F70 still stops the jumping and tells me when I am swinging over a good target like a coin.
If they are a bit deeper it might not stay in that 3 number jump but I can amend my rules to 5 numbers easily.
I found that turning and hitting the target from 90 degrees and watching for close to identical numbers, or block of numbers, helps me to tell trash from treasure most of the time.
I practiced using all metal in the woods a lot in Kansas, I also used it more and more in my regular park sites and got pretty comfortable with it.
I noticed over time even in areas with high EMI and with the settings turned up to the highest levels I seemed to be getting the most accurate and stable signals in both the tone and the numbers on the screen using all metal over my other choices so that is why I kept using it more and more till it became natural and a go to choice more often than not.
I used to use disc to hunt in and then all metal as a check at the beginning...now I have turned that around 180 degrees and do the opposite most of the time.
Now one thing you need to know is I discovered hunting areas with iron, and that would be huge pieces or even small like nails or screws, if they are rusty they usually throw off some high coin numbers and even seem like they might repeat sometimes but in reality they don't and these high signals could actually be several inches away from where the actual rusty item is located.
I usually would use the pinpoint button if I suspected iron and found the exact location and by swinging over that area with the center of the coil I could then see the iron numbers only show up...no jumping to a higher range if that target was the only one under the coil.
By moving the coil to the area where I got those first ghostly high numbers with the pinpoint button I found nothing was there so doing all this quickly and efficiently helped me avoid digging a ton of iron and concentrate on the good stuff instead.
Yesterday something happened and I had another one of those AHA moments when I learn something new and useful.
Love when that happens.
I was walking back to the house from a trip around the neighborhood hitting curb strips, I was in all metal and as I was walking back to my porch I was swinging over part of my well hunted front lawn and saw some high numbers flash by.
I stopped and swung my sniper coil slowly over the area and I kept seeing the same block of numbers repeat with no drops to lower areas like iron in this lawn likes to do, and turning and hitting it from 90 degrees the same numbers were still there.
I didn't think I left anything in this lawn after hunting it so much in the past but I had to dig it to see and a silver coin popped up...surprise surprise.
Cut to this morning when I decided to hit my lawn again, and two of the neighbors also both of which I have hunted in the past.
I had lots of those high number signals in the past that I didn't dig because they jumped too much for my taste, plus I was swinging at my usual speed which is not the slowest but works most of the time for me but in this area in this soil a little too fast might result in a slight number drop that simulated iron which I remember seeing on many of those.
Change of plans today...I vowed to go real slow and see if I could find some of those high number signals.
If I could, I would stop and move the coil over them in short swipes but not too fast, and then turn and do it again from 90 degrees.
If they didn't drop, especially to iron, I would dig them.
Well the results of this little excursion are in the pics below.
I dug not one piece of trash even though I acquired many targets in my little hunt.
One zincoln but all the rest high tone targets except for that old padlock key.
Two wheaties and the others that could have been silver considering this is an 80 year old neighborhood but weren't...this time.
I am still thrilled I was able to learn and understand a good way to hunt in this hot soil, or at least recognize what is going on a little better.
Still much to do as I continue to hunt down here once again.
I wonder if silver rings that are a bit deeper will act the same?
I found plenty here in the past but never with the F70.
Chains are weird...how weird are they in this part of the country?
I got good at finding chains in Kansas...can I do that here I wonder?
I think the lower section targets will act in a similar fashion, I dug lots of gold in Kansas and hope that continues here.
I wouldn't mind finding some old nickels and there are areas with relics around here too.
Of great interest to me is depth.
In the past I never could get much deeper than 4-5" with most of my arsenal, I am hoping the F70 can penetrate this soil a bit better and I have used the pinpoint button on a few of those deeper blanked out screen signals, (see below), and saw some pretty deep and amazing numbers on the screen...10-11-12" and a few deeper.
That was with the small DD sniper.
Wasn't prepared to dig them at that time but I will eventually.
Wonder what will happen with the big F75 DD coil mounted instead?
Will those deep ones act the same way or is there a tone and disc setting that can give me a bit more reliable info on the deepies?
I didn't notice or experiment before but I will pay more attention now.
I seriously considered getting a TDI one day for special sites that I could not deal with well in the past.
That might not be necessary now.
I have noticed that unlike in Kansas where you can hear the tones on really deep targets but the screen will go blank and show no info when they are at the very end of the scanning field on the F70/F75 platforms, (usually in the 10" area using my smaller coils, a few inches more with the big DD), here I see no screen info on most targets at about 6" or more.
Like I said, very hot and challenging soil compared to the sweet stuff I used to hunt in.
More swinging and adapting to do and more lessons to learn but for me that never ends.
Another small piece of this southern mineralized soil puzzle just fell into place, soon enough I hope to complete the thing and see the whole picture.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/29/2015 07:56PM by diggwr27.
Not saying I am an expert, I just observe things and report back if they are helpful to me.
For me, in this soil with my equipment this is a lesson I will use well in the future.
Some soil background and info...
Kansas soil I usually ground balanced at numbers from mid 40's to mid 50's...1 bar on the dirt meter...if that.
Alabama soil is usually mid 60's to the mid 70's with 2 or 3 bars on the dirt meter every time.
I have only been to a few sites...it could get way worse than that as I widen my travel area.
Here in Birmingham we not only have the normal heavy red dirt mineralization problems the south is known for but we have the extra bonus of all the minerals necessary in the ground to make iron and steel.
This town is nicknamed "Steel City" because of the history of steel and iron manufacturing we were known so well for in the past.
There are small nodules of naturally occurring iron infused into a lot of the dirt around here, run a magnet though it and you can easily pick them up and see.
Is it any wonder depth is usually worse than pitiful using most brands of detectors in this wonderful area of the country?
Recently I moved from Kansas back to Bama.
Went from rich dark beautiful soil to red mineralized iron infused garbage.
I lived here before and started my career here so I knew what I was in for, still it is hard to go from Hades to heaven and then back again.
In the good stuff I found I could zero in on most good targets with my F2 and narrow the signal down to good tones with only a 3 number jump or less.
Those were the type of signals I chose to dig most of the time, anyway, and did extraordinarily well.
When I switch to the F70 I tried to do the same but the much greater power this thing had made it difficult at first.
I had stuff jumping all over the place and dug a ton of everything even with 10 number and section jumps as I learned.
Slowly I got better and was able to get that down to more like a 5 number jump or less...usually less, so I was back to using my 3 number rule most of the time on the shallow stuff unless the signal sounded extra good.
Deeper stuff the rules were different but most targets I came across were 5" or less.
This worked well in that good soil with 3 different coils and usually no matter what tone settings I was using from all metal to mono tone to multiple tones.
Challenging sites with tons of iron were different and that 3 number rule didn't work at all in that situation but I figured out 2 ways to be successful in that stuff one using disc and another using all metal.
Now I am back in this devil dirt and I am doing pretty well just bopping around but I notice even using the small sniper coil it is really difficult to get a stable non jumpy number on my screen over good targets in the soil unless it is very shallow like an inch or less.
I have been hunting some pretty trashy areas including one with a bunch of iron and I have done pretty good in disc but eventually found all metal works better.
Even with my sense and thresh maxed out I still might get some noise from EMI and all the little bits and pieces of metal in the ground but the F70 still stops the jumping and tells me when I am swinging over a good target like a coin.
If they are a bit deeper it might not stay in that 3 number jump but I can amend my rules to 5 numbers easily.
I found that turning and hitting the target from 90 degrees and watching for close to identical numbers, or block of numbers, helps me to tell trash from treasure most of the time.
I practiced using all metal in the woods a lot in Kansas, I also used it more and more in my regular park sites and got pretty comfortable with it.
I noticed over time even in areas with high EMI and with the settings turned up to the highest levels I seemed to be getting the most accurate and stable signals in both the tone and the numbers on the screen using all metal over my other choices so that is why I kept using it more and more till it became natural and a go to choice more often than not.
I used to use disc to hunt in and then all metal as a check at the beginning...now I have turned that around 180 degrees and do the opposite most of the time.
Now one thing you need to know is I discovered hunting areas with iron, and that would be huge pieces or even small like nails or screws, if they are rusty they usually throw off some high coin numbers and even seem like they might repeat sometimes but in reality they don't and these high signals could actually be several inches away from where the actual rusty item is located.
I usually would use the pinpoint button if I suspected iron and found the exact location and by swinging over that area with the center of the coil I could then see the iron numbers only show up...no jumping to a higher range if that target was the only one under the coil.
By moving the coil to the area where I got those first ghostly high numbers with the pinpoint button I found nothing was there so doing all this quickly and efficiently helped me avoid digging a ton of iron and concentrate on the good stuff instead.
Yesterday something happened and I had another one of those AHA moments when I learn something new and useful.
Love when that happens.
I was walking back to the house from a trip around the neighborhood hitting curb strips, I was in all metal and as I was walking back to my porch I was swinging over part of my well hunted front lawn and saw some high numbers flash by.
I stopped and swung my sniper coil slowly over the area and I kept seeing the same block of numbers repeat with no drops to lower areas like iron in this lawn likes to do, and turning and hitting it from 90 degrees the same numbers were still there.
I didn't think I left anything in this lawn after hunting it so much in the past but I had to dig it to see and a silver coin popped up...surprise surprise.
Cut to this morning when I decided to hit my lawn again, and two of the neighbors also both of which I have hunted in the past.
I had lots of those high number signals in the past that I didn't dig because they jumped too much for my taste, plus I was swinging at my usual speed which is not the slowest but works most of the time for me but in this area in this soil a little too fast might result in a slight number drop that simulated iron which I remember seeing on many of those.
Change of plans today...I vowed to go real slow and see if I could find some of those high number signals.
If I could, I would stop and move the coil over them in short swipes but not too fast, and then turn and do it again from 90 degrees.
If they didn't drop, especially to iron, I would dig them.
Well the results of this little excursion are in the pics below.
I dug not one piece of trash even though I acquired many targets in my little hunt.
One zincoln but all the rest high tone targets except for that old padlock key.
Two wheaties and the others that could have been silver considering this is an 80 year old neighborhood but weren't...this time.
I am still thrilled I was able to learn and understand a good way to hunt in this hot soil, or at least recognize what is going on a little better.
Still much to do as I continue to hunt down here once again.
I wonder if silver rings that are a bit deeper will act the same?
I found plenty here in the past but never with the F70.
Chains are weird...how weird are they in this part of the country?
I got good at finding chains in Kansas...can I do that here I wonder?
I think the lower section targets will act in a similar fashion, I dug lots of gold in Kansas and hope that continues here.
I wouldn't mind finding some old nickels and there are areas with relics around here too.
Of great interest to me is depth.
In the past I never could get much deeper than 4-5" with most of my arsenal, I am hoping the F70 can penetrate this soil a bit better and I have used the pinpoint button on a few of those deeper blanked out screen signals, (see below), and saw some pretty deep and amazing numbers on the screen...10-11-12" and a few deeper.
That was with the small DD sniper.
Wasn't prepared to dig them at that time but I will eventually.
Wonder what will happen with the big F75 DD coil mounted instead?
Will those deep ones act the same way or is there a tone and disc setting that can give me a bit more reliable info on the deepies?
I didn't notice or experiment before but I will pay more attention now.
I seriously considered getting a TDI one day for special sites that I could not deal with well in the past.
That might not be necessary now.
I have noticed that unlike in Kansas where you can hear the tones on really deep targets but the screen will go blank and show no info when they are at the very end of the scanning field on the F70/F75 platforms, (usually in the 10" area using my smaller coils, a few inches more with the big DD), here I see no screen info on most targets at about 6" or more.
Like I said, very hot and challenging soil compared to the sweet stuff I used to hunt in.
More swinging and adapting to do and more lessons to learn but for me that never ends.
Another small piece of this southern mineralized soil puzzle just fell into place, soon enough I hope to complete the thing and see the whole picture.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/29/2015 07:56PM by diggwr27.
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Re: My just learned lessons on hunting in hot southern mineralized soil... August 30, 2015 12:10AM |
Yep down here in places the hard play dough, I mean red clay won't allow stuff to sink very deep. However if there is a run off of precip somewhat it'll cover stuff up deep and quick. You just learned a very valuable lesson looks like. Iffie targets a lot of the time are good. Here's what red clay will do....... Good digs in this nightmare dirt BTW.
It's like owl **** when wet but will stick to everything LOL
It's like owl **** when wet but will stick to everything LOL
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Re: My just learned lessons on hunting in hot southern mineralized soil... August 31, 2015 04:23PM |
capt. Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Great write up. I experienced something very
> similar in central Arkansas a couple of days ago
> with the high tone an inch or three off the side
> of iron. This was a first for me. Bar meter was
> pegged out. Pulled a few pennies out of the
> area... one was a 1942 wheat. All shallow targets.
> Will be going back. Thanks for posting that
> information. It helped confirm what I experienced
> with my F75 (I was using the small DD coil).
>
> Good luck and HH.
Yea, I discovered this falsing high tone stuff around iron pretty quickly after digging some empty holes in the wrong place.
Soon enough I got it the habit of hitting the pinpoint button and looking around the area for actual iron and then moving the coil back to the falsing area and usually found nothing so that helped me to avoid digging a lot of iron.
I found that big iron will do this on the F2, but I assume the greater power range of the F70 will throw off high numbers on much smaller targets away from the iron like nails and other bits of metal if they are rusty.
I usually avoid digging most iron in the 6-10 number area because most of the time that will be small wire or nails, but iron signals in the very low numbers could be something big and interesting and I have found many old rusty pocket knives in the 11-15 area.
Pocket knives are one of my favorite things to find and dig.
Figuring out ways to hunt in my bad soil is important to me, learning to hunt in heavy iron infested sites even more so.
The reason is I have found that at many sites like that others might come and try their luck but many just give up and go away soon after.
Why?
Could be they just don't understand their tools well enough or want to spend the time to learn them to the extent I do.
It might be that many just don't enjoy hunting challenging sites like I do and would rather spend their time in much easier places.
That is just fine...this is a hobby, not a job, and should be enjoyed in any of the many ways open to different ways of thinking.
As far as challenges I embrace them and last year I found heaven at a site so bad I don't think one other person ever came back after one visit.
Crazy me kept returning for two years trying different detectors and coils with never much to show for my efforts.
Then, using my F70 I came here and spent several hours experimenting until I finally hit on a couple of settings and techniques that worked.
Slowly I started to dig less and less iron and then more and more great targets started to emerge.
We all suspected great things were there, how to get at them was the puzzle that needed to be solved.
Out of everything I have learned in this hobby the lessons I learned there at that site I think I am the most proud of in my career.
Those lessons are now being used at other difficult sites with great success so all that time spent there was well worth it to me.
Some of the best targets I eventually found at this site below.
Now I need to put the same effort into solving this heavy mineralized soil puzzle as I did at that iron mine and if I do I know it will eventually be worth it.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 08/31/2015 05:06PM by diggwr27.
-------------------------------------------------------
> Great write up. I experienced something very
> similar in central Arkansas a couple of days ago
> with the high tone an inch or three off the side
> of iron. This was a first for me. Bar meter was
> pegged out. Pulled a few pennies out of the
> area... one was a 1942 wheat. All shallow targets.
> Will be going back. Thanks for posting that
> information. It helped confirm what I experienced
> with my F75 (I was using the small DD coil).
>
> Good luck and HH.
Yea, I discovered this falsing high tone stuff around iron pretty quickly after digging some empty holes in the wrong place.
Soon enough I got it the habit of hitting the pinpoint button and looking around the area for actual iron and then moving the coil back to the falsing area and usually found nothing so that helped me to avoid digging a lot of iron.
I found that big iron will do this on the F2, but I assume the greater power range of the F70 will throw off high numbers on much smaller targets away from the iron like nails and other bits of metal if they are rusty.
I usually avoid digging most iron in the 6-10 number area because most of the time that will be small wire or nails, but iron signals in the very low numbers could be something big and interesting and I have found many old rusty pocket knives in the 11-15 area.
Pocket knives are one of my favorite things to find and dig.
Figuring out ways to hunt in my bad soil is important to me, learning to hunt in heavy iron infested sites even more so.
The reason is I have found that at many sites like that others might come and try their luck but many just give up and go away soon after.
Why?
Could be they just don't understand their tools well enough or want to spend the time to learn them to the extent I do.
It might be that many just don't enjoy hunting challenging sites like I do and would rather spend their time in much easier places.
That is just fine...this is a hobby, not a job, and should be enjoyed in any of the many ways open to different ways of thinking.
As far as challenges I embrace them and last year I found heaven at a site so bad I don't think one other person ever came back after one visit.
Crazy me kept returning for two years trying different detectors and coils with never much to show for my efforts.
Then, using my F70 I came here and spent several hours experimenting until I finally hit on a couple of settings and techniques that worked.
Slowly I started to dig less and less iron and then more and more great targets started to emerge.
We all suspected great things were there, how to get at them was the puzzle that needed to be solved.
Out of everything I have learned in this hobby the lessons I learned there at that site I think I am the most proud of in my career.
Those lessons are now being used at other difficult sites with great success so all that time spent there was well worth it to me.
Some of the best targets I eventually found at this site below.
Now I need to put the same effort into solving this heavy mineralized soil puzzle as I did at that iron mine and if I do I know it will eventually be worth it.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 08/31/2015 05:06PM by diggwr27.