MX-Sport, made in china ??

G'day folks someone has just informed me that his MX-S came with "Made In China" Stickers on parts of it, And if that is the case then No wonder the thing is a Wreck,

It's a Sad sad Day for Detecting,

See here,, [www.findmall.com]

John.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/03/2016 12:10AM by auminesweeper.

The guy said he looked in the battery compartment and saw the sticker. It could have been on the battery holder but the main machine is built in Sweet Home.

Kenny
[www.youtube.com]

khouse Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The guy said he looked in the battery compartment
> and saw the sticker. It could have been on the
> battery holder but the main machine is built in
> Sweet Home.

I See that now, I wonder why they can't get it made Local, So now they will have to State it is Assembled In America,

Now I know I don't want another one.

John.

We are part of global manufacturing. The made in the USA days are over. Parts are made all over the world. Cheap labor, lax environmental laws, and just good old corporate greed mean those jobs are never coming back.

goodmore Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> We are part of global manufacturing. The made in
> the USA days are over. Parts are made all over the
> world. Cheap labor, lax environmental laws, and
> just good old corporate greed mean those jobs are
> never coming back.

Yep, One minutes they are the enemy and next are Business partners, it's the way of the world,

The one thing I liked about Whites was the Sticker on the Back with Ole Glory waving to the Crowd, But Assembled in America just don't feel the same.

Well I made a post asking about it and they Locked my thread, and referred it to Whites for an official Reply,

[forums.whiteselectronics.com]

John.

auminesweeper Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> G'day folks someone has just informed me that his
> MX-S came with "Made In China" Stickers on parts
> of it, And if that is the case then No wonder the
> thing is a Wreck,
>
> It's a Sad sad Day for Detecting,
>
> See here,,
> [www.findmall.com]
>
>
> John.

why does this come as a surprise? - Personally, I believe most US companies get their product made there & create an illusion that its Made in the USA

[www.earthscan.co.nz]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/03/2016 01:40AM by rustic charm.

auminesweeper Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Well I made a post asking about it and they Locked
> my thread, and referred it to Whites for an
> official Reply,
>
> [forums.whiteselectronics.com]
> p?76188-MX-Sport-Made-In-China
>
> John.

well if that don't answer you query I don't know what will lol

I dont think Minelab lost customers when the disclosed that they manufacture in Malaysia so I cannot understand why these other manufacturers cannot do the same - It explains their problems with the MXS

[www.earthscan.co.nz]

Their 40 dollar digger is made in Taiwan and that would be easy to make in the U. S. It's not a matter of where something can be made but rather a matter of where it is profitable to be made.

rustic charm Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> auminesweeper Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Well I made a post asking about it and they
> Locked
> > my thread, and referred it to Whites for an
> > official Reply,
> >
> >
> [forums.whiteselectronics.com]
> > p?76188-MX-Sport-Made-In-China
> >
> > John.
>
> well if that don't answer you query I don't know
> what will lol
>
> I dont think Minelab lost customers when the
> disclosed that they manufacture in Malaysia so I
> cannot understand why these other manufacturers
> cannot do the same - It explains their problems
> with the MXS

I don't know why they hide everything, Minelab being made in Malaysia has not held them back, they are still scooping up the Gold, Damn It, Lol

dont go posting to whites pages that deaslyfox dude will just close ur thread and kick u off the forum after that crap i had to deal with the v3i i had ill never own a whites agin

Those of us who live in the world of realities know that electronic component manufacturing moved to the far east decades ago.

Not only that, but nobody builds stiff under one roof anymore.

Design, develop, assemble, test. This is pretty much the maximum of what western electronics manufacturers do in the "home country".

Whites, Garrett, First Texas are all entitled to a "Made in the USA sticker if they meet certian criteria about US content.

Get over it.

It's better than totally outsourcing the whole lot and becoming only a markerterm(and trademark owner) for items designed, manufactured and tested abroad.

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold

lytle78 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Those of us who live in the world of realities
> know that electronic component manufacturing moved
> to the far east decades ago.
>
> Not only that, but nobody builds stiff under one
> roof anymore.
>
> Design, develop, assemble, test. This is pretty
> much the maximum of what western electronics
> manufacturers do in the "home country".
>
> Whites, Garrett, First Texas are all entitled to a
> "Made in the USA sticker if they meet certian
> criteria about US content.
>
> Get over it.
>
> It's better than totally outsourcing the whole lot
> and becoming only a markerterm(and trademark
> owner) for items designed, manufactured and tested
> abroad.

That's right a lot of gear is made over seas, I guess one thing that we forgot to take in to account was that with a new machine would come more foreign parts,

There is really nothing to get over, most of use just won't buy it,, I prefer to have that made in America mean just that, If I wanted to buy a foreign detector I would have done, I don't like the fact this costs American jobs yet the companies want American Dollars, and that they want American money but not the American workers, That is the exact reason I ditched all my Minelab gear.

I guess the Failure of this machine is called payback, This machine has 8 Faults They never had such issues when 95% of their machines were Made in the U.S.A.

The people who are willing to except foreign made stuff don't really care as long as they get what they want regardless of the long term effects or who it hurts.,

So be It. let em get on with it.

lytle78 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Those of us who live in the world of realities
> know that electronic component manufacturing moved
> to the far east decades ago.
>
> Not only that, but nobody builds stiff under one
> roof anymore.
>
> Design, develop, assemble, test. This is pretty
> much the maximum of what western electronics
> manufacturers do in the "home country".
>
> Whites, Garrett, First Texas are all entitled to a
> "Made in the USA sticker if they meet certian
> criteria about US content.
>
> Get over it.
>
> It's better than totally outsourcing the whole lot
> and becoming only a markerterm(and trademark
> owner) for items designed, manufactured and tested
> abroad.

What a rude man you are assuming everyone else does not live in the real world - YOU NEED TO GET OVER IT

What is this certain criteria you mentioned? - Where is this information found in the real world? You seem to know all about it, please inform the rest of us?

As for your last comment, how do you know that it is better to source parts only as opposed to the entire product? Look at this case in question in the REAL world - maybe just maybe the fixes for the MXS are delayed because the US are working with the Chinese production line which all takes time -

Finally this is the last place to practice your condescending posts - Your obvious discomfort over this should be better directed to that manufacturer who is failing in every aspect of their latest release and NOT people who are caught up in it -

Real world FFS - Full DISCLOSURE from the manufacturers who DO use China for manufacturing parts/products should be a standard practice for US Corporations using them, instead of creating the illusion of big bad China stealing yet another US design -

Is their a difference between the US made White's GMT & the Chinese made GMT asides from $600usd price difference?

[www.earthscan.co.nz]

rustic charm Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> What a rude man you are assuming everyone else
> does not live in the real world - YOU NEED TO GET
> OVER IT
>
> What is this certain criteria you mentioned? -
> Where is this information found in the real world?
> You seem to know all about it, please inform the
> rest of us?
>
> As for your last comment, how do you know that it
> is better to source parts only as opposed to the
> entire product? Look at this case in question in
> the REAL world - maybe just maybe the fixes for
> the MXS are delayed because the US are working
> with the Chinese production line which all takes
> time -
>
> Finally this is the last place to practice your
> condescending posts - Your obvious discomfort over
> this should be better directed to that
> manufacturer who is failing in every aspect of
> their latest release and NOT people who are caught
> up in it -
>
> Real world FFS - Full DISCLOSURE from the
> manufacturers who DO use China for manufacturing
> parts/products should be a standard practice for
> US Corporations using them, instead of creating
> the illusion of big bad China stealing yet another
> US design -
>
> Is their a difference between the US made White's
> GMT & the Chinese made GMT asides from $600usd
> price difference?

Must admit that was not the response I expected from an Internet mate, whom I have trusted and bought things off and clowned around with. in the past,

john.

Recently bought a Jeep hat..... if bought from Jeep here in the US it was like $35. I ordered it from China.....free shipping $8. Thats why parts come from other contries foe assembly. BUT.... spects can be different and not all are tuned the same. Also a reason some of the older machine are sought after.

Dew

lytle78 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
1. electronic component manufacturing moved to the far east decades ago.

Absolutely, at the electronic component level there have been very few 'All American' electronic devices, including metal detectors, in decades.


2. Not only that, but nobody builds stuff under one roof anymore.

Very true, 'vertical integration' is usually not pursued unless there is a quality or cost reason to do so. Some sub-assemblies and tasks are contracted out domestically and in some cases purchased from overseas. Manufacturers will focus their limited resources on the 'core competencies' associated with their product or in areas that are proprietary to this product. For example, a detector manufacturer will design and build their own coils but they may contract printed circuit board (PC layout and fabrication. In my own engineering experience, high quality bare PCBs could be produced in Taiwan for 40% of the cost of PCBs produced domestically.

3. Design, develop, assemble, test. This is pretty much the maximum of what western electronics manufacturers do in the "home country".

Do we really expect a relatively small company to own their own foundry for making components to their own design specs, have a full machine shop for metal fabrication, injection molding equipment for plastic cases, own and maintain pick and place lines for printed circuit board assembly ?


4. Whites, Garrett, First Texas are all entitled to a "Made in the USA" sticker if they meet certain criteria about US content.

From the videos I have seen and plant tours that I have taken, White's is the most 'vertically integrated' of the 3 major American manufacturers.


5. It's better than totally outsourcing the whole lot and becoming only a marketer (and trademark owner) for items designed, manufactured and tested abroad.

Absolutely, I am happy there are still American metal detector manufacturers.
Finding a battery holder, speaker or some other component with a 'made in China' sticker doesn't change the fact that these detectors are more 'American' than 99% of the consumer electronics on the market.

I understand the OP's frustration with the tone of this thread. This is one area where the criticism of White's is not justified.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/03/2016 07:21PM by gravityrules.

gravityrules Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> lytle78 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> 1. electronic component manufacturing moved to
> the far east decades ago.
>
> Absolutely, at the electronic component level
> there have been very few 'All American' electronic
> devices, including metal detectors, in decades.
>
>
> 2. Not only that, but nobody builds stuff under
> one roof anymore.
>
> Very true, 'vertical integration' is usually not
> pursued unless there is a quality or cost reason
> to do so. Some sub-assemblies and tasks are
> contracted out domestically and in some cases
> purchased from overseas. Manufacturers will focus
> their limited resources on the 'core competencies'
> associated with their product or in areas that are
> proprietary to this product. For example, a
> detector manufacturer will design and build their
> own coils but they may contract printed circuit
> board (PC layout and fabrication. In my own
> engineering experience, high quality bare PCBs
> could be produced in Taiwan for 40% of the cost of
> PCBs produced domestically.
>
> 3. Design, develop, assemble, test. This is
> pretty much the maximum of what western
> electronics manufacturers do in the "home
> country".
>
> Do we really expect a relatively small company to
> own their own foundry for making components to
> their own design specs, have a full machine shop
> for metal fabrication, injection molding equipment
> for plastic cases, own and maintain pick and place
> lines for printed circuit board assembly ?
>
>
> 4. Whites, Garrett, First Texas are all entitled
> to a "Made in the USA" sticker if they meet
> certain criteria about US content.
>
> From the videos I have seen and plant tours that I
> have taken, White's is the most 'vertically
> integrated' of the 3 major American
> manufacturers.
>
>
> 5. It's better than totally outsourcing the whole
> lot and becoming only a marketer (and trademark
> owner) for items designed, manufactured and tested
> abroad.
>
> Absolutely, I am happy there are still American
> metal detector manufacturers.
> Finding a battery holder, speaker or some other
> component with a 'made in China' sticker doesn't
> change the fact that these detectors are more
> 'American' than 99% of the consumer electronics on
> the market.
>
> I understand the OP's frustration with the tone of
> this thread. This is one area where the criticism
> of White's is not justified.

A+ response

gravityrules Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> lytle78 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> 1. electronic component manufacturing moved to
> the far east decades ago.
>
> Absolutely, at the electronic component level
> there have been very few 'All American' electronic
> devices, including metal detectors, in decades.
>
>
> 2. Not only that, but nobody builds stuff under
> one roof anymore.
>
> Very true, 'vertical integration' is usually not
> pursued unless there is a quality or cost reason
> to do so. Some sub-assemblies and tasks are
> contracted out domestically and in some cases
> purchased from overseas. Manufacturers will focus
> their limited resources on the 'core competencies'
> associated with their product or in areas that are
> proprietary to this product. For example, a
> detector manufacturer will design and build their
> own coils but they may contract printed circuit
> board (PC layout and fabrication. In my own
> engineering experience, high quality bare PCBs
> could be produced in Taiwan for 40% of the cost of
> PCBs produced domestically.
>
> 3. Design, develop, assemble, test. This is
> pretty much the maximum of what western
> electronics manufacturers do in the "home
> country".
>
> Do we really expect a relatively small company to
> own their own foundry for making components to
> their own design specs, have a full machine shop
> for metal fabrication, injection molding equipment
> for plastic cases, own and maintain pick and place
> lines for printed circuit board assembly ?
>
>
> 4. Whites, Garrett, First Texas are all entitled
> to a "Made in the USA" sticker if they meet
> certain criteria about US content.
>
> From the videos I have seen and plant tours that I
> have taken, White's is the most 'vertically
> integrated' of the 3 major American
> manufacturers.
>
>
> 5. It's better than totally outsourcing the whole
> lot and becoming only a marketer (and trademark
> owner) for items designed, manufactured and tested
> abroad.
>
> Absolutely, I am happy there are still American
> metal detector manufacturers.
> Finding a battery holder, speaker or some other
> component with a 'made in China' sticker doesn't
> change the fact that these detectors are more
> 'American' than 99% of the consumer electronics on
> the market.
>
> I understand the OP's frustration with the tone of
> this thread. This is one area where the criticism
> of White's is not justified.


What are your thoughts on White's 40 dollar Taiwan digger ?

Some nice official responses in that thread on the White's forum - Offical White's Forum With Less Noise

tboykin Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Some nice official responses in that thread on the
> White's forum - Offical White's Forum With Less
> Noise


Is there any such thing as an MX Sport that is not defective ?

tboykin Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Some nice official responses in that thread on the
> White's forum - Offical White's Forum With Less
> Noise


Hopefully this will clear up the Made in China nonsense!

auminesweeper Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> rustic charm Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
>
> > What a rude man you are assuming everyone else
> > does not live in the real world - YOU NEED TO
> GET
> > OVER IT
> >
> > What is this certain criteria you mentioned? -
> > Where is this information found in the real
> world?
> > You seem to know all about it, please inform
> the
> > rest of us?
> >
> > As for your last comment, how do you know that
> it
> > is better to source parts only as opposed to
> the
> > entire product? Look at this case in question
> in
> > the REAL world - maybe just maybe the fixes for
> > the MXS are delayed because the US are working
> > with the Chinese production line which all
> takes
> > time -
> >
> > Finally this is the last place to practice your
> > condescending posts - Your obvious discomfort
> over
> > this should be better directed to that
> > manufacturer who is failing in every aspect of
> > their latest release and NOT people who are
> caught
> > up in it -
> >
> > Real world FFS - Full DISCLOSURE from the
> > manufacturers who DO use China for
> manufacturing
> > parts/products should be a standard practice
> for
> > US Corporations using them, instead of creating
> > the illusion of big bad China stealing yet
> another
> > US design -
> >
> > Is their a difference between the US made
> White's
> > GMT & the Chinese made GMT asides from $600usd
> > price difference?
>
> Must admit that was not the response I expected
> from an Internet mate, whom I have trusted and
> bought things off and clowned around with. in the
> past,
>
> john.

I am sorry John but in the past when I have mentioned those companies POSSIBLY using China for products/parts I have been slammed by that very poster & now its apparently REAL world knowledge according to the same -

[www.earthscan.co.nz]

Hi Rustic Charm

You and I have gone round and round about this kind of thing on various forums and obviously we are unlikely to agree.

First and most important. I Used intemperate language which apparently led to my points being misconstrued. I am sorry for that, it's an old fault and at age 70, I've about given up on eradicating it.

A couple of points however,

When I wrote "those of us who live in the world of realities" i was referring to the FACT that electronics components are almost exclusively made in the Far East. I did not claim that anyone wasn't living in the world of realities, just that facts are facts. Sorry if you felt that I was accusing you of being in some nonreality group - I wasn't.

Our previous disagreements, to the best of my recollection, were not about the use of far east components but the wholesale piracy of intellectual property in the form of software theft - a chinese GMT, for example (which you refer to above) - if such a thing exists - could only be a GMT if they copied the software - a clear violation of copyright law. This is exactly the issue with the fake T2's and Gold Bug Pros made in China.

You have on a number of different forums, and in this thread, accused American companies of having product manufactured in the FarEast then fradulently labeling it as "made in the USA"

You asked me for my reference for their being 'certain criteria" for use of that label. Here is the relevant information from the US Federal Trade Commission. My apologies for not supplying the link with my original post.

[www.ftc.gov]

Since you are so sure that violations of these standards is rampant in the US detector industry, perhaps you should just skip to the section on reporting violations - the full text is below.

Please copy us on the first complaint you file with the Federal Trade Commission.

WHAT TO DO ABOUT VIOLATIONS
What if I suspect noncompliance with the FTC’s Made in USA standard or other country-of-origin mislabeling?
Information about possible illegal activity helps law enforcement officials target companies whose practices warrant scrutiny. If you suspect noncompliance, contact the Division of Enforcement, Bureau of Consumer Protection, Federal Trade Commission, Washington, DC 20580; (202) 326-2996 or send an e-mail to MUSA@ftc.gov (link sends e-mail). If you know about import or export fraud, call Customs’ toll-free Commercial Fraud Hotline, 1-800-ITS-FAKE. Examples of fraudulent practices involving imports include removing a required foreign origin label before the product is delivered to the ultimate purchaser (with or without the improper substitution of a Made in USA label) and failing to label a product with a required country of origin.

You also can contact your state Attorney General and your local Better Business Bureau to report a company. Or you can refer your complaint to the National Advertising Division (NAD) of the Council of Better Business Bureaus by calling (212) 754-1320. NAD handles complaints about the truth and accuracy of national advertising. You can reach the Council of Better Business Bureaus on the web at adweb.com/adassoc17.html.

Finally, the Lanham Act gives any person (such as a competitor) who is damaged by a false designation of origin the right to sue the party making the false claim. Consult a lawyer to see if this private right of action is an appropriate course of action for you.

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold



Edited 7 time(s). Last edit at 08/03/2016 09:35PM by lytle78.

I'm not overly concerned as to where the parts of the machine are made but It may be helpful to just list the parts that are made in the U. S. That would let let people know how much of the machine is made elsewhere and they could then base their opinions of where the machine is made on facts rather than swayed BS.

tboykin Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Some nice official responses in that thread on the
> White's forum - Offical White's Forum With Less
> Noise

Tom with all due respect I have already posted that link here and people do not need to see ( With Less Noise ) added to the script and in all fairness you have not answered peoples questions and because of you making a post stating that a Statement would be released and then you vanish for days on end leaving people up in the Air has done nothing but raise the Temperature around here,

So I would ask you to stop using with such comments, As I want to work towards solving these issues/problems so we can get back to normal,

take care John.

They are not going to tell you squat. You think an auto manufacturer is going to release a parts list of things made over seas? Either will a detector manufacturer. Made in the USA is a nice idea, but it isn't reality. Global manufacturing is the just the way it is. The USA can not compete with other countries when it comes to manufacturing. The only thing we have on our side is we have the money to spend on the final product.

SeabeeRon Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> tboykin Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Some nice official responses in that thread on
> the
> > White's forum - Offical White's Forum With Less
> > Noise
>
>
> Hopefully this will clear up the Made in China
> nonsense!

Why is this non-sense? - They have cleared up why they use Chinese parts -

The nonsense I see is that forum 'locks' & 'unlocks' threads at will/when it suits - Do the Chinese moderate that site as well?

[www.earthscan.co.nz]

I never thought some of those electronics wasn't made in China.
There is no way anyone can compete anymore making everything in the USA the Detector would cost 5K if so.

goodmore Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> They are not going to tell you squat. You think an
> auto manufacturer is going to release a parts list
> of things made over seas? Either will a detector
> manufacturer. Made in the USA is a nice idea, but
> it isn't reality. Global manufacturing is the just
> the way it is. The USA can not compete with other
> countries when it comes to manufacturing. The only
> thing we have on our side is we have the money to
> spend on the final product.

Well Whites have started to talk openly and that is a good thing, So maybe we should give them a chance because we have nothing to loose, If they don't Answer right away that is only to be expected because we have given them a lot to think about not forgetting they are still working on finding fixes for the MXS,

John