iron masking surprise.

Hi Tom, I know you have probably written about this type of iron mask. I just watched 4 u-tube experiments showing a 4 foot long 1x6 board on the ground. A coin placed in the center and an iron nail placed parallel with the board 6" from a coin. They were trying to show how long a detector when swinging it at normal speed would mask a good target when passing over the iron nail first. I won't say which detector was best because it doesn't matter. I don't know how each machine was set up. What was amazing was the fact the coin was masked for such a long separation of the iron nail and coin. It really opened my eyes to test different settings and realize how many good targets I have missed. Any input you may have would great.

Tom has a good masking story about an 1858 dime that he dug several years back. I was with him at the time. I was using a CZ-5 and he was using a 1266...Tom? Care to elaborate?

Glenn

I usually don't feel various tests are reliable as items haven't been buried in the ground for years and of course settings may make them vary and of course all of our ground conditions differ. Basically swinging slower which is featured in one of Tom's video's and should help. Alway remember after cleaning a yard of silver coins decided to try for some jewelry. Got a two inch tab signal that turned out to be a gold filled cheapie ring and swung my coil over the hole before filling in and got a high coin signal. 4 or 5 inches under came out a 1827 large cent so masking indeed can make us miss a goodie or two and its not always iron doing the masking...

Dan-Pa is right, but I think Norfolk from Regton is doing his best with a short clip. I've walked behind my father's XLT with my F4 and found coins Recovery is very important and White's seems to be missing the boat. I think the French XP has the right idea with an iron volume instead of total mask. Anyone know of a U.S. manufacturer doing something simliar? I heard on another forum that the next Fisher machine will have it as well as wireless headphones... is that pie in the sky?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/10/2008 01:05AM by Shambler.

There's tons of information on just exactly this topic on this forum. Now..... I know that I'm getting a bit technical about what you viewed on u-tube..... and it's only semantics (wording - definition)..... but I'm a stickler for proper definitions; ; ; What you witnessed was NOT masking; rather, ADJACENT TARGET SEPARATION FAILURE. Yes,,,,, I know,,,,,, the results are still the same. BUT, BUT, ... IF a slower coil sweep speed,,, or a smaller coil..... or a coil of a different config,, such as a DD coil = CAN INDEED separate these adjacent targets; THEN THE GOOD ITEM WAS NOT/NEVER MASKED! Yes, I demonstrate this on the DVD.... and I believe I cover the definitions of masking & target separation.

Yes, I remember holding a handful of dirt...... waving it in front of Glenn's CZ.... and...... no matter how I oriented/rotated my hand..... the CZ ALWAYS positively identified my hand as ONLY iron. In front of a detector with ADJUSTABLE iron Disc capabilities ( a modified proto 1266-X )..... I positively knew that I had MORE than just a nail in my hand. I'm certain that if this particular detector had some form of ID capabilities; ..... the detector would have ID'd that handful of dirt as "high-end-of-iron-range"... and maybe even into the low-end of 'foil' range.

Upon opening my hand.... I could visibly see a nail. I removed the nail..... and closed my fist again. Now..... waving my hand in front of the CZ..... it (now) ID'd as a high-tone/high-coin. Opening my hand once again..... (something) slid down the small handful of dirt..... on the OTHER side of my hand ((( the side I could not see )))..... and Glenn GRABBED 'something' from my hand.... and screamed "Seated Liberty dime"! 1858 in EF-40 condition.

Moral of the story; ADJUSTABLE iron Disc is paramount .... in many applications.

Tom

Tom,
I was able to be one of those people who was able to witness SILENT MASKING.
i was at a boyscout camp i have an open invite to hunt...brought two buddies and my cz7apro...
Now we all do what i am about to say: I dropped a quarter on the ground before I began hunting just to hear the tone...i made it a "toughy" by dropping it in tall weeds...Well, you guessed it...NO SIGNAL..WTF I said, first in my head then out loud after three or four more sweeps...Did it roll or hit off a rock and bounce somewhere else..."Great, I just started and I am already DOWN twenty five cents"...so, just before i walked away i cleared the weeds w/ my hands and saw the quarter...next to some new iron that was dropped there (they built some movie watching room not too far away, probably a scrap from that project)....
...Anyways, after that i was thinking "COOL"!!! I just saw something that probably happens to me and all ofus many times but we never get the chance to know it...then i think of how many excellent silver and even gold coins have just been detected over w/ no signal...Maybe once a year all earth must be deeply tilled...
...Though, I sill wouldn't vote for Obama even if he promised that one...haha.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/11/2008 12:28AM by PanMan.

Curious why your detector did not at least give you an 'iron' tone response.... unless the metal was truly a form of oxide.

I agree with you Tom and the rest of you. Seeing it happen right in front of your face like Pan Man just set me back. Like him I know i have gone right over good targets. Your articles on masking and seperation are very well done and I really understand what you were saying. It just takes me a while thanks

On that note..... If I am EVER unclear, just holler! My style of writing..... and sometimes wording ambiguity are a bit rough.

Tom

RE: Curious why your detector did not at least give you an 'iron' tone response.... unless the metal was truly a form of oxide.?

I don't know why Tom...I heard of silent masking and I believed that was what I witnessed...the iron wasn't rusted, i saw it threw the weeds, saw it was just garbage, grabbed my quarter and walked away....i just thought to myself as i walked away i witnessed silent masking...and if it was something else, i feel stupid because i told of that incident for several years.

(deleted)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/14/2008 02:45AM by Shambler.