Equinox non servicable?

Mike C Wrote:
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> Official Words from Minelab regarding EQUINOX b
> attery
>
> “The Li-ion battery in the EQUINOX detectors is easily replaceable. Minelab has not yet released official information
> as to whether or not a user can change the battery over without voiding warranty or if we recommend the battery is
> changed by a dealer or service centre.”

In the US, the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act forbids limiting repair to an authorized service center. Saying the warranty will be voided if a person opens the unit violates this law.

Pretty sure my American Express card doubles the manufactures warranty, so if warranty is a concern for folks you might want to check your credit cards as many of them offer free extended warranties as part of their credit card program

Because, if the housing is completely sealed, which I think it is, it will have to be broken down, the battery replaced, resealed, then pressure tested against leakage, which will cost money. It wouldn't surprise me if it ended up costing a couple hundred dollars, once everything is said and done.

What's annoying about the choice of a 26650 size Li cell is that it's an uncommon size. 18650's are HUGELY more common, in everything from laptops to electric cars, and as a result get lots of R & D, and the massive manufacturing volume keeps the cost down. 26650 cells should in theory have best capacities of about 6000mAh (based on size comparisons), but in reality it's hard finding ones over 4000mAh, which is only slightly more than the best capacity 18650 cells ( of 3400mAh). Minelab would've been wiser to use two 18650 cells in parallel, though it may make for a slightly large handgrip...

Tech note: 18650 means 18mm diameter, 65mm long.
26650 means 26mm diameter, 65mm long.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/17/2018 04:45PM by Pimento.

Cal_cobra Wrote:
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> Pretty sure my American Express card doubles the m
> anufactures warranty, so if warranty is a concern
> for folks you might want to check your credit card
> s as many of them offer free extended warranties a
> s part of their credit card program

Wow! I never knew that? That's pretty cool.

Pimento Wrote:
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> What's annoying about the choice of a 26650 size Li cell is that it's an uncommon size.
> 26650 cells should in theory have best capacities of about 6000mAh (based on size comparisons)

26650 is widely used for vaping, so they are pretty easily available. Yes, not as widespread as 18650. By volume, it should have 44% more capacity than 18650, so maybe 5000mAh for a good brand.
BTW, a whole lot of these off-brand batteries are wildly overrated, some are dangerous. I would not trust an 18650 rated over 3000mAh unless made by Samsung, Sanyo, Sony, or Panasonic. I would have a similar trust issue with 26650.

I think most of the people that have an issue with it, will be many of the same ones who had no intention of buying an Equinox from the get go. Just my opinion.

"By volume, [26650] should have 44% more capacity than 18650, so maybe 5000mAh for a good brand."

Dodgy maths, Carl. Assuming internal diameters of 25mm and 17mm (where the active part of the cell is), I calculate volume increase to be (25/17) ² = 2.16 times greater. As the better brands of 18650 can be over 3000mAh (eg. Sanyo-Panasonic 3400mAh), a figure of over 6000mAh could be attainable.
This "not 18650" phenomenon affects smaller size cells, too. I looked into AA size (14500), and the best seem to be 850mAh, which doesn't compare favourably (ought to be 1400mAh).

Less-common size Li cells are used in upmarket torches (=flashlight), there's forums devoted to the subject (eg. candlepower forum), and they have plenty of discussion about how poor the capacity ratings of good brand cells can be ( plus the issues of cowboys printing 10000mAh onto garbage cells and listing them on certain online sites).



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/17/2018 08:24PM by Pimento.

My mistake, I forgot to square the ratio. ~2x is correct.

"The squaw on the hippopotamus is equal to the sons of the squaws on the other two hides"

Greg (E.Tn) Wrote:
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> Because, if the housing is completely sealed, whic
> h I think it is, it will have to be broken down, t
> he battery replaced, resealed, then pressure teste
> d against leakage, which will cost money. It woul
> dn't surprise me if it ended up costing a couple h
> undred dollars, once everything is said and done.

So how is this a problem when you compare it to say First Texas and their prices for software and warranty upgrades?

You all should be used to this type of maintenance by now anyway - I don't here the gripes and moans about the prices for the F75 & T2 upgrades etc -

[www.earthscan.co.nz]

If I end up purchasing an Equinox, it will be my fourth Minelab detector purchase.

That being said, the battery issue is a concern to me, because I intend to use the detector primarily underwater, and I think I have the right to get a truthful answer to my question.

Someone earlier posted this: “The Li-ion battery in the EQUINOX detectors is easily replaceable. Minelab has not yet released official information as to whether or not a user can change the battery over without voiding warranty or if we recommend the battery is changed by a dealer or service centre. "

Does that not sound a bit odd? If the battery is " easily replaceable" , then why does the next sentence indicated that a battery change by the user might void the warranty?

The current Equinox owner's manual says only this about replacing the battery: (from page 8) ".......the battery may need to be replaced every few years. Replacement batteries can be supplied and installed by an Authorised (sic) Service Centre (sic)."


The first quote CLEARLY indicates that at some point, Minelab was not sure if the battery could be replace in the field, as opposed to the dealer or service center.

The fact that the current Equinox owner's manual has no instructions on how to replace the batteries, SHOULD answer the question for everyone: if the battery is " easily replaceable" then why are there NO directions in the official minelab owner's manual regarding HOW to change out the batteries?

I really hope I am wrong about this. It would help a lot if someone from Minelab would pop up somewhere, and give either a "yes, it can," or "no, it can't"and answer the question.

At this point, all I can do is keep my fingers crossed and hope that Minelab uses good batteries.

Those people do not even read answers. I clearly stated that was able to access battery just using 2mm and 3mm allen keys. But nooooo, they are keep moaning. They are obviously here to complain, not to find answers.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/17/2018 10:52PM by Gastro.

Gastro - check in when you have replaced the battery in your Equinox....till then, you’re guessing.

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold

What guessing? 3mm key used to unmount unit from the shaft and 2mm to undo screw that locks battery hatch. Than just use pliers to pull it out.
If you have trust issue, why you even bother to ask people on forums if you are going to disregard what they say?
Also, why don't you doubt that information about nonservicable battery the same way you doubt my words?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/17/2018 11:37PM by Gastro.

When you have your Equinox (if you get one), take the battery out, replace it with another one, put it back together, submerge it to 10’ or so for a few hours and then tell us...

How did it go
What battery did you use
What did Minelab tell you about your remaining warranty.

Till then - you’re guessing - same as everybody else.

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/17/2018 11:53PM by lytle78.

Did you even read what was said?
For some reason you talk like I owe you something. I don't feel like I do.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/17/2018 11:59PM by Gastro.

Yes, I read your master plan - unscrew hatch, pull out battery...easy.

Now what the hell do you do?

Which battery to buy to the same specs?
Is the replaced “hatch” properly waterproof now?
What does Minelab have to say now about your warranty?

Again, call back when you have done it, please include the email from Minelab confirming that your warranty is still good - till then - you’re guessing. And, according to you, everybody who doesn’t share your rosy view of the issue is a fool.

You don’t owe ME anything. You owe the forum some reason to believe that your simple plan is the solution - so go buy yourself an Equinox and do it. Till then, as I believe I have said - you’re guessing.

And again - call back when you’ve done it.

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/18/2018 12:07AM by lytle78.

The Deus batteries are replaceable as well , two with screwdrivers and one with a knife , sealer and cutting a hole in the coil.
Both companies void the warranty if the owner does it themselves , the last I heard.
The Deus has a two year warranty on the batteries , Minelab's is six months.
A) Why the difference in warranty duration?
Why no word from Minelab addressing the issue?

Now, THOSE are good questions and useful observations. Now, of course Shoveler has 4 years and 633 posts under his belt. A bit more than 4 months and 26 posts. Sometimes, with experience, comes wisdom.

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold

Oh my god! A person who spends that much time in the internet must be able to Google an instructional video how to apply a silicon grease on two o-rings or find what a 26650 Li-ion cell is. If you really are not capable of doing that than find someone nearby who can.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/18/2018 12:25AM by Gastro.

I’ll give you this Gastro - you’’re persistent.

Call back when you have done it - please include the Minelab okeydokey on your warranty.

Doing something is easy - doing it right, maybe not.

Look forward to your You tube video - don’t forget the pressure test and the Minelab approval on the warranty.

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 02/18/2018 12:34AM by lytle78.

It is clear that you are here to whinge, but not to acquire an information. I'm ok with that. Everyone has goals on their own.

You could apply a bit af a thinking, you know. If battery is easily accessible with common tools an the cell is a standard size Li-ion cell, will authorised service centers be capable of changing it? A mystery of the 21st century.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/18/2018 12:57AM by Gastro.

Looking forward to your video.

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/18/2018 01:06AM by lytle78.

Again, for some reason you think I owe you something. Are you a debt collector?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/18/2018 01:26AM by Gastro.

shoveler Wrote:
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> Both companies void the warranty if the owner does it themselves , the last I heard.

As I said before, the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act of 1975 makes this illegal in the US. A company cannot void a warranty if the consumer replaces their own battery. The way the company can require you to use their service, is if they offer it for free.

As I said, some are here to whinge. It does not matter how much useful information you post and how many times you repeat it.

Geotech Wrote:
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> shoveler Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Both companies void the warranty if the owner do
> es it themselves , the last I heard.
>
> As I said before, the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act o
> f 1975 makes this illegal in the US. A company can
> not void a warranty if the consumer replaces their
> own battery. The way the company can require you t
> o use their service, is if they offer it for free.

Yes , I read that and understand the intent but in the real world all XP or Minelab would have to say to argue the point is that in the process of doing the replacement I (or whomever) had damaged some part of a component that led to a subsequent failure. Minelabs warranty reads like a government contract with exclusions galore. Coiltek requires you to ship a coil to OZ to determine whether it will be covered under warranty AFTER their examination. Who is going to be able to devote enough time , energy and funds to go through the legal shenanigans to enforce a warranty over an $11 part?

The law is wonderful , it's legal implementation is not.

31 posts

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold