Finder’s Keepers?

Finders’ Keepers?

In 2014, this article was run in a Scottish newspaper.

One of the most important Viking hoards ever found in Scotland has just been announced.
The historically significant find was made by Derek McLennan, a committed metal detector enthusiast who has been searching around the area in Dumfries and Galloway (Scotland) for the last year. The hoard contains more than one hundred artefacts, many of which are unique. They are now in the care of the Treasure Trove Unit and considered to be of international importance.

The hoard falls under the Scots law of treasure trove, and is currently in the care of the Treasure Trove Unit. The law provides for a reward to be made to the finder which is judged equivalent to the market value of the items. The Church of Scotland General Trustees, as the landowners, have reached agreement with Derek about an equitable sharing of any proceeds which will eventually be awarded. Secretary to the General Trustees, David Robertson said “We are very excited to have been part of such an historic find and we commend Derek for the spirit in which he has worked with us and the other agencies involved in making sure everything is properly registered and accounted for. Any money arising from this will first and foremost be used for the good of the local parish. We recognise Derek is very responsible in pursuing his interest, but we do not encourage metal detecting on Church land unless detailed arrangements have been agreed beforehand with the General Trustees.”

[www.archaeology.wiki]

Now the Church of Scotland has been unable to collect their potion of the $£2M in finder’s fee - they can’t seem to get in touch with the finder, Derek, and have now sued for recovery per their alleged written agreement.

[www.independent.co.uk]

This kind of thing gives us all a bad name - Derek is a major “influencer” for Minelab and I bet that they aren’t happy about the publicity in the UK.

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold

"we don't encourage metal detecting on church land",BUT we will take the money.

I hope Derek follows through with the written agreement, I’m sure eventually this will get worked out but it may hurt Derek obtaining permission on future sites or being invited to participate with group sites.

Paul

It’s a funny business about finders vs. landowners rights to “Treasure Trove”. In the US, it is very much “unsettled” with various states taking different views of the law in this matter. This Wikipedia entry will make good bedside reading if you are interested.

[en.m.wikipedia.org]#

And doc... He was invited by Church authorities and according to the article I put up, the agreement to share was part of the overall agreement wherein he was allowed to do what would otherwise been an act of trespass. Their statement about not “encouraging” digging on church land is a reasonable one - anyone on private land without right of way or invitation can be “seen off” and failure to vacate is trespass.

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 09/19/2019 04:33PM by lytle78.

Hello Rick,

That Wikipedia entry was a good read, thanks for sharing.

Paul

Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It’s a funny business about finders vs. landowners
> rights to “Treasure Trove”. In the US, it is very
> much “unsettled” with various states taking differ
> ent views of the law in this matter. This Wikiped
> ia entry will make good bedside reading if you are
> interested.
>
> [en.m.wikipedia.org]#
>
> And doc... He was invited by Church authorities an
> d according to the article I put up, the agreement
> to share was part of the overall agreement wherein
> he was allowed to do what would otherwise been an
> act of trespass. Their statement about not “encour
> aging” digging on church land is a reasonable one
> - anyone on private land without right of way or i
> nvitation can be “seen off” and failure to vacate
> is trespass.

We haven't heard both sides of the story, but anyone who doesn't abide by the unwritten 50/50 rule is just a greedy b4st4rd of the highest order.
I have hope and faith that the finder will play ball.

and some USA hunters "wax romantic" about those UK-type-of-laws (Scotland, etc...). Thinking they might be a good system to implement here. Let this link be a lesson that such-a-system is fraught with problems (at least if tried to implement here).


Over here, in the USA, if you find a cache/treasure on farmer-bob's land (or church land, or whatever), then it's totally between you and farmer Bob how you want to split that. That sounds good to me. The less the govt. is involved in the process, the better.

This is, of course, if the govt. is involved in that. If it's between the church and the md'rs, well then ............ so too would the same scenario develop here in the USA. But in NO case would either side want the govt. involved saying "where's our share ?"

Tom, the government - in the form of state courts is potentially involved in all disputes between parties as to the ownership of property of all kinds. As soon as one party brings suit against another, the government is involved. It is one of the inherent functions of ANY government - to resolve civil disputes.

When “farmer Bob” claims 100% of the $100k coin you just found on his land, in spite of a clear agreement (whether written or verbal), you have the option of seeking redress in civil court in the state which has jurisdiction.

The case brought by the Church of Scotland is a civil claim for recovery of monies due under a valid contract. That’s one of the reasons we have governments..

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold

But they Will take the money--agreement or no.

lytle78 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Tom, the government - in the form of state courts
> is potentially involved in all disputes between pa
> rties as to the ownership of property of all kinds
> . As soon as one party brings suit against anothe
> r,

I don't disagree. But when it comes to a "forced sale" , because the government "owns the wealth/resource riches beneath the ground", then it's no longer simply between "you and farmer Bob". Now you have a 3rd party involved. NOT because "someone sued someone", but .... just : At the git-go.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/20/2019 03:25PM by Tom_in_CA.

Agreed

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold