would like input on the "new' "sierra super trac" from whites.
does anyone have one of these? if so,wat are it's benefits over the mxt/m6?
thanks!

(h.h.!)
j.t.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/27/2013 04:52PM by jmaryt.

Don't have a prayer as not familiar with one..I do know Jimmy Sierra has been affiliated with Whites for years and was instrumental in the makeup of the original MXT so imagine its a top notch unit as Jimmy knows detecting and detectors...

yeah! i have been able to find some info on it it has 0 discrimination as it is fixed in all metal mode
with tones to distinguish ferrous from non-ferrous metals! would be good for relic field hunting,but for coin shooting,a genuine "nightmare"
in trashy parks and such! jimmy likes to head to england,so i guess he loves it,and had whitey build it just for him! i understand you can buy it off him,
but whitey won't sell you one out of "sweet home!"

(h.h.!)
j.t.

I live in Jimmy Sierra's marketing area. I stopped by a local White's dealer today and tested one. I was very impressed with the performance. It picked up a 12" deep nickle with the coil 4" above the ground. On my F70 the dirt was two bars and the iron was 69. The F70 with the 11" DD in AT mode would not pick up the nickle until I turned the sensitivity up to 80 which was very unstable at that level due to EMI.

The SST has very quick ground balance and tracking that can be locked. It has the M6 tones and a sensitivity control. The amount of gain is impressive. The aforementioned nickle was found with the sensitivity on 5 1/2 out of 14 and it was very stable.

The MXT Pro can be set up similarly but based on the short testing I did it is my opinion the SST is more sensitive. I was going to purchase one today but wanted to trade some US silver coins and the dealer didn't want to trade. Maybe next week. The current $600 price is a remarkable value.

Alan

I think Jimmy is done with detecting he is really old I know him but have not seen him in about ten years and he was about 71 I think. I know his son is running the business and his name is Jimmy also

LowBoy

TAKE A LITTLE TIME KICKBACK AND WATCH SOME OF MY DETECTING VIDEO'S BELOW ON YouTube

[www.youtube.com]

If you don’t dig it, then how are you going to know what you’re missing!
How can you have your pudding if you don’t eat your meat!

Alan in East Bay Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I live in Jimmy Sierra's marketing area. I stopped
> by a local White's dealer today and tested one. I
> was very impressed with the performance. It picked
> up a 12" deep nickle with the coil 4" above the
> ground. On my F70 the dirt was two bars and the
> iron was 69. The F70 with the 11" DD in AT mode
> would not pick up the nickle until I turned the
> sensitivity up to 80 which was very unstable at
> that level due to EMI.
>
> The SST has very quick ground balance and tracking
> that can be locked. It has the M6 tones and a
> sensitivity control. The amount of gain is
> impressive. The aforementioned nickle was found
> with the sensitivity on 5 1/2 out of 14 and it was
> very stable.
>
> The MXT Pro can be set up similarly but based on
> the short testing I did it is my opinion the SST
> is more sensitive. I was going to purchase one
> today but wanted to trade some US silver coins and
> the dealer didn't want to trade. Maybe next week.
> The current $600 price is a remarkable value.
>
> Alan

That depth sounds like a Deeptech. Good timing Whites.

Jimmy may be old(mature) but imagine his expertise and knowledge are influental in new products if perhaps Jim Jr. is running the show so to speak....even so I feel its trickled down and he may or may not be a silent partner or the head honcho..Your right though as he was old when I started this hobby 20 odd years ago...
Odd arrangement he has with Whites as some of his products can only be bought from him even though made for Whites products...
Still remember his bigfoot coil that cleaned up for me in planted hunts until they banned it...

Hey Alan does it have a treshold or is it silent search,,,

in other words its not dual mode like the mxt all metla and disc in unison is it?

If it has lots of power and runs silent with iron i.d. that might be a stepup from the MXT ....I find the MXT annouying afet awhile of hunting in rion with the threshold running....yet I find when i turn off the treshold it looses some of it's pizzaz...

maye thats the reason for the hybrid crossover model...

hopefully the gain is HOT and stable and deep ...to bad tone break is not adjustable...

Keith

Keith:

The SST runs silent (no threshold) in all metal mode with M6 tones.It is not dual mode (like the Nautius or Mixed mode like the XLT) it is all-metal motioin with a pin-point on trigger pull. The audio intelligibility is excellent. The tones are clear and not muddy like some I've heard. If the sensitivity is turned way up you get the occasional crackling and falsing although not near as much as the F70 I had with me.

The dealer has a board set up with 6 or 7 different coins on it spaced about 3" apart. Even at a very fast sweep each coin was picked up individually. I was pretty amazed with the fast response of both the targets and the tones being processed that quickly.

He had a plastic bucket of black sand from a beach near Half Moon Bay. There was a large 14K mens ring sitting on top of the sand. My F70 in discrimination mode would not pick it up sitting on top of the sand. In AT mode and ground balanced to the black sand it would pick it up but as soon as the coil went past the edge of the bucket the response would go positive in air due to the amount of magnetite in the black sand. However when the ring was pushed about 3" into the sand the F70 would no longer see the ring. The SST when ground balanced to the sand would ready down to 5" and probably further but i didn't try.

This detector could be used for coin hunting but it would get tiresome after a while (at least for me) listening to everything. In relic hunting, plowed fields or the beach I think it will hold its own with just about any detector that I have seem on the market. For the current $600 price I don't think anything can touch it. My new F75 SE will arrive next week so I'll take it with me to try it out on the black sand and see how it performs.

Alan

So maybe White's and Fisher and Tek will all have new flagships coming soon to a store near you!

LowBoy

TAKE A LITTLE TIME KICKBACK AND WATCH SOME OF MY DETECTING VIDEO'S BELOW ON YouTube

[www.youtube.com]

If you don’t dig it, then how are you going to know what you’re missing!
How can you have your pudding if you don’t eat your meat!

hey! lowboy!
glad to know you are in fighting shape again!
i believe all of us said a prayer,or two for ya!
thanks again for contributing.

(h.h.!)
j.t.

Alan in East Bay Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Keith:
>
> The SST runs silent (no threshold) in all metal
> mode with M6 tones.It is not dual mode (like the
> Nautius or Mixed mode like the XLT) it is
> all-metal motioin with a pin-point on trigger
> pull. The audio intelligibility is excellent. The
> tones are clear and not muddy like some I've
> heard. If the sensitivity is turned way up you get
> the occasional crackling and falsing although not
> near as much as the F70 I had with me.
>
> The dealer has a board set up with 6 or 7









> different coins on it spaced about 3" apart. Even
> at a very fast sweep each coin was picked up
> individually. I was pretty amazed with the fast
> response of both the targets and the tones being
> processed that quickly.
>
> He had a plastic bucket of black sand from a beach
> near Half Moon Bay. There was a large 14K mens
> ring sitting on top of the sand. My F70 in
> discrimination mode would not pick it up sitting
> on top of the sand. In AT mode and ground balanced
> to the black sand it would pick it up but as soon
> as the coil went past the edge of the bucket the
> response would go positive in air due to the
> amount of magnetite in the black sand. However
> when the ring was pushed about 3" into the sand
> the F70 would no longer see the ring. The SST when
> ground balanced to the sand would ready down to 5"
> and probably further but i didn't try.
>
> This detector could be used for coin hunting but
> it would get tiresome after a while (at least for
> me) listening to everything. In relic hunting,
> plowed fields or the beach I think it will hold
> its own with just about any detector that I have
> seem on the market. For the current $600 price I
> don't think anything can touch it. My new F75 SE
> will arrive next week so I'll take it with me to
> try it out on the black sand and see how it
> performs.
>
> Alan


me too! believe it would be a terrific "plowed field hunter"
as targets are generally more scattered,but for coin shooting,
there are better options.

But could you not use this machine in the same way you could use the Deeptechs? (As in for hunted out spots with little non ferrous targets.) The price seems similar but this has multiple tones and VID...

Albert

Albert, I am sure you could. You are talking about the kind of hunting done here in europe right? That is what I would use it for.

This machine seems to have potential. I really liked my M6.

Pulled this off another forum.

" I just got a Sierra Super Trac and can tell you it is a remarkable machine for the money. Here are the facts: Has the depth of an MXT, the ultra fast tracking system of the GMT, and the seven tone audio ID of the M6. A silent search machine, it operates in the all metal mode (thus awesome depth) using seven tone audio tone id and vdi meter readout (VDI numbers, bars, icons) . The audio tone id is remarkably accurate, deeper, cleaner, and far less "muddled" as some other machines. With modulated audio the size or depth of the target is audibly discerned, and then add to that is the tone and visual id. Thus, a faint but high-pitched signal might be small silver or copper, a loud grunt is large iron, etc. Jimmy designed this for use where speed, depth, and sensitivity are important. As for nugget hunting, yes, it does find small gold, just not quite as small as the GMT. Handles bad ground exceptionally well. YES, at a site that is "wall to wall" trash, patience is required. A really top-notch machine. HH Jim



Oh yeah, operates at 15 khz and uses all the same coils as the MXT/DFX, etc. The stock coil for it is the 10x6 DD. Thus really sensitive to small targets and really good target separation."

excellent feedback.in your opinion,do you believe it separates targets better than
mxt/m6 in high trash?.being in "all metal" you will have to possess the "patience"
of job to use it in trash laden parks,but i suppose it could be done.

(h.h!)
j.t.

Interesting. This machine sounds like it comes setup the way I would program a V3i to run...all metal mode for depth in bad ground, set the recovery speed a tick fast, with the bonus of tones. This worked remarkably well on the V3i in bad ground....the faster recovery speed lets you hear the fast double blip of a nail when you hit them. Often times in bad ground, a non ferrous target will begin to read as iron/ferrous beyond a certain depth. The hotter the ground is, the less depth it takes for this to occur...so what you have a lot of times, is non ferrous targets responding just like they are iron. A fast recovery lets you hear the double blip of the nails easier...so that eliminates you digging a bunch of nails but still being able to dig the non ferrous objects because they wont double blip.

Most places I have the CTX set to hear it all. If the tones ar good you don't need discrimination. The reason this detector has my interest over the Vista Gold is because of the addition of more tones. Where it falls short is being able to customize point breaks or change the frequencies. But picking out silver should be easy.

Jace - not talking just about Euro hunting, but those hunted out dig it all spots (which now with the tones this new machine seems more attractive than the Deeptechs, speaking pretty superficially.) i mean is this machine potentially like a Deeptech with depth? I'd like to see more tests but wouldn't be shocked since ts running in AM.

Goodmore - I think that deep Nickel test was done with the relatively small stock coil. Getting a bigger coil on this machine might put it past the Deeptechs, at least in cleaner ground, say for deep silver.

Albert

Seem's like a nice machine for sure ...But its not running in all metal mode.It's running in an all metal accept disc mode....

The tones are locked also.....

Not sure why for intended purpose of DIG IT ALL it is not variable tone break in an expaned iron range..

I dont like machines deciding where to break tones when I am looking for RELICS/ARTIFACT'S..

Seems more like an M6 with disc control locked at zero...

Keith

Oh Well



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/03/2013 12:01AM by Pac man.

Keith:

The SST is Motion-All Metal with tones. No discrimination at all unless you ground balance to iron. If that is done it sacrifices depth.

Alan

yeah! ok! but again,you gotta be super patient and analyze every ''audio" hit
in the junk,which can get "old" very fast.in a cleaner area,it would be terrific,i'm sure!

(h.h.!)
j.t.

Alan in East Bay Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Keith:
>
> The SST is Motion-All Metal with tones. No
> discrimination at all unless you ground balance to
> iron. If that is done it sacrifices depth.
>
> Alan

Appears to be confusion on this. From what I am seeing the SST is running in discrimination mode with all items set to accept. In other words, same as M6 with disc knob set to zero. This IS NOT the same as running in a true all metal mode. A mixed mode with true all metal running with disc tones layered on top, a "Mixed Mode", would be my preference.

Basically sounds like an M6 with ground tracking, disc knob locked preset at zero and an elliptical coil. But I have not had one in my hands so I am not swearing 100% to this.

I wish manufacturers would quit referring to zero discrimination as being all metal. Two completely different things and I think it is misleading. Not purposefully, but I am learning to be very careful as this is a perfect example of a machine being said to have an all metal mode that does not. Do we need new terms? Filtered all metal versus un-filtered all metal? The AT Pro and AT Gold had similar confusion going on.

Steve Herschbach

Steve:

When I tested the unit the dealer told me it was motion all-metal. No discrimiation. That also is what the performance told me.

The ad on the CA Whites webpage states:

"My Super Trac operates in an All Metal / Silent Search mode with Audio and Visual Discrimination. In this way you will Hear Every Target within the range of the detector and YOU will decide what to DIG.

First by the Audio Tone & Then the Visual ID Number

I tested this circuitry in England for two years and just had to haveit built for me.

The ST is mounted with the easy popular 6 by 9 inch Eclipse Oval Search Coil for extra ground mineral control and target separation. There is no learning curve, you will be finding at once."
- Jimmy Sierra"

If you can spoof your domain to a CA, AZ, UT or NV server here is the link:

[ca.whiteselectronics.com]

There is a short video clip with a little more information that what the display graphic states at the site.

It has to be all metal disc accept...tones work through disc not a TRUE ALL METAL mode...

Whites is saying its all metal motion and in theroy it is bu its channeled all metal..

A true all metal mode can not I.d. it does no phase comparison.

And yes if you balance to iron it will become lifeless.

Thanks for the info Alan..

Keith

Hmmm Keith, I wonder if Whites got creative with something? How do we explain the insane depth? (Though the Vistas are getting it in disc mode as well.)

I might be wrong, but doesn't the Omega have an "all metal mode" with VID? (but only single tones). Is that also not a true AM mode?

Albert

Like I said Alan, people do not understand the differences and are getting confused. I repeat, setting a discrimination system to accept all metal IS NOT the same as a true unfiltered all metal mode. I am with Keith on this.

Steve Herschbach

"True all metal" is "NON motion"

it has been stated here several times that this unit is a "Motion all metal mode" detector and therefore - not a true all metal non motion mode machine which means it's operating in Disc mode at "0"

the same as an AT Pro in "Pro mode all metal" - it's a "disc" mode

as Keith said

there's no way for a machine to give variable audio tones in "True all metal NON motion"

it's the same thing as "auto tune" if any of you have ever used a CZ ---- CZ's have Disc mode all metal (when set at 0 disc.) AND True all metal NON motion mode when switched to "auto tune"

GTI 2500's have True all metal non motion
CXIII's have it
CZ's have it
Gold Bugs have it
Tesoro Tejon's have it
etc.
etc.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 04/05/2013 09:32PM by MichiganRelicHunter.