Xp Deus hunt ( some commentary) Added another hunt same site again with commentary

Took the Xp Deus back to what I call my testing grounds site--- a site I've got a bunch of hours in with Deus,,and other detectors.

Today,,ran the 9" coil.

To describe this site,,very old,,,nearest light wires about 650 yards,,nearest house about 800 yards away.

So EMI influence is definitely less likely,, or at the very least to maybe stay more consistent.

The ground at this site,,4 bars on F75.

This particualr patch is a part of a bigger field of 17 acres,,,and like I said I have busted this patch countless times.

Today ground conditions wet,,but generally not as wet vs in the winter time when I hunt it.

Now me posting this info and comments-- not meant to upset anyone,,drive them to a Deus,, or away from Deus,,,I do like both of my units.

You will notice the pic,,,the nonferrous targets are on the left ( checked with magnet),, and a few ferrous targets on the right.

Now,,I have hunted this site many times using full tones, O disc using both 9" coil and 11" coil previously,,,18khz,,reactivity 2 and 3 silencer -1.
And doing such pulled some targets each time.

And also hunted the site at disc level 6 3 tones countless times.

Today,,I tried something different,,,full tones,,disc 2.5, 18khz,,sens 95, hunted a little with reactivity at 3,, and went to 2--- silencer setting always at -1.
Ground balance a couple points above ground reading.
Most finds today came with reactivity at level 2.

First thing I will say,,,Deus sees more nonferrous targets than one might think

What do I mean by this???

Many of the targets today,,provided tone more closely associated with iron wrap signals vs the high tone cleaner hits.

Many times after I would get tone ( signal breaking the disc) and sounding off,,,many resweeps and coil position performed--- and many times a very questionable tone would be heard.

A consistent tone,,can be somewhat broken ( at times),, but not the iron grunt signal,,and not the smooth higher pitch crawling in the headphones.

Something else I see as a pattern here too.

Deus acts as such tone wise,, it seems moreso with not round targets,,,Deus even seems to struggle with out a round targets even when in the plug when swept with coil with just a short distance separating them.

It seems like maybe using reactivity 2 ( and remember you do get some extra depth vs using level 3),, it seems maybe using reactivity 2 is allowing the coil to maybe saturate a bit more in the iron,,,,yet still even allow some signals to get through--- but tone is trying it seems to move more to the iron side of things ( not quite).

Sometimes on a good nonferrous target,,,I would get this ( closer to iron sounding tone),, but with exacting coil position the signal would clean up-- but not always.

I didn't change any settings when over any targets--- but trust me,,I have hunted this patch very methodically in the past countless times.

And one reason I did (do) this is to keep as many variables ( EMI/ soil wise) out of the equation,,,so maybe I can nail down better what makes this detector tick.

Now,,a person will no doubt dig some iron as I did,,but considering the condition of this site ( nails and iron wise),, I feel my results were very good,,,and what I was able to find today-- even surprised me.

Meter readings btw,,in case anyone is interesting,,,was all over,,but will say some of the nonferrous targets even meter wise reacted like iron wrap signals can.

The sound (tone) a lot of the targets provided-- very hard to put in words.

For anyone hunting say an old site--one may be surprised how long it may take them to deplete the site of nonferrous material.

I did witness some good depth today on a few targets as well with the 9" coil.






Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 06/06/2016 01:38AM by tnsharpshooter.

This is a most interesting and intelligent post. Unwrapping the iron wrap. Would understand it better with some time on a Deus for sure, but the concept is fascinating. Hope you will post more on this.

Some additional comments,,
A few IFs,,

If the new smaller coil performs better in iron--- has better separation and keeps the 9" coil depth,,I will be satisfied.

IMO,,if Xp would consider the following,,

Could they alter programming-- say for hunting relics,,,,could they give the user a choice of format ( programming),,, where a person could hunt a site with the ( likes round better),,and then change programs where the detector favors ( out a round better),,, novel idea or what!!!

Or at the very least offer 2 different versions one for each of the above-- a person could download whichever one tickles their fancy.

The Deus with it current programming,,,a person just by tone and how the detector responds-- can tell many times when they are about to pull a not so round target or a target with jagged or uneven edges.

Also would like them,,,if they do improve the TID at depth capability,,,,to give the user a way to select the way the detector currently works ID wise.

Maybe I'm wishing for too much.

Still though,, I think there is quite a bit that can be done with Deus-- even using current coils.

it would be interesting to know just how close to data storage/operating limits version 3.2 has put the detector....How much space is left??

And last,, I wonder if they are developing another platform (not Deus coil)???

I may be wrong here by saying,,,but IMO Deus with version 3.2 is probably overall a better performer in the USA vs Europe--- with Europe's cut coins and such.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 06/05/2016 03:03AM by tnsharpshooter.

And yet, a lot of that you are already doing with your own ears and by the look of the post, going further. Unwrapping and target masking are two intertwined aspects of the same thing, and of particular interest. The idea is to avoid one and undo the other to the greatest extent possible. Even a slight advantage opens new ground. Of course you know all this.

Slag Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> And yet, a lot of that you are already doing with
> your own ears and by the look of the post, going
> further. Unwrapping and target masking are two
> intertwined aspects of the same thing, and of
> particular interest. The idea is to avoid one and
> undo the other to the greatest extent possible.
> Even a slight advantage opens new ground. Of
> course you know all this.


Unfortunately I don't know all the answers,,or as much as I would like.

I can say,,I have always wondered why Xp stayed away from elliptical coil design--- some thought it was the internal battery that was the show stopper.

And I wonder why Minelab has even done the same,, granted the joint effort 5x10 coil for the CTX is an exception.

But still seems most other manufacturers went the elliptical coil design for stock sized coils,,,,White's, Minelab, and Xp haven't-- there may be more,,I'm not entirely familiar with all.

It may have something to do with coil's surface area over ground,,,less footprint for ground minerals.

Maybe one of the whiz kids here,,,will do some math--- and show the actual coil area differences say between a 7x11" vs a 9" round and a 11" round.

I know there are tradeoffs-- and getting one stock coil to perform decent in lower and higher mineral ground,, seems to be the goal,, it would seem.

The word is the new coil is 6x9" that is coming with version 4.

Could we see a 7x11" coil for Deus in the future-- running the original freqs,,to lessen the overall weight,,and maybe improve separation over current 11" round coil???



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/05/2016 03:35AM by tnsharpshooter.

It is not exactly about the area. It is about how the coil behaves electronically, Elliptical is lighter and easier to swing so more popular, especially as the coil gets large. Round is the better configuration for performance. Saw a thread one time someplace where engineers were talking about making coils. Elliptical is a compromise and round will always perform better for a given size they said. The new coils get around some of that with advanced design strategies, but for a given size round is superior when performance is the only concern..

Another hunt same site..

Settings reactivity 2, silencer -1, 95 sens tx power 2, full tones disc at 2.5, 9" coil. Ran ground balance pretty close to ground reading to maybe a couple points above.

Folks most of these targets were not near clean hits--- just listening most I would have thought ( a few days ago) were in fact nails/ iron being rejected.

All I can say,,,with the settings above,,if the Deus gives tone,,,,watch out,,and if it is not good sounding,,,better give some more attention,,with coil sweeps,,different speeds, and coil position,,and after doing all this--- the signal still may not come to life.

A repeatable signal,,can be broken,,no grunting,,even with broken tone,,,tone seems to be more gradual on each side when sweeping.

So in a nutshell I lowered my threshold for digging (what I thought was a good target) from previous hunt.

Now the soil adjacent to this nail/ iron rich site-- measures half scale on Deus to 1 or 2 dots above mineralization wise.

And I think it is either targets that are masked,,and or all the iron flakes/dust-- that is making the Deus tone not so apparent on good nonferrous finds-- not actually mineral,,,why do I say this ??? one of the headstamps I found out adjacent to this particular spot,,,it was Garrett pinpointer deep and rang up like a big dog.

And notice how much iron I dug,,it is in upper right of pic,,,and one nail came out of hole with one button.

Btw the rod looking thing,,was straight down in the ground.

Folks who have old sites,,and have discovered low conductors like $1 gold coin-- that little coin may indeed sound off on Deus,,and a person might not even know what they heard.

To put things into perspective here-- this area measures approx 100 ft by 100 ft.
Have hunted multiple times with Deus version 2.0 9" coil. Using reactivity 2,3 and 4.
Have hunted this site with Deus version 3.2 with both 9 and 11" coils a combined 20 times running disc level 6 three tones using reactivity 2,3 and q little at 4.
Have hunted this site with Deus version 3.2 with both 9" and 11" coils using full tones 0 disc 5 times each with each coil size with reactivity at 2 and 3.
Have hunted the site only twice with Disc at 2.5 with full tones with finds posted.
All hunts were using 18khz at this spot.

And have hunted with etrac multiple times with 10x12 sef coil, 6x8 sef coils-- in a dig all nonferrous mode.
Have hunted numerous times with CTX with stock coil using combined mode-- again operating in a dig all nonferrous mode.





Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 06/06/2016 02:06AM by tnsharpshooter.

I am watching this post with interest. I buried a dime and some Minie balls at fringe depths and have been experimenting with different settings. One noteworthy item: My XP Deus is only giving an iron grunt on the 10 inch dime. My settings are 4 tone (first two tones are set at 202 (tone setting), the third tone is set at 550, and 4th tone is set at 800.
I am running zero disc. 99 sensitivity. Silencer at -1. Frequency is at 12 kHz, Reactivity is set at 1. It easily slams a 9.5 inch bullet. But the 10 inch dime is merely giving an iron grunt. I'll continue to try different settings and frequencies until success is achieved .........or not. Anyway, this is a good thread.

Just so everyone understands-- I am far from being a grand master with a Deus.

But here is really I think the bottom line.

Full tones 0 disc,,will no doubt allow a person to make some finds-- I have.

But when you are running O disc,,all targets get lit up.

When you run say 2.5 disc using full tones--- the items that do provide tone,,,,this allows a person to zero in(( study a target)). Can't do this with running 0 disc near as well.

I do know running disc 6 say with 2 or 3 tone-- you are going to leave some finds in the ground. And chances are the tone and indications you MAY see, not all,,,but is when the tone is broken and the horseshoe is switching sides--- most newbies,,including myself think iron or nail target,,,NOT true all the time.

And most folks when they get their Deus,,and they think they have a handle on iron wrap signals,,,and watching the meter run in the 90s with broken tones--- again I'm finding some of these are in fact nonferrous targets.

A person can use their pinpoint function-- it will help at times,,at least part of the time it will give you confidence you are about to dig a small target instead of a big pice of relic iron.
But a person has to be careful,,,using pinpoint on a target surrounded by ferrous-- can lead one down the wrong path.

I should say,,,so far my experiences with 11" coil,,,a person might not get away with running say a 2.5 disc using full tones-- may have to go to say 3,,, a person can get some ground feedback using 11" coil running reactivity levels 0,1 and 2,,, reactivity 3 though seems to perform pretty good with disc level 2.5.

Ground mineral levels here could play a part-- so your mileage may vary with what I've said here about this.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/06/2016 02:24AM by tnsharpshooter.

Kevin with your first two tones being 202 and zero disc 4 tones...Try two tone and say 4 disc and scan the dime...off set your ground bal negative too about 5 points..

if you haven't adjusted your tone breaks that means everything up to a I.D. of 60 is grunting using your 4 tones...

Keith

“I don't care that they stole my idea . . I care that they don't have any of their own”
-Nikola Tesla



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/06/2016 02:41AM by Keith Southern.

Kevin B Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I am watching this post with interest. I buried a
> dime and some Minie balls at fringe depths and
> have been experimenting with different settings.
> One noteworthy item: My XP Deus is only giving an
> iron grunt on the 10 inch dime. My settings are 4
> tone (first two tones are set at 202 (tone
> setting), the third tone is set at 550, and 4th
> tone is set at 800.
> I am running zero disc. 99 sensitivity.
> Silencer at -1. Frequency is at 12 kHz,
> Reactivity is set at 1. It easily slams a 9.5
> inch bullet. But the 10 inch dime is merely giving
> an iron grunt. I'll continue to try different
> settings and frequencies until success is achieved
> .........or not. Anyway, this is a good thread.


Kevin,
I have a 10" nickel in my test garden,,granted it is not a dime,,,but if I run full tones 0 disc,,I can hear the nickel,,,but if I raise my disc to 2 or 3,, the higher tone provided on nickel is slightly higher than running 0 disc.

Sounds strange right???
Try this on your dime,,,and don't forget about 18 kHz either,,might surprise you.

The highest I have ever really ran my Deus sensitivity wise is 95.
My units to me sound a bit wishy washy at 99 sensitivity.

And Kevin,,are you sure it is an iron grunt you are getting???

Try this with your buried dime,,compare signals on a small nail buried at say 7".

I'll bet they make different noises tone wise,,,listen close.

This is what I'm relaying here in this thread---- good targets don't provided as apparent tone at times,,,can sound awfully close to nail reject and or weak iron wrap signal.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/06/2016 03:23AM by tnsharpshooter.

I sincerely appreciate the feedback Keith and Tennesseesharpshooter. I will definitely try your suggestions. I have kept this machine longer than I have kept any other (mainly because of limited economic means) so I am trying to find the very outer limits of it's ability.
Having said that, I have used (with great success) the Full Tone function with little to no Disc in very naily areas and can testify with some conviction of it's ability to find the high(er) toned targets amongst a dense carpet of square nails.
And now, I have made a test garden of several targets that are what I call 'fringe of detection' targets......although I didn't coin that term myself. Anyway, this is some fun stuff. And profitable (historically speaking). Again, I appreciate the feedback. It seems that the older I get, the less I realize that I actually know. Ironic ain't it? I thought that wisdom came with age, But the opposite seems to be apparent. LOL Have a great week and happy detecting!!!!! Kevin

I havent been using my Xp much because been testing the R2 and havent been able to get out as much as would like. I know what ur talking about the broken tones and how the XP will tell u that its a good signal even tho its a broken tone or junk type tone. I love those type signals cause usually is something good. Anyways i spend most of my time using the 9” in nail beds in the old Nv ghost towns. In my opinion id have to say Reactivity 2 silencer minus 1 12 khz or 18 khz is definitely the Xp’s sweet spot. I myself prefer 12 khz only cause in 18 khz i find myself digging extremely small stuff all the time. 12 is not as sensitive to all the little tiny stuff. great thread i love trying to unlock coins in relics in the iron.