Racer 2 comments and a few other detector comparisons

I have not hunted much with my Racer 2 detector,,,been to happily busy with my Nokta Relic detector.

So today,,after picking 4 more gallons of the blackberries,,I decided to do some test with the Racer 2,,, to get a better handle on it.
Most of these test I've done with many of my other detectors.

To begin with the screens on the Racers' are all great,,and layed out nicely.
The one switch to make settings changes is very good,,a person can move around very fast using it.

I bought a basic Racer 2 package,,,so I put the smaller coil off of my Racer 1 on this detector-- as some know there is a slight difference in overall size.

I began doing some test to see how both the tone break and notch filter would work,,to help me hunt in some places.

I used a dime and a lot of tabs,,,doing some same plane testing.

My test bed was actually a clean(no iron) set of conrete steps.

My testing revealed,,,in 2 tone first,,,when a higher conductive coin and a colocated tab are swept,,,average ID is given,,,so the tone break is key to get the detector to give one hints of what the conductivity value is of the highest conductor.

What does this mean exactly,,,,for example many square tabs have an ID on the racer 2 of approx 33,,, so one can run their tone break up to 35 and get rid of square tabs,,,and a colocated square tab and a dime,,,a high tone will be given on the dime,,,what if you add more tabs around the dime??? Again an average TID is provided and if tone break is not set to get rid of the tab,,,one will not know the possible conducitivy of a sitting colocated higher conductor.

Notch filter if used seems to provide same results,,but a person can specifically notch out say 32,33,34.

But one must remember,,if the tone break is set too high,,this average TID will be included in section with notch filter or tone break applied-- hence you won't hear your good target colocated with junk target.

Also, I noticed,,even if say a person uses a nickel for testing,,and they come in at 30/31 on Racer 2,,,if a person runs their tone break up to 34,, the nickel when swept will go bye bye,,but if you start raising your coil and sweep,,at some point you'll get tone.
If you up the ante and raise tone break to 40,, again nickel is gone tonally,,but as you sweep and keep raising your coil,,a small layer of height will provide tone.
Setting of 50,, the same thing,,but with even a more shallow layer of tonal detection.
Setting of 60,, no nickel detection with all coil heights.

So it seems own would think,,,even with nickels notched out,,either by using tone break,,or notch filter,,deeper nickels still possible to provide tone.
I haven't done any in ground test to confirm.
And a person could assume ground minerals could accelerate this what seems Up averaging process (( like what happens using Xp Deus)).

The small coil did well with same plane testing using the higher and lower conductors,,,I even played with zincolns and a quarter.

I then proceeded to do some 3D testing with tab(s) above clad dime.
The small coil did poorly here.

So next I put the stock coil on ( for the first time actually),, and repeated the above test.

It overall performed very well.

Same plane testing as above,,,a slightly higher above junk target tone break or notch filter could be used,,,and good tone acquired on high conductive coin.

3D test using tab(s) above dime,,,again stock coil performed well.
Actually here in my opinion,,,Racer 2 bested Deus with 9" coil,,,as far as comparing to Deus with 11" coil-- very close.
Also should note,,,Deus users should be paying attention here....Based on my test today,,Deus users hunting sites loaded with modern trash looking for higher conductive coins using. Notch,,IMO reactivity 2 is the way to go,,,reactvity 3 fell short here-- and remember here I'm not talking about nails or iron, rather modern trash. Deus with 11" coil,,in this scenario reactvity 3 setting is very workable,, but again I feel reactvity level 2 overall better choice.

I did some testing with small coil only using some coins and nails,,,right now my best guess based on the testing is to use tone break setting of 9 or 10 when going after all the nonferrous in a site riddled with iron and nails.

3 tone
I ran some test with it,,one thing a person will notice,,it is very possible just by listening to the tone provided(I call it the goose tone)-- user likely to be able to tell if a higher and a lower conductor are under the coil
This could however also be a nonferrous target and iron under the coil.
And tone break here can help,,but remember the detector provides average TID for multiple nonferrous,,and hence tone reported could mislead a person thinking lower conductor only.

But for stand alone targets 3tone can differentiate lower and higher conductors.

A user may elect to run say 3 tone coin hunting,,and when they do get the tone (goose tone) could in fact toggle to 2 tone with a predetermine tone break assigned and further be able to get some great clues to the targets unde the coil.

This detector is not hard to run,,in modern sites where folks like to seek clad and maybe recent drops of silver jewelry,,,this detector top rated in my book,,based on my testing.
And I don't say this to be disparaging to the detector,,what I mean here is a person can leave the zincolns and get the dimes and quarters very easily.
And the ease by which a person can toggle around between 2 and 3 tone,,each with different settings--- tremendous asset in the field.

Now a little depth test.
My 10" nickel,,been buried know for over a year.
Stock coil attached Groundgrab GB at 58, 2 bars showing,,O disc, Used both 2 tone and 3 tone various gain settings-- 2 tone would provide a chirp every now and then -- coil trailing off the coin. Tried Deep mode-- no help.
Tried manipulating GB- no help.
Tri d all channels no help.

Same target,,White's MX Sport stock coil,,coin and jewelry mode-shaky signal,,sweep speed coil position sensivitve,,,relic mode- very dig gable signal as far denoting nonferrous, TID awful high 90s..

Deus 11" coil disc 3.5 full tones,,good signal very smooth,,all freqs except 4khz ,,provided a chipped signal
Desu 11" coil disc 6.0 3 tones,,signal a lot less reliable vs 3.5 disc full tones.
Deus 9" coil did 2.5 full tones,,good signal very dig table
Deus of course no accurate TID reported awful too.

Don't have a DST F75 anymore,,but whenI did test this particular buried target with it,,,Bp mode only a trailing signal,,erratic when swept.

Blisstool V6 small 7x9"coil. Disc depth at 10 disc at 10, gain at 1,,and I think even a slightly more positive than actual Ground setting ground balance wise--good smooth signal

Overall I like the Racer 2,,,some very good features,,will allow folks to hunt both sites with iron and modern trash.
Good for the loot paid.

Cheers



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 06/30/2016 03:20AM by tnsharpshooter.

I mostly detect ghost towns, demos, and older iron infested relic sites in California and I have yet to make a good find in the 30's on the R2. It's mostly been 22 shells, small bits of camp lead, and small caliber bullets which isn't what I'm looking for.

Some folk here in the UK were saying that small silver like half and quarter cut hammered coins fall as low as 15, i found large hammered silver in the low 50's and the highest silver in the low 70's for milled victorian three and sixpence coinage, so if i didn't dig everything above say iron nails i could have been missing out! Very high 90's felt like it was back around to the start of iron again.
The TID is maybe more useful and accurate for quarters and dimes in parks but thats just not my game.

tnsharpshooter, I found your post above a bit confusing. You made a number of statements along the line of targets below the tone break not being heard. Are you sure you don't mean below the ID Filter? The tone break should only change the tone of the target low to mid, mid to high etc. Please explain your use of tone break vrs ID Filter.
Thanks
Tom

Tom Slick Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> tnsharpshooter, I found your post above a bit
> confusing. You made a number of statements along
> the line of targets below the tone break not being
> heard. Are you sure you don't mean below the ID
> Filter? The tone break should only change the tone
> of the target low to mid, mid to high etc. Please
> explain your use of tone break vrs ID Filter.
> Thanks
> Tom


Maybe I was not as clear as I could have been.

In 2 tone,,the tone brreak will silence a target is the tone break is set high enough,,example nickels read 30,, so if you run tone break to 33 nickels are gone,,as long as iron audio is set to
0.

3 tone if you move your fe tone break over the nickel TID,,same thing,, no tone as long as iron audio set to zero.

ID filter obviously only blocks what you have selected Vdi wise,,,but with colocated nonferrous targets,,,averaging still takes place.

And this averaging is based in the conductivity of multiple targets under the coil-- size it seems play a part too.

Meaning on paper a person could use a higher tone break say in 2tone to pick quarters out of zincolns,,,but would need a lower tone break setting to pull quarters out of tabs.

The ID would show average,,but tone if tone break is set correctly,,,the tone will flush out the higher conductive targets colocated say with junk lower conductors like tabs.

Now this obviously would be better suited for cherry picking ops.

Some scenarios,,to show what the Racer 2 can do that for example the F75 is likely not to do,,on higher conductors collocated with lower conductors..

First and foremost let's say for example your town has an annual county fair,,,and when it's over you want to hunt with Racer 2.

Your mission is to look for higher conductive coins and silver jewelry,,,,lots of lower conductors in the site.
So a person could use 2 tone and hunt,,set tone break to 65 and roll on,,digging all high tones.
Will this get all the higher conductors ???
Probably not,,the colocated higher conductors with lower conductors will be missed.

So what to do,,,well if a person just dials down their tone break using 2 tone and tried to hunt,,,,this won't flush out the colocated targets,,,,meaning a person would hear possible colocated targets,,,and also stand alone targets reading above tone break setting...

So what to do???

Go to 3 tone and set your higher tone break to 65 and hunt,,,but listen for the goose tone I call it,,,,this will identify possible higher conductors colocated with lower conductors,,and possibly iron.

Even with this goose tone I call it,,you still get a meter reading,,just average reading though.

Now the Racer is capable of doing this moreso on close quartered targets of mixed conductivity-- recovery and how fast it transition tone,,,F75 in these instances less likely to tell a person there is a colocated situation based solely on tone---- it's tone not near as fast at reporting the mixed conducitivy.....

A lot of folks hunt modern sites too,,more than some think,,and yes good silver jewelry can be pulled along with the higher conductive coins be it clad or silver.



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 06/30/2016 08:16PM by tnsharpshooter.

tnss - Thanks for the response to my question. Now I understand how you're using your terminology. For a minute there, I thought you were using a different Racer 2 than I.

TNSS the goose audio tone really works at identifying high tone conductors being masked by low tone and medium tone conductors. There are more silver coins out there that are masked than silver coins that are not masked. Most every site has been cherry picked. I'm going to use the Racer 2 to find those masked silver coins. Hide and watch me! LOL Like you, I have been testing different settings in each of the modes to see which one works best alone or in conjunction with the other modes. Also I'm finding that the audio tones trump the VDI numbers at depth. Which is alright with me because I prefer audio tones since I was weened on single audio tone Tesoro detectors.

tabman

tabman Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> TNSS the goose audio tone really works at
> identifying high tone conductors being masked by
> low tone and medium tone conductors. There are
> more silver coins out there that are masked than
> silver coins that are not masked. Most every site
> has been cherry picked. I'm going to use the
> Racer 2 to find those masked silver coins. Hide
> and watch me! LOL Like you, I have been testing
> different settings in each of the modes to see
> which one works best alone or in conjunction with
> the other modes. Also I'm finding that the audio
> tones trump the VDI numbers at depth. Which is
> alright with me because I prefer audio tones since
> I was weened on single audio tone Tesoro
> detectors.
>
> tabman

The goose sounding tone,,when the coil comes over items of mixed conductivity-- this could be perceived as a weakness,,,but at the same time can also be perceived as a strength.
Strange sounding,,but these are my thoughts.

When I test and use testers,,I am always looking and sometimes thinking sorta backwards,,in what the detector could possible tell me-- depending on the possible or actual detecting scenario that may take place on any one target.

Tabman, I look forward to any thing you can shed with your ur Racer as your u continue to use it.

Iron mixed with nonferrous gets a great deal of talk,,,other nonferrous masking out worthy nonferrous,,not so much.

After doing my test with Deus,,,,I have found some old coins in a site with modern trash,,,,and have been thinking about these for a while now,,,,my Deus testing as of late I can definitely now see the why behind my coin discoveries in this one particular site,,,,and many Minelabs and old Fishers had pounded this spot as well.