Gold recovery seems to be a hot topic

Those of you that are relying on Target ID, Notch, or tones to guide you to golden treasure are just fooling yourselves. Sure...there are ranges in the conductivity scale that is home to gold jewelry...But it is also where junk aluminum also resides. I have dug up several gold rings with my Tesoro Tiger Shark and that was any where from the towel line to neck deep water, I'm too old to risk water hunting now. I run my disc. at nail rejection and dug the beeps, that is the reason for my success in water hunting at popular swim beaches. The junk aluminum rate compared to the gold rate was astounding with buckets full of pulltabs. but with a learned technique with a long handled sand scoop it easier than digging turf...sort of. I was talking to a seasoned water hunter and he said that in his area that the lakes are so cleaned out that you won't find a pulltab... anther reason I sold my Tiger. I also found silver jewelry plus some 'nitro' rings, I have a zip lock bag full of those...LOL

On land, gold jewelry comes up very sporadic and is always a welcome surprise as I'm hunting for anything above an iron nail. I hunt turn of the century homes in town with a hand trowel and in the country where I can use a relic shovel as my discrimination. I usually hunt with one of my non metered Tesoros in the country around old torn down school houses, churches, picnic groves and similar sites because I can freely dig there. A metered machine tells you the general conductivity of a buried target, but you won't know what it is until you dig it up. I pick my sites carefully so that I'm not digging too much modern aluminum junk, but nowdays that stuff is everywhere. So if you want to believe your metered detector and walk past what you determine is junk, then watch in horror as a kid with a cheap detector digs a honking good find, well more power to ya

Well said sir!
My first machine had a screen that always lied to me.
Sold it and bought a Tesoro and never looked back.

TabZilla...thanks for the reply,

I do use several metered machines as I hunt some in town Victorian houses. A lot of times my permissions are good for one time only, so I do some cherry picking with my analog machines. These include my White's 6.59 kHz detectors like the IDX Pro and 5900 CB. The Tesoro TID machines are my Toltec 100 and Toltec ll. They provide important info such as conductivity, size and depth of found targets in a well maintained yard. The most important technique is target recovery with a hand trowel and drop cloth.

Hombre Wrote:
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> Those of you that are relying on Target ID, Notch,
> or tones to guide you to golden treasure are just
> fooling yourselves. Sure...there are ranges in the
> conductivity scale that is home to gold jewelry...
> But it is also where junk aluminum also resides

Hombre, good post.

As for "tones", I must add: It's easy for us md'rs to think, once we've found a gold ring, that the "mass" and "density" sounded different. So that perhaps it had a TID that was the same as an aluminum item. Yet it SOUNDED different Eg.: tone, softness, boldness, roundness, or whatever. But I believe this is just the trick of selective memory. Every time you and I go to dig an object, we're subconsciously thinking "this sounds different". And once we dig it, we forget our premonitions . But if it's gold, only THEN do we remember our premonitions and think "I knew it !!"

Example: If you ever woke up to a certain song on your radio-alarm clock, that you were JUST dreaming about, you'll think: "aha! I'm psychic". But it's just that we dream hundreds of dreams per night, none of which come true. But the minute one coincidentally comes true, we think "aha! I'm psychic" (forget the other 999 that didn't come true).

There was/is a dealer in CA (2 actually) that are telling persons that they sell machines to, that : "With practice, you can learn to tell aluminum apart from gold by sounds/tones". Yet, oddly, no one seems to ever be able to attain to it. But you have poor newbies going and beating their brains out , convinced that *they too* can some day attain to this Jedi-skill level.

I would also add: That it's no doubt true that if/when you test an aluminum object and a gold ring, that have exact same TID's readings (conductive scale), that, yes, you can probably discern a tonal sound difference. Via mass, or roundness, or thickness, etc.... Subtle differences are bound to exist between any two dis-similar items. And that might make someone think "Aha! There's a learn-able difference !"

But the devil is in the details: SO TOO is there going to be "tonal differences" between every gold ring vs another (even of the same TID). And SO TOO will there be "tonal differences" between every two aluminum objects (even of the same TID).

To which the proponents of the theory will merely say : There's exceptions and it's not perfect system. Eg. molten aluminum nuggets (from cans on campfires) will give them fits. Or small thin lead things. Or .... you name it. There will be things that mimic gold. But they'll say though that you can greatly minimize junk , through practice on the "tone system". However, if you press them for ratios that this would amount to (eg.: 1 in 50? 1 in 100 ?, etc...) you can't pin it down.

Yes there are guys (perhaps even the proponents of this tone theory) that are going to turf and getting gold rings. Perhaps better than someone "strip-mining". But I have a suspicion that a lot of that is good old fashioned notching, and simply picking better turf , where ratios are better to begin with. Eg.: upscale neighborhoods vs blighted picnic parks, etc...

Hi Tom_in_CA

[www.dankowskidetectors.com]

This article is an interesting read about identifying a target by tonal quality.

HH
Mike

Mike Hillis Wrote:
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> [www.dankowskidetectors.com]
> missed.htm
>
> This article is an interesting read about identify
> ing a target by tonal quality.


Bear in mind that targets like a USA dime and a USA penny .... can indeed be identified by "tonal quality". Why ? Because every single one of them comes off the assembly line exactly the same. Same weight, same composition, same size, etc.... Unfortunately the same can not be said for : A) gold rings, and B ) aluminum objects

Thus unfortunately, the article would not shed light on tonal qualities of gold rings vs aluminum



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/19/2017 04:13AM by Tom_in_CA.

Timely thread. Good comments. Total agreement.

Wayne

Pleasant Garden, NC
AT Max, Nokta Impact, MX Sport, Nokta FORS Relic, GPX 4800, Infinium, Racer, Deus, F75SE, Nautilus DMC II (order of acquisition, last to first)

Does an archeologist argue with a plow? A bureaucrat with a bulldozer?

Not really about finding gold specifically, but my goal was to find gold rings.. that being said, I found roughly 30 rings (most junk) the year before last digging solely on the sound of the size of the target with my Bandido II Micro in all metal. Blew my back out the following year but still managed a couple rings. Dug lots of trash.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/19/2017 12:12PM by Mike C.

Mike C Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Not really about finding gold specifically, but my
> goal was to find gold rings.. that being said, I f
> ound roughly 30 rings (most junk) the year before
> last digging solely on the sound of the size[/u
> ] of the target with my Bandido II Micro in all me
> tal. Blew my back out the following year but still
> managed a couple rings. Dug lots of trash.

Welcome to the forum Mike....

The Bandido ll µMax is a powerful treasure finding tool. The slow motion Disc. mode when set at minimum rejects an iron nail and when used in conjunction with the static All Metal mode tells a lot about the size and shape of a buried target. I think the All Metal mode is a most useful tool that is misunderstood by a lot of people. Not only does it precisely pinpoint where the target is located but also tells how deep or small an object is because the audio is modulated. Also you can tell by coil movement how big or small the object is.

Simply put gold just weighs more than most of the junk that imitates it....certainly not 100 percent but does cut down the odds.....For this reason to a trained ear many can cut down digging and increase your chances.....All comes down to the nut behind the wheel kind of knowledge of the unit being used. Tom you have raised some good points but indeed cutting down the odds is possible thru tonal interpretation but does take patience and persistence...

I just missed out on a Bandido II uMax on eBay last night. Had watched and waited 4 days for it before I bid anything. I was sitting here in my chair when it was counting down the last seconds. Was at $255 with 30 seconds to go. I bid $275 and someone's highest bid was higher...that shot it to $277. So I assumed since that was an odd number that they had probably bid $280 as their max high bid so I waited til 5 seconds to go and hit $285 but was still short and didn't have enough time to counter it. It sold for $287.77. Looks like I may have to just get an Outlaw or Vaquero since they are easier to find.

Daniel Tn Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I just missed out on a Bandido II uMax on eBay las
> t night. Had watched and waited 4 days for it bef
> ore I bid anything. I was sitting here in my chai
> r when it was counting down the last seconds. Was
> at $255 with 30 seconds to go. I bid $275 and som
> eone's highest bid was higher...that shot it to $2
> 77. So I assumed since that was an odd number tha
> t they had probably bid $280 as their max high bid
> so I waited til 5 seconds to go and hit $285 but w
> as still short and didn't have enough time to coun
> ter it. It sold for $287.77. Looks like I may ha
> ve to just get an Outlaw or Vaquero since they are
> easier to find.

Hi Daniel...
Since I started this thread, I would like to give an opinion on the Vaquero and Outlaw. I have owned both of them, the Vaquero is gone and I still own the Outlaw...the Outlaw has an important feature that the Vaquero does not have. And that feature is the static All Metal mode that lets you size up a buried object. The Vaquero has an Auto Tuned All Metal mode that is too quick acting to be a useful tool other than scouting a low target area for any signal.

...I'm hesitant to recommend the Outlaw even though I did the field test on it for Tesoro. The reason is because it has a useless RETUNE button that if used wrong can foul up the operation of the Outlaw. An experienced operator can shrink the size of the All Metal audio by detuning the signal. This is accomplished by moving the coil slightly off the target and pushing the RETUNE button and hovering back over the target. If the operator does not lift the coil and fully depress the RETUNE button before flipping the Mode toggle switch back to Disc.,,,, the motion Disc. mode is also "detuned". A big problem for someone not used to this type of pinpointing technique.

On a positive note about the Outlaw, it has a better Disc. circuit than the Bandido ll µMax. I compared the Outlaw with my collection of Bandidos and it acts like the original big box Bandido ll from 1993. The Outlaw does great in the nail beds I hunt at and pretty deep too as I found an IH penny at 9" deep in my mild Ks. soil. JMHO

I would never sell my Bandidos ..

Found me too much. especially hundred of buttons...

that's the reason its hard to find things around here anymore....I hunted All my sites with one hard 25+ years ago ....Zero disc in nails was perfect....


And if you wanted depth just flip into all-metal and reverse disc a signal that's sounds deep and round and faint..

I used to hunt South Carolina Low country alot in the mid 90s and everyone was running DMC 's and the 2B's had just came out around that time...

I could hang with them guys all day down there and at times out do them for find's to finds especially when the iron got quick and that's where the stuff was anyways..I had secret too...10.5 C coil...DEEEEEP and still separated in nails..I dug a whole epaulette down there once at 2ft a nautilus walked all over ..dug deep bullets 13 + inches civil war and before coins all deep...and the buttons was non stop....

Tesoros have a certain language on deep targets...its clicks and pops that once the all metal side is utilized for sizing and shaping the clicks or pop make since..its stuff right at the disc depth that most ignore as trash....and if it's round and soft in all metal and quite on disc you better cut the cake...

Keith

“I don't care that they stole my idea . . I care that they don't have any of their own”
-Nikola Tesla

Keith is right about the 10½"concentric coil, I use one at certain sites where the targets go deep. Most of the time though I use the smaller concentric coils because the nails are too thick. My favorites small coils that are no longer in production are the Troy Shadow X-2 Super Seven and the thick bodied white 7" coil. Been itching to try the Mojave 7" coil but will wait until they become available.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/19/2017 04:26PM by Hombre.

Quote

Welcome to the forum Mike....

The Bandido ll µMax is a powerful treasure finding tool. The slow motion Disc. mode when set at minimum rejects an iron nail and when used in conjunction with the static All Metal mode tells a lot about the size and shape of a buried target. I think the All Metal mode is a most useful tool that is misunderstood by a lot of people. Not only does it precisely pinpoint where the target is located but also tells how deep or small an object is because the audio is modulated. Also you can tell by coil movement how big or small the object is.

Sorry for the underline.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/19/2017 06:08PM by Mike C.

Hombre what about the Troy Super 9" Coil? Heard People rave about that coil for Years.

Harold,ILL. Wrote:
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> Hombre what about the Troy Super 9" Coil? Heard Pe
> ople rave about that coil for Years.

Hi Harold,ILL.

...The Troy Super Nine coil, Ah Yes, I remember us talking about this coil during our phone conversations. At least I will answer your post instead of 'big timing' you...LOL. Ya know, it took me years to find one and it has a permanent home on my Toltec 100. This combo is deadly at the old Victorian houses that I hunt at. Deep and it separates well on the Toltec 100. The meter is used to cherry pick through the trash at these old places and with less hole digging, it makes for a happy home owner. Sometimes I will give some nice coins to the home owner and will get referrals for other properties. So...in a nutshell, the Troy S9 coil is worth searching for but mine is not for sale, nice try though.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/19/2017 06:37PM by Hombre.

Though I suppose its common sense, my point was that using all metal for target sizing is a the only way to discriminate as far as small targets are concerned.

Though most people do this anyway, it still doesn't take away from the fact that using a fast re-tune in all metal mode to separate multiple targets can net good results.

Using the Bandido II if I find big aluminium in parks that I know are hunted, I switch to auto and listen for multiple targets. I've found some good stuff next to big can slaw and iron. No VDI needed.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/19/2017 06:44PM by Mike C.

But Hombre You got the Pantera which some say was the Best Gold Ring Machine ever made? Even Ole' Keith Southern prefers it as a Relic Machine to Most Oldies But goodies. Figured that would be Your go to Tesoro and not the Outlaw You and Skiwhiz feild tested.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/19/2017 10:38PM by Harold,ILL..

Harold,ILL. Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> But Hombre You got the Pantera which some say was
> the Best Gold Ring Machine ever made? Even Ole' Ke
> ith Southern prefers it as a Relic Machine to Most
> Oldies But goodies. Figured that would be Your go
> to Tesoro and not the Outlaw You and Skiwhiz feild
> tested.


It depends on what day of the week it is as far as what I'm using as my main use detector(s). The Pantera has batteries in it and along with my MX5, these two are what I'm using as of now....lol



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/19/2017 11:56PM by Hombre.