ctx 3030

hi tom!
the ctx 3030 has been out for a while.just curious
as to your "take" on it! if you have NOT used it in the field,
would still like your input on it! thanks!

(h.h.!)
j.t.

Very complex platform. Opposite of K.I.S.S. theory. Pages, pages, pages of menu's, menu's, menu's and sub-menu's. Capable unit. Appears to employ a form of a boost process when Sens is on '26' or higher. Auto +3 is a exceptionally good program; yet, can be trumped in manual Sens. whilst in competent/skilled hands. CTX will start falsing on iron whilst in higher Sens settings such as Sens 26 and above. Microprocessor/code/software appears to be faster; subsequently, much better in iron. Unit does not go into iron 'null' as often....... nor does it stay in 'null' as long. With 6" DD coil installed, the 3030 "starts" to show some abilities in carpets of nails. (This is a 'first' for Minelab..... which is a tremendous leap). Unit is in the top 10% with its abilities as to how it handles bad dirt (excluding all PI's). Unit ID is quite accurate to depth........ as long as targets are solo. In Florida inert dirt, the 3030's depth capabilities are akin to CZ, F75 SE, E-Trac/Explorer depth. Unit is not good with small relic targets. A (small variety) pistol percussion cap can be detected to 2" on the 3030........ and 6" on F75 SE. Same performance with pre-Civil War buck-n-balls. High conductor targets like silver Half Dimes.... or larger coins.... the 3030 is a very good performer. Unit is very stable and not prone to EMI. Heavy unit; yet, well balanced. Waterproof feature is proper for outdoor electronics device. Very good wet salt performer. Not a micro-jewelry unit. Low frequencies // high conductor unit. Audio presentation/communication is very good; yet, is digital processed artificial intelligence.

My experiences (thus far).
In a nut-shell.

I know you did not ask me, but I will respond with a whole different take.

I have been detecting just over 40 years now. I have used a lot of detectors, and my tastes normally run a tier short of top-of-the-line as a step down usually gets me more bang for the buck. I mostly nugget detect so lean towards powerful all metal hunting with detectors strong on low conductors. But I do like hunting coins and jewelry, both in water and out.

My take on the CTX is that I was able to pick one up, and just using stock programs with the sensitivity bumped, do extremely well. I immediately started finding silver coins and gold jewelry, in water and out, with no fuss at all. The machine can be complex, but my experience was it can also be not only pick up and go, but extremely so. I think the real strength of the unit is how well it does right out of the box. I would have no qualms putting a CTX in a novices hands, and my main advice would be do not mess with it! It is very stable, very EMI resistant, and delivers very clean results.

It may be heavy but the balance makes it feel like it is not. It is a pleasure to hold and use. The bottom line for this long time detectorist is that the CTX immediately clicked with me and has in a short time become one of my favorite detectors. I have fun with it, and there is no higher praise in my book. Finally, I do love that little 6" coil.

Steve Herschbach
DetectorProspector.com

Steve I agree w you completely as regarding the CTX. However, I think you are misinterpreting Toms post. We had brought my CTX to HEAVY nail infested relic sights that have 200yrs of history behind them. I only brought the 6" coil and didnt expect much the last time we went to this sights I brought the Etrac w 5" coil w no success, only lots of nulling from tons of big nails.
Tom placed me in the exact same spot again only w the CTX w 6" coil, that he has heavily pounded w various machines and I did manage to find a .22 cal short right next to a 4" nail, Tom was, needless to say impressed.

In another area he had me search a specific area he had previously hunted and I found a .68 musket ball and .41 cal pistol ball and a small drop of lead. I was amazed at how well it actually did work in the iron. Nulling, was not nearly as bad as the Etrac, recovery time is exceptional. Would this be my machine of choice for iron? No. I would rather take my DEUS, however I feel the CTX has one advantage in that it has a much smaller coil, which is a big plus.

Most of mine time on this machine has been spent in the water however I'm looking forward to using it in the parks and as a backup iron site machine. I strongly feel this is one of those machines that people will be learning new tricks and ect. from for years to come. There is so much info to be learned from the VDI, especially in Target Trace, it's really cool!

HH!

Aaron



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/26/2013 06:35PM by Aaron.

CTX3030 is my favorite machine to date - I'm a coin hunter. I did find it better than the E-Trac and I agree with the accounts above. I only really got rid of it because it was hard to get around with such a heavy unit that only broke down into two pieces on my bike. The balance is perfect but if you have an elbow injury or the like, you will feel the weight. I went back to the E-Trac and just finished my E-Trac mod but it is very cold right now and I'll wait a bit to try out the balance (weight is minimally lighter than the E-Trac (it is just under 4 pounds with batteries), but the balance seems great. We'll see). Anyway, back to the CTX - I may get another one depending on how my mod works. I do miss the speed of the CTX for sure. The menu, though complex is not daunting. If you just play with settings (as I do) you can move between them quickly with shortcuts. As a coin hunter it is great but one can argue on the price...

Albert

Honestly, I do not find the CTX anymore complex than the Etrac, now if your talking about the GPS, which I haven't messed with yet that's different.

Aaron Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Honestly, I do not find the CTX anymore complex
> than the Etrac, now if your talking about the GPS,
> which I haven't messed with yet that's different.

Agreed. I mean how many real settings are there to change? 4 or so? I tried the GPS but it really didn't help me and I liked to keep things simple.

Only thing I wish for is for the CTX to have the same high tones as the Etrac.

The tones would be much better then for sure. But to be honest, they should have offered a 2.5lb E-Trac that was like the CTX. It would have sold much better and made more people happier and been half the price.
Even though the balance is great, it is still 5lbs to many of us.

Agreed.
It's more noticeable to me in the water after 3-4hrs.

Ha! I have never even turned the GPS on. Seems like it would just suck up batteries, and I know where I am. I agree a non-waterproof, non-GPS CTX with less weight and a much lower price would be a killer. You know that, I know that, and Minelab sure knows that. Sales 101 - leave people wanting more.

And Aaron I did not take Tom's post as negative in any way - sounded very positive to me. My only difference was to point out how well the machine can work without really delving into the details. I think it is the real secret to Minelabs success with the FBS machines. They actually work pretty well for most anybody right out of the box, and can make novices run with the experts in pretty short order.

Steve Herschbach

I played with the GPS on mine a couple of times. I do not need it to detect, but I was pretty impressed when I loaded my hunt into the XCahnge 2 program. It was very accurate. I could even see where I turned 90 degress on a target. I plan on using it at the beach in a couple of weeks. Like I said I do not need it to detect. And I did not enjoy paying extra for it. But it is there and I will use it.

I find the recovery speed to be a great deal better than the E Trac. Those using TTF on the E Trac still have no idea what they are missing in the iron. Plus as I have mentioned on here a few times I find the ability to customize the tones the best of any detector out there.

I just ordered the 17 inch coil yesterday. I will be using it at the beach. My main concern will be pinpointing. I didn't like the WOT coil for this reason. But that was on my Sovereign and the CTX does have a better pinpoint feature. I'll give my review of the 17 inch coil in the middle of April. My only report so far is that sucker is expensive.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/26/2013 09:15PM by goodmore.

Yes agreed on the Etrac TTF in heavy nasty iron, I found it pretty much useless with all the hi-tone falsing.

I don't know why but I always found 50CO better than TTF, both on the E-Trac and CTX. But, this was in moderately heavy iron and not super thick. I tested this on many targets in the field.

Albert

*** always found 50CO better than TTF ***

What is 50CO?

Johnnyanglo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> *** always found 50CO better than TTF ***
>
> What is 50CO?

Same here,confused lol

NASA-Tom Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Very complex platform. Opposite of K.I.S.S.
> theory. Pages, pages, pages of menu's, menu's,
> menu's and sub-menu's. Capable unit. Appears to
> employ a form of a boost process when Sens is on
> '26' or higher. Auto +3 is a exceptionally good
> program; yet, can be trumped in manual Sens.
> whilst in competent/skilled hands. CTX will start
> falsing on iron whilst in higher Sens settings
> such as Sens 26 and above.
> Microprocessor/code/software appears to be faster;
> subsequently, much better in iron. Unit does not
> go into iron 'null' as often....... nor does it
> stay in 'null' as long. With 6" DD coil installed,
> the 3030 "starts" to show some abilities in
> carpets of nails. (This is a 'first' for
> Minelab..... which is a tremendous leap). Unit is
> in the top 10% with its abilities as to how it
> handles bad dirt (excluding all PI's). Unit ID is
> quite accurate to depth........ as long as targets
> are solo. In Florida inert dirt, the 3030's depth
> capabilities are akin to CZ, F75 SE,
> E-Trac/Explorer depth. Unit is not good with small
> relic targets. A (small variety) pistol percussion
> cap can be detected to 2" on the 3030........ and
> 6" on F75 SE. Same performance with pre-Civil War
> buck-n-balls. High conductor targets like silver
> Half Dimes.... or larger coins.... the 3030 is a
> very good performer. Unit is very stable and not
> prone to EMI. Heavy unit; yet, well balanced.
> Waterproof feature is proper for outdoor
> electronics device. Very good wet salt performer.
> Not a micro-jewelry unit. Low frequencies // high
> conductor unit. Audio presentation/communication
> is very good; yet, is digital processed artificial
> intelligence.
>
> My experiences (thus far).
> In a nut-shell.


thanks! tom! very informative!

j.t.

Steve Herschbach Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I know you did not ask me, but I will respond with
> a whole different take.
>
> I have been detecting just over 40 years now. I
> have used a lot of detectors, and my tastes
> normally run a tier short of top-of-the-line as a
> step down usually gets me more bang for the buck.
> I mostly nugget detect so lean towards powerful
> all metal hunting with detectors strong on low
> conductors. But I do like hunting coins and
> jewelry, both in water and out.
>
> My take on the CTX is that I was able to pick one
> up, and just using stock programs with the
> sensitivity bumped, do extremely well. I
> immediately started finding silver coins and gold
> jewelry, in water and out, with no fuss at all.
> The machine can be complex, but my experience was
> it can also be not only pick up and go, but
> extremely so. I think the real strength of the
> unit is how well it does right out of the box. I
> would have no qualms putting a CTX in a novices
> hands, and my main advice would be do not mess
> with it! It is very stable, very EMI resistant,
> and delivers very clean results.
>
> It may be heavy but the balance makes it feel like
> it is not. It is a pleasure to hold and use. The
> bottom line for this long time detectorist is that
> the CTX immediately clicked with me and has in a
> short time become one of my favorite detectors. I
> have fun with it, and there is no higher praise in
> my book. Finally, I do love that little 6" coil.
>
> Steve Herschbach
> DetectorProspector.com


thanks steve! your input is most appreciated!
it appears a lot of guys like it for grabbin' silver!
what higher accolade can you give a detector than to say it is "fun"
exactly what the hobby is supposed to be!..just sayin'

When you would show Crocodile Dundee a Deus he would say: "Naah,... that's not a detector,.... this is a detector!"

Where he would promptly pull a CTX out of his old Toyota Landcruiser, and whack a large silver coin out of the head of a huge snake, with the battery alone.

"Try that with your Deus,... Mate!"

It's heavy, solid, sometimes akward, but I like it.


Now we just need 007 to whack someone into revealing top-secret inelligence with the back end of a Deus!!

Both great pieces of kit and with that 6" col the CTX is starting to perform in Iron.
How about independent volume levels for every assigned tone in the combined pattern.
I could then turn down the volume of the not wanted targets in my iron/trash patch.

HH
Johnb

docbars Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Johnnyanglo Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > *** always found 50CO better than TTF ***
> >
> > What is 50CO?
>
> Same here,confused lol

2 modes right? TTF and 50 Conductive (multitone)? Haven't hunted in 5 months or so, so maybe I'm wrong but I think that was it...

Albert

*** Yes agreed on the Etrac TTF in heavy nasty iron, I found it pretty much useless with all the hi-tone falsing. ***


For me, I would rather use 4TF or multi-tone ferrous (MTF) when in iron. The problem with TTF for me is that everything above 17Fe is a low tone, which includes many deeper coins. TTF doesn't give any variation when a target is in the lower-right - nails and coins are all low tones. Also, to shut-up the ferrous it is necessary to DISC at least above 29Fe where little of anything good is found. Uses too much DISC.

So, I use the pattern below in 4TF or MTF. Not much DISC, just enough to shut-up iron above ~28Fe, where the probability of a deep coin plummets rapidly and the probability of nails rises quickly. The remainder of the Med-Low Tone is something deep - may be a nail or if repeatable at least one-way, worth checking. Much less DISC is required in 4TF (which appears by my testing to avoid depth loss that comes with overusing DISC). In 4TF the Low Tone sounds on junk (above 30Fe) and does not require using DISC to silence as does TTF. I just ignore the low tones.






The only other option that I would consider is perhaps TTC if looking just for silver and high conductors. It certainly puts all the rings and low conductors in one Low Tone zone, which isn't helpful but tolerable if you aren't after these targets. However, the reason I would rather stay with 4TF is that TTC (below) gives the High Tone equally on high conducting silver and ferrous nails. In fact, you must stop the High Tone response with DISC above ~29Fe or nails will all be High Tone. I know people like TTC, but for me it has too many drawbacks for practical use when I don't know what I'm going to encounter. TTC audio can be narrowed down by using DISC but I want to minimize its use.




You can see my display of 4TC elsewhere on this site - but in my opinion it isn't a viable choice. To isolate non-ferrous from ferrous requires massive amounts of DISC and the remaining tonal areas don't correspond to good-vs-bad, so they don't help alert to anything in particular. So, for me 4TC is out. TTC and TTF have limited application due to their wide tonal zones. That leaves for me 4TF or MTF as the most effective E-Trac mode. With 4TF you get Med-High on a slew of possible targets from rings to jewelry to clad to silver and gold and you get High Tone on very conductive silver (and gold). The Med-Low Tone alerts that something may be worth examining further and is easy to differentiate from the other tones. The Low Tone is stuck responding to junk, as it should and DISC is judicially used in this mode. That's my take anyway.

If iron falsing is a problem my solution is to reduce the sensitivity until it is manageable regardless of the mode you are using. The E-Trac isn't going to do well in fields of iron, unmasking will be a problem, but I don't want to make it any harder than it already is by using a mode whose tones aren't supplying intelligent information (in my opinion).

So I don't have my CTX yet but I've started reading the Textbook of a manual! I am sure once it comes I will ask many more questions but I'm curious:
1: Can you literally adjust Iron 'volume'?
2: Can you adjust individual 'tone volume? Or just the sound of the tone?
3: I watched a short video on how to set up a program and he was showing how you can make nickels and zinc both sound in different tones, silver tone and iron tone to create 4-tones, why not blend nickels and zinc and keep silver at a high so you have a three tone?
Thanks guys!

Remember that Johnny's post relates to the Etrac, not the CTX.

The Etrac does not offer the customization to which you refer.

Go-Rebels, sorry I wasn't responding to Johnny's post I was just asking the questions in general about ctx thanks!

I apply the same frequency to all trash tones in the combined pattern.
This in effect turns the machine in to a 3 tone.

Very easy on the ears and brain, especially when you're after higher conductors.

Once you get your brain wrapped around this set up, you can then assign a conductivity band and tone to highlight the targets you want to pick out of the mix.
Hey presto a programmable CZ-3D or a total screw up.

You can't lower volume for each assigned tone,.... that would be very nice indeed,... but again it would give the user the possibility to further screw everything up.

D-Tone Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Go-Rebels, sorry I wasn't responding to Johnny's
> post I was just asking the questions in general
> about ctx thanks!

HH
Johnb

But you can adjust iron audio right?
Thanks scoop!!

You can't adjust the volume of the iron/trash tone,..... but you can drop the frequency down to 75 Hz.

It's about borderline for my hearing. Meaning it turns the tone into a vague grown,... very pleasant for my hearing,... and easily discernable when a higher tone just "chirps" in.

So you've got threshold,... detector is telling you I'm in free from all metals environment.
You've got the vague grown,... detector is running over trash.
You've got a null,... detector is running over standardised trash.
You've got a target tone,... detector is running over target.

Hey it's a high end Minelab,.... you teach it how to talk to you.

HH
Johnb

Aaron Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Yes agreed on the Etrac TTF in heavy nasty iron, I
> found it pretty much useless with all the hi-tone
> falsing.

I have found just the opposite in my case with the etrac. I hunt mostly old homes that have quite a bit of iron. I hunt 90% of the time in TTF. With your screen opened up you don't get all the nulling and in TTF I believe the processor is quicker reacting. Now you could open the screen up using multi tone if you'd like to go crazy listening to all the different tones . I have dug quite a few coins that have had rusted iron in the same hole hunting this way.

I wonder about the effect of Etrac nulling:

"Ryan, thanks for your comment above. I'm from Minelab Engineering so would love to hear in what way the processor speed appears to be faster using 2 tone ferrous so that I could properly address the issue. Without that I'll just talk about things from the point of view of the E-TRACs internals.

Fundamentally the speed that the signal is processed in the E-TRAC is unchanged irrespective of discrimination pattern or tone mapping. The bulk of the processing time is consumed by filtering the raw channels, calculating the Ferrous and Conductivity values, removing the effects of ground etc. Things like discrimination pattern and tone mapping just force the E-TRAC to make some fairly simple decisions based on the results of some complex calculations.

It is possible however that changing those settings may change the way that the audio sounds and so appear to be faster."
Posted By: Phil on May 17, 2011 06:02am

[www.minelab.com]

(sorry for hi-jacking this CTX thread)

Bump