Is the EQUINOX A DEEP SEEKING MACHINE??

I saw the thread about the F75 and the Equinox and some were saying that its not a deep machine... Is the Equinox a deep machine? We know its fast and can pull targets from the iron in the same league as the Deus. Is the NOX a deep machine too? I sot a video in my garden where I test it with different recovery speeds.....EQUINOX DEPTH

Would you mind posting all of your settings in your Park 2 five tone program as seen in the video? Also, please include the advance settings? Thanks

I think it has to do with the settings people are using.

Similar to the out of the box Coin program on a Whites DFX or V3i....no depth.

The way I have been reading things, Park 1 and Park 2 are different animals all together...and that's in the pre-set mode. Probably even more different when one starts adjusting settings.

Looks like the Nox is plenty deep in this video Calabash. Probably deeper when you turn down the reactivity speed.

As far as the on edge thing goes. I can see the point if the unit is not IDing properly. But if it's still hitting on edge coins at depth and ID'ing as non-ferrous, then that's half the battle.

pine3874 Wrote:
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> Would you mind posting all of your settings in you
> r Park 2 five tone program as seen in the video? A
> lso, please include the advance settings? Thanks
sen23
park 2
5 tones, tones pitch 1 , 15, 20, 22, 25
iron cut down to lowest vol 1 and rest of tones at highest vol in advanced settings
iron bias 2 but have run 1 too...
recovery speed for thick iron 7
ground balance pumping and noise cancelled.
This is my relic settings and not good for modern trash imo,,,



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/12/2018 06:29PM by calabash digger.

What about your tone breaks, or didn't you change them from the default?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/12/2018 06:35PM by pine3874.

Scotts ground is almost like air. Don't forget ground matters. I can't get 10"+ coins in my ground and it's only moderately mineralized. Well in disc mode anyway. That being said all detectors struggle in my garden. All metal, even $219 machines can hit my 10" quarter smooth as butter.

FWIW F75 with DST is half inch deeper than nox in my garden. With boost almost 2" deeper. Disc mode.

The deepest disc mode in my garden? X-terra 705 on 7.5khz with MARS Tiger coil and a very close second with MARS sniper coil.

Deepest all metal in my garden? Garrett AT MAX



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/12/2018 06:40PM by detectingMO.

Reducing recovery speed in high mineral ground or high trash ground is exactly the wrong thing to do with Equinox and even in so-called lower mineral ground. And no, the default modes are not low power but instead the best place to be for most situations. The defaults are excellent with maybe just a bump to sensitivity. People messing with the settings right out of box and dramatically lowering recovery speed are generally shooting themselves in the foot. Equinox is new and applying all this stuff learned with other detectors is a huge mistake in my opinion. People should maybe try listening to the people using the machine instead of opinions from those who have never held it. Unless you are blind or willfully ignorant the evidence is piling up.

Steve Herschbach Wrote:
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> instead of opinions fr
> om those who have never held it. Unless you are bl
> ind or willfully ignorant the evidence is piling u
> p.

Steve, I don't think the O.P. is being "willfully ignorant". And the notion he is questioned IS coming from "those who have held it". I have spoken to a long-time expert turf hunter in CA (in the top-5 statewide, for his prowess in plucking deep silver from worked out parks). He got hold of a Equinox early on (1 month ago ? 2 month ago?) and ... although it was in the hands of a dealer, he got to try it out.

His conclusion was that it was not going to replace the Explorer, CTX, Etrac, etc... in deep-turf scenarios (where the need to reach 8 or 9" deep, and still have good TID , is the order-of-the-day). And in his opinion, it was NOT a matter of "wrong settings" or "need more practice".

But if this analysis (by a renowned hunter) has any weight, then the O.P.'s question was valid. That's not to say it won't excel in other venues. But ... no ... it's not going to spank various other long-time turf machines.

I hope to disprove this. Because I do a lot of old-park hunting for silver. But ... just sayin' ....

I never said the O.P. was being willfully ignorant. Straw man argument.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 03/12/2018 06:55PM by Steve Herschbach.

detectingMO Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Scotts ground is almost like air. Don't forget gr
> ound matters. I can't get 10"+ coins in my ground
> and it's only moderately mineralized. Well in dis
> c mode anyway. That being said all detectors stru
> ggle in my garden. All metal, even $219 machines
> can hit my 10" quarter smooth as butter.
>
> FWIW F75 with DST is half inch deeper than nox in
> my garden. With boost almost 2" deeper. Disc mod
> e.
>
> The deepest disc mode in my garden? X-terra 705 o
> n 7.5khz with MARS Tiger coil and a very close sec
> ond with MARS sniper coil.
>
> Deepest all metal in my garden? Garrett AT MAX

705 & F75 with the Mars Tiger coils tie for depth in my ground. 10"+ on insitu copper pennies. Will have to see how the Nox does on dimes as those two won't get the deeper silver I crave.

____________________________________________________________________________________________________________
In a democracy, it is difficult to win fellow citizens over to your own side, or to build public support to remedy injustices that remain all too real when you fundamentally misunderstand how they see the world.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/12/2018 06:55PM by Jackpine.

I'm confused, with vlf detectors it's thought you can have speed or depth, but not the extremes of both together, also that reducing recovery speed helps with depth and ID.
So is the Equinox different in this respect Steve?

Steve Herschbach Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Reducing recovery speed in high mineral ground or
> high trash ground is exactly the wrong thing to do
> with Equinox and even in so-called lower mineral g
> round. And no, the default modes are not low power
> but instead the best place to be for most situatio
> ns. The defaults are excellent with maybe just a b
> ump to sensitivity. People messing with the settin
> gs right out of box and dramatically lowering reco
> very speed are generally shooting themselves in th
> e foot. Equinox is new and applying all this stuff
> learned with other detectors is a huge mistake in
> my opinion. People should maybe try listening to t
> he people using the machine instead of opinions fr
> om those who have never held it. Unless you are bl
> ind or willfully ignorant the evidence is piling u
> p.

Calabash, I enjoy your Vids.

Tom_in_CA Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Steve Herschbach Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > instead of opinions fr
> > om those who have never held it. Unless you are
> bl
> > ind or willfully ignorant the evidence is piling
> u
> > p.
>
> Steve, I don't think the O.P. is being "willfully
> ignorant". And the notion he is questioned IS com
> ing from "those who have held it". I have spoken
> to a long-time expert turf hunter in CA (in the to
> p-5 statewide, for his prowess in plucking deep si
> lver from worked out parks). He got hold of a Equ
> inox early on (1 month ago ? 2 month ago?) and ..
> . although it was in the hands of a dealer, he got
> to try it out.
>
> His conclusion was that it was not going to replac
> e the Explorer, CTX, Etrac, etc... in deep-turf sc
> enarios (where the need to reach 8 or 9" deep, and
> still have good TID , is the order-of-the-day).
> And in his opinion, it was NOT a matter of "wrong
> settings" or "need more practice".
>
> But if this analysis (by a renowned hunter) has an
> y weight, then the O.P.'s question was valid. Th
> at's not to say it won't excel in other venues. B
> ut ... no ... it's not going to spank various othe
> r long-time turf machines.
>
> I hope to disprove this. Because I do a lot of ol
> d-park hunting for silver. But ... just sayin' ..
> ..
hey Tom, this is exactly what Minelab has stated from the onset.....I do like my 800 tho, zippity do dat....

canslawhero Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> hey Tom, this is exactly what Minelab has stated f
> rom the onset.....I do like my 800 tho, zippity do
> dat....

Yes. I recall that. So I don't know why some guys are getting frazzled now at this claim.

And if this depth thing is also true of the wet-salt beach, then this is not boding well If a person does not do nuggets (hence has no need for a machine with nugget-crossover ability), then what does that leave ? Relicky ghost townsy iron-see-through needs ?

And some people are touting the "more sensitive to low conductors" (ie.: better for gold). If that's for beach hunting or sandboxes (to get dangly fine earings or chains), then I could understand. Although, truth be told, I can already get some mighty fine small gold (little charms, dainty rings, etc...) with a standard excal or explorer on the beach.

But if they're referring to this in terms of park turf hunting, then ... no ... I don't understand. Because anyone can walk out to ANY park, with ANY machine (even an Ace 250 or bounty hunter), and merely turn down his discrimination. And he can already dig low conductors till his arms fall off.

calabash digger Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> sen23
> park 2
> 5 tones, tones pitch 1 , 15, 20, 22, 25
> iron cut down to lowest vol 1 and rest of tones at highest vol in advanced settings
> iron bias 2 but have run 1 too...
> recovery speed for thick iron 7
> ground balance pumping and noise cancelled.
> This is my relic settings and not good for modern trash imo,,,


Really like your videos, and enthusiasm

I've been really enjoying the 50 tone mode, just curious why you gravitated towards 5 tones? Are you trying to make it more similar to a Dues, or ?

Thanks!
Cal

possum mo Wrote:
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> Calabash, I enjoy your Vids. Thanks ! As far as recovery speed goes been looking for the magic all around number for my general relic hunting setup. On the deus it was 2 ,that gave good depth and fast recovery speed .On the nox I think its gonna be 6 and I will NEVER run it below 5. I think 6 is the magic number at this time for depth and separation in my soil. 7 will be for the foundations and such..

Tom_in_CA Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I have spoken to a long-time expert turf hunter in CA (in the top-5 statewide, for his prowess in plucking deep silver from worked out parks). He got hold of a Equinox early on (1 month ago ? 2 month ago?) and ..
> . although it was in the hands of a dealer, he got to try it out.
>
> His conclusion was that it was not going to replace the Explorer, CTX, Etrac, etc... in deep-turf scenarios (where the need to reach 8 or 9" deep, and still have good TID , is the order-of-the-day).
> And in his opinion, it was NOT a matter of "wrong settings" or "need more practice".
>
> But if this analysis (by a renowned hunter) has any weight, then the O.P.'s question was valid. That's not to say it won't excel in other venues. But ... no ... it's not going to spank various other long-time turf machines.
>
> I hope to disprove this. Because I do a lot of old-park hunting for silver. But ... just sayin' ..
> ..

I saw Ron's "assessment" from a couple of weeks ago too, and I'm sorry, but it's ridiculous to put ANY credibility in ANYONE (no matter how good they are, or aren't) from ONE TWO HOUR HUNT.

I'm not saying Ron's assessment was right OR wrong, but one short hunt, with no idea what settings he was even using, simply has zero credibility in my book. It's akin to doing statistics with one data point.

When he puts 100 hours on it, then his assessment has credibility. That's when I'll post my assessment of it.

Cal cobra: Theoretically (not saying this was the occasion with Ron and that post): Theoretically, If someone could point to a known signal, that was "called" by another machine. And machine #2 can go over it every which way till the cows come home. And can try every setting imaginable TILL THE COWS COME HOME. And yet, after all that, can not "bring it in " to-the-extent that the first machine could. Then what difference is 100 more hours going to do to that equation ?

Tom_in_CA Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Cal cobra: Theoretically (not saying this was the occasion with Ron and that post): Theoretically, If someone could point to a known signal, that
> was "called" by another machine. And machine #2 can go over it every which way till the cows come home. And can try every setting imaginable TILL
> THE COWS COME HOME. And yet, after all that, can not "bring it in " to-the-extent that the first machine could. Then what difference is 100 more hours going to do to that equation ?

Again, no data. What settings were used? Just because a 'dealer' was using the machine, means nothing, did the dealer have it set up correctly, who knows, we don't even know the settings.

Let's break down said assessment:

a) How do you think it will fare in turf (where cherry picking is the order of the day) , when compared to ...... say ...... the Exp. II ?

Still think the Explorers will be the dominate turf machine. Better depth and ID. Equinox is set up on a 40 number ID system.

WRONG, it's a 50 number system. And he wasn't testing it in turf, he was relic hunting in gold country, so completely invalid statement with zero data points.

b) How do you think it will fare in nail-riddled ghost-townsy sites ? As in: The averaging or see-through ability ? Compared to .... say .... A 2-filter Tesoro (bandito, sabre, etc...) ?

I think this is where it may have an advantage over other Minelabs. It does have a adjustable processor or recovery speed. I see this as an advantage in the iron riddled sites. Many times, ID and depth is not that important as if it beeps you dig it in these types of sites. The machine was very fast and with the proper coil size I see it having some value. If it is better than the Deus that I own will have to be proven.

Again zero data, he didn't compare it to his Dues, he only speculated "I think".

I was seeing good separation on the few targets we compared but the multi freq technology is suppose to be impressive. Cant say I used it enough to really have a real opinion. BINGO - THERE'S HIS ASSESSMENT.

c) Did you get a chance to do an air test on coins ? Such that, if the depth of a CTX on a dime (for instance) were 10", then is the Ox more or less than that, assuming commensurate coil sizes ?

Did some air testing and it did read "pretty deep" but I have not compared to the CTX.

Again, not helpful, zero actual data.

My point, try it out, put an honest effort into learning it in the field (not just waving nails and coins in front of the coil to test iron see through or air tests and what not, plenty of those vids on youtube already) have an open mind, don't try to make it something it's not, because it's not an Exp2, Etrac, CTX, Dues, etc., don't go to town tweaking all the advanced settings out of the gate, else you're setting yourself up for failure IMHO. Many of the people I see that are not having positive results have tweaked so many different settings, they've lost what ML engineering (who's likely smarter then all of us) built in the first place.

If you're free Saturday (or Friday evening), I'll be happy to bring my EQ800 to any site you select (ok, maybe not a park, unless it's scraped and, even though I have few hours on mine, we can do some comparisons between your Exp2 and the EQ800.

Cal cobra: Notice in my post that I distinctly said "theoretically ". I was only probing your inference that "100 hrs " is needed.

If a person *could* try every conceivable setting over a known target, and (theoretically) none of them worked to bring in the target @ an equivalent boldness, then 100 more hours wouldn't change that outcome. That's all I was saying.

Yes I'm fully aware that the other post in question didn't fulfill all that. Just saying that "100 hrs " is not always needed.

I will be bringing " The Heat " very soon Calabash.

It better be good in iron George cause this thing is.........Deus good in iron. Will take some getting used to because the tones don't pop out like the Deus . They are more mellow but it can see non ferrous in iron very well with the 11 inch coil. I cant wait to see the 6 inch coil.

Tom_in_CA Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Cal cobra: Notice in my post that I distinctly said "theoretically ". I was only probing your inference that "100 hrs " is needed.
>
> If a person *could* try every conceivable setting over a known target, and (theoretically) none of
> them worked to bring in the target @ an equivalent boldness, then 100 more hours wouldn't change that outcome. That's all I was saying.
>
> Yes I'm fully aware that the other post in question didn't fulfill all that. Just saying that "100 hrs " is not always needed.

100 hours was just an arbitrary number, the point being that a short 2 hour hunt really tells us nothing.

Your "theoretical" post, sure if you tried each and every possibility without success that tells us something, but that's not what happened, so I don't understand the point?

It would have been nice to see the I.D. Numbers on the deep dime it hammered. To Me depth is nothing without I.D., But I am a Coin shooter though.

If you know your unit grunts on a really deep coin/relic or the threshold wavers just slightly.... and the depth meter is pegged,... you're out in a field on a historic property....well, what do you do? Most of the ducks are lining up . Serious detectorists will take the 60+ seconds and recover the piece....often not always, they pull a keeper.

Around here I can't get past 9" depth with a 1021cz 12.2" air test Tom D calibrated unit or a f-75ltd. The etrac and the MLSE less than that. A friend is on the list for a EQ. If he can hit coins deeper than 10", I may be persuaded to get one....or at least dream of one. lol

Cal_cobra Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> , so I don'
> t understand the point?

The point is: A machine can indeed be tested in 1 to 2 hrs. If two hunters have flagged known "called" signals. And the new machine is tested with every conceivable setting adjustment, swing speed, etc... And each of the hunters agrees that the resulting audio of the new machine isn't nearly as tell-tale , etc... Then ... IMHO, "1 to 2 hrs." could indeed be all that is needed. Ie.: no amount of additional hours are going to change that outcome.

And I know this will be disputed, but .... I'm not even so sure "every conceivable setting" needs to be exhausted. Nor "6 months of efforts", etc... Because, in theory, if 1 machine maxed out @ 8" on a dime in an air test, and the other got 10" on a dime in an air test, then .... how is this going to 'get any better' in the field ?

I know there's scores of variables, but ... I'm just for-seeing, that if any (heaven forbid) comes in with a forum report of how the machine was lacking in a pitted side-by-side test, then ... sure enough, someone else is going to come on saying "You need more months practice" or "you didn't have the settings right", or "you're not interpretting the sounds right", etc.... So as you can see, it will boil down to where NO ONE can ever deduce 2nd place for it. The come-back lines forbid that.

Mine should be here shortly. I am going to go flag some deep turf signals against my Exp. II. As far as the wet salt beach: Nothing going on in-so-far a "must check out" erosion . This winter has been totally lame. I'm sure there's some fluke pockets going on, but.... I've pretty much resigned myself to land detecting this winter.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/13/2018 05:58PM by Tom_in_CA.