NEL 12X13 Tornado Coil Vs. Stock 11"DD coil

I searched for a thread to add this to but don't see a NEL specific thread. This video was filmed yesterday on my E-Trac. [www.youtube.com]

This 12X13 coil is made for quite a few detectors and is worth bringing up because, well, the stock coil on the E-Trac is excellent and this one might be a bit better except when things get trashier and such. By checking on ebay I can see the Tornado coil is made at least for the following machines: Minelab FBS and Xterra, Fisher F2 & F5 and Gold Bug, Bounty Hunter , Garrett GTI 1500 and 2500, Garrett Ace, Omega 8000 and I think a few others.


Well, I have to say the NEL 12X13 Tornado is a nice coil. I ran it all day today. It is a little heavier than the stock and you do feel that - it's a reverse leverage effect - and my only complaint.

To summarize, I notice that the Tornado is Louder, More Responsive and Livelier (Hard to describe what that means). This does get me wondering on how the smaller NEL's might work. I had to drop the volume 2 levels on the E-Trac (I don't run it on my headphones) as the Tornado is substantially louder, maybe 3 or 4 levels. The coil really does perform differently than the stock and it was most noticeable when I first used it as it was so new. The loudness of the hits was the first shock but then the clarity set in. It had more problems pinpointing due to the iron in the area.

Of interest, I dug my deepest coin ever today. It was at a measured 11,5" - 12" and made of iron! It wasn't a super old coin I think, From 20th century. The VDI was jumping all over the place and after getting it out of the ground the E-Trac woudn't read it as it was iron. So I opened it up and then there it was. The place I was hunting has been flooded recently. So there was often water past the 8" mark. That might be why? I checked the hole and nothing more was in there. I also compared signals on the stock coil which didn't pick it up as well. I didn't include the video here as it's a bit of a joy kill digging so deep for an iron coin but thought I'd mention it. Again, the stock hit on it, so it must have been the super wet ground. Sensitivity was at manual 30. I also dug two iron clad coins stuck together that read as semi regular coins in the ground but not out of the ground.

My rough depth tests on the Stock, Tornado and 15"X17" NEL Big (I just ran it a little today) with sensitivity at 30 and an open screen with a Nickel, Dime and Quarter are as follows (Sound and VDI):
#######.05#####.10#####.25 (all non silver)
Stock##12"-13"##12"####13.5"
Torn.###13.5"####13.5"##15.5"
BIG####15"######15"###16" (I had to set it down on the ground, not off to the side, to get it to run moderately quiet.)
Note - Zero EMI in the area for the most part. I don't think normally I would get such a good air test from an E-Trac.

Did you notice if the depth reading was off with the NEL coil. the one I tried was reading about 2" deeper than the target actually was.

Tom in SC

I didn't notice that but did suspect it was reading shallower than the coins were. I believe on another 8" coin that it was only at the halfway point on the meter but it was bouncing around a lot. I need more practice with it though to really say. The hits are VERY HARD on the NEL and that takes some getting used to - and this is after turning the volume down.

I think there is something special in the NEL design, even if it is the same size as a standard DD coil. I think this is probably due to the NEL having smooth intersections with the overlapping parts. I mean a DD coil has 4 harder meeting points where the curved outside circle changes quickly do a "D". The NEL is closer to a "O" but more like an oval. Perhaps that is why they seem sharper and more responsive as you don't have the a flatter area of the coil, it is pretty much symetrical. I would love someone with a technical understanding here to chime in.

EMS



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/26/2012 08:06PM by earthmansurfer.

Have you seen any reports on the sharpshooter??
Thanks,
John

Albert,

Great job on the videos, very educational!

One thing though. I'm not sure I guess maybe its your soil but I'm getting great depth with my stock Procoil on my Etrac. Tonight alone, I dug a 37' wheat @ 9-10" and though it was bouncing, and iffy, it still sounded strong. A few feet away, I dug a 06' indian @ 11-12" and it though it too was bouncing it mostly was about 12/38. My Lesche handle was a inch below surface and then I found it in clump of dirt on top of the pile.

Keep up the good work on the videos!

There is a guy called iron mask that is an authorized nel dealer on the minelab owners forum that sells the 12 x 13 for a tad over $200, w/ free shipping.
Buying it on ebay will cost around $250.
That 13' detech ultimate coil looks tempting too, and weighs less than the minelab pro coil.

Any time you 'open up' (expand) the electromagnetic footprint of the coil (vs the extremely tight electromagnetic footprint of a tight DD coil)..... it will allow the detector to go deeper........ at the cost of adjacent target separation abilities.

Yes......... this is to say that (in general) a concentric coil will detect targets deeper than it's comparable-sized DD coil.

Thanks Tom for that note. I notice it quite clearly after another few hours of use - The Tornado doesn't separate as well as the stock coil (not close actually, very apparent), but it's larger so that is somewhat to be expected. I'm sure if it was a DD coil that size the separation would be better. I mean it was much much more noticeable after the second day of use today. I went back to using the stock coil today for the most part.

Of Note - compared signals with a 6X8 SEF coil. That small could hit (not great but it would be a dig me signal) an 8" really small silver ring and at 8" zinc coin - not in a garden, real targets and on video...

possum - I think after swinging the heavier 12X13 I'm going to opt for the new Detech coil. Lighter than the stock coil is too good to pass up. I really don't like the extra weight and how it affects the balance. It's not that bad actually but if I can sell the 12X13 at a small loss and have a LIGHTER than stock (and larger) Detech, then that is the way to go!

These posts comparing these two coils were deleted from Finds! So sad, there was good info in there for people to use. And now I have some not so great things to say about the 12X13 and the thread there is gone. Sort of like cutting off your nose to spite your face...

Albert

Albert, I noticed it was deleted last night. Why do you think they deleted it? I'm curious.

No doubt one of the sponsors complained
That's what happens when you introduce advertising you get censorship and politics
I wonder how much $$$ this site could make if it had sponsors and how many are turned down?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/27/2012 08:57PM by Aaron.

Yeah, Aaron hit it on the head. And this has happened before. (And just so you know, they do check up on "us" here and I know this as I've gotten PM's and posts from Mod's almost quoting me what I've said here) But you know what gets me is that NO ONE contacted me. No one gave me a warning. It just disappeared It's like Homeland Security at times and it's just sad - Yeah, if you haven't heard, they are fighting terrorism by taking down websites. It is Corporate America's problems in the microcosm and on one forum. It means that a large number of people will not find out about other brands and even opinions (to an extent) because it is not allowed there. It is like SOPA to a point. I'm a bit saddened by it. I can't believe a sponsor would be so selfish as to have that post deleted as the coils come from overseas and really don't compete with anything except now the new Detech coil. I actually was going to post some negative comments on the coil as I did above and Tom sort of pointed out, but they didn't give me a chance.

Anyway, here are two short videos of the stock coil and 6X8 SEF Coil on a very small 8" silver ring and an 8" coin. This little 6X8 gets great depth and gets in between things as you would think it would. I don't think they will delete this one as some of the sponsors sell them. Sort of like free advertising...

[www.youtube.com]

[www.youtube.com]

I heard that because none of their sponsors sell the nels, they dont want them mentioned there. dont know for sure if true.

Since everything in life has pro's/con's.......... it is not a 'slam' or a 'negative' to be honest about both pro/con.

When it hurts the money-trail....... wrongful selfish things happen. (((But not on this freedom forum))).

I contacted them about one for the BBS..... none is planned. They wouldnt say why. There are a couple of with differences. Gary did a test as well: [www.garysdetecting.co.uk] Are we about to see a change in the hobby.....With even more competition for US detecting companies? Im waiting on a Chineese version of the Xcal.... comes on a wooded straight shaft.... coin and box is extra lol.

Dew

"When it hurts the money-trail....... wrongful selfish things happen. (((But not on this freedom forum)))."

A man who cannot be bought, how unusual....

This site rocks!!!

I know times are tough. I was listening to Carl from White's on a relic show and he mentioned that White's could cut costs in half by sending jobs overseas but he won't. I greatly respected him for that. Also, the other US manufacturers have stayed home as well. Made me wonder about Minelab and how much more they might be making by not making detectors in Australia, their home. All for $$$.

Now, regarding sponsorship. I understand we have to make a living. But you don't have to make it so cut and dry with posts. In the end it invariably comes back to haunt you. The Music industry tried to control music and it is still biting them. Governments seem to be falling lately. I think Find's could be much much bigger and better than it is, but money, it looks like, is having enough of an affect to only give you 2/3's of the picture. You know how many people have PM'd me with comments regarding how rude moderators there have been? Around 10. You know how many actually questioned the moderators or tried contacting them? Zero, outside of me. You all know the story "They came for the jews" or something like that and then "There was only me left"? Well, speaking up is a way out and it can be beneficial if done with etiquette and friendliness, etc. Ok, I tried that and it didn't work but you still got to be truthful and do what is "right". I wonder if White's also knows how many people sold their V3i's or don't even go on the main forums any more because of some Moderators' behavior? It is costing them money, this much I truly know. It is like the Cutting Off Your Nose to Spite Your Face saying.

My philosophy, or perhaps observation, is that when you do things more from your heart, you get paid in the end. And I don't mean with Love and just good vibes. I mean the Universe is a flowing place, it's alive and if you go with the flow and not try to be the police things just work themselves out. There is enough for everyone and I dig this place cause it seems to follow that basic rule.

Rock on Dankowski Forum, Rock on :-)

EMS

EMS,
How much of this industry do you think is built around HYPE ? ......All this garbage that get's spewed about this detector and that detector is nothing more than HYPE !!...It sells detectors .....The more hype , the more sales .....It doesn't have to be true , it just has to have the appearance of being the latest and the greatest ......Get one guy that says his XYZ detector goes 12 inches in the ground, and there will be someone saying that theres will go 14 inches in the ground !!!..... People believe all this , and end up buying the detector and find out that theirs only goes 7 inches , and then they get told " well maybe you don't have a good one " ..... Believe me when I tell you " NO GOOD DEED GOES UNPUNISHED !!!" ........ People don't want to hear the truth !!.....They want to believe in fairy tales !!..... Reality SUCKS !!...... The only way that you will know whether or not you have a good machine is by learning how to use it , and spend plenty of time experimenting with it ...... There are so many " ME TOO " guys on these forums because they have NOTHING TO SAY !!.......They have never experimented .....They just go with the flow and are led to the slaugher ......These forums generate a TON of money and a TON of advertising for these metal detector companies ...... It's all about telling the consumer what they want to hear ..... and let the guys on the forums send it home even deeper ...... One guy lies and the next one swears to it !!..... Thanks to Tom , we don't have to deal with that crap here !!......God Bless Freedom of Speech !!.....Jim

If I keep the eTrac I am either getting an NEL coil for it or the new Detech Ultimate coil.

I once again concur about the other forums and disappearing posts. I am a pretty bold guy and ain't afraid to mix it up with folks if I don't like something. I am one of the few that will do that and I have done it on several occasions on other forums for having posts of mine deleted for reasons specified by some of you guys.....I.e. comparing two brands, saying my findings from testing particular machines that folks were hyping up especially when it contradicts their posts. Good lord you wouldn't know how bad videos rub them raw when you prove them wrong lol For this cause I've been banned from a couple forums because I refuse to drink the Kool-ade.

I have 3 other coils w the Etrac I usually end up using the Procoil most of the time, I would advise sticking w the Etrac and the Procoil learn the machine and don't bother investing more money in a machine your not happy with,,,, yet.