For What It's Worth....Omega & 3 Coil test

I just now, fresh off the truck, received my Detech Ultimate 13" DD for the Omega, and put it on the machine...ventured to my air test site and my test garden. Stunned to say the least.

This coil is exactly the same shape as the Minelab Pro coil....except it is 13" whereas the Minelab is 11. The weight is...well there just ain't any weight there. Very deceptive to look at a coil this large and it not weigh hardly anything. But anyway here are my tests for now...will keep this thread open as I venture out and get some real world hunts on it.

Coils are the stock 10" elliptical concentric coil, 11" DD coil, and 13" Detech.

Targets are, 1 US silver dime, 1 US silver quarter, 1 Civil War eagle regular size button, and a .58 minie ball. These are my air test targets. In ground I have a silver quarter at 8" in red dirt....a silver dime at 6 inches in red dirt...and a .58 minie at about 6.5 inches in red dirt.

Settings are in DISC mode, at square nail reject level of 21 on the disc numbers...still allowing larger iron to come in. Two tones, and sensitivity at 90....this particular machine is too noisy to get the gain any higher than 90, no matter where I am or what coil I have on it.
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10" Concentric:

AIR TEST.

Silver dime = 11"

Silver quarter = 11.5"

Eagle button = 11"

Minie Ball = 11.5"

GROUND TEST.

8" Silver Quarter = No signal

6" Silver Dime = Iron signal with occasional high tone chirp

6.5" Minie = Iron signal

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11" DD coil:

AIR TEST:

Silver quarter = 13"

Silver dime = 12"

Eagle button = 12"

Minie Ball = 13"

Ground Test:

8" silver quarter = jumpy signal...iron to high tone chirp about once out of 5 passes over it

6" silver dime = high tone, dime-quarter VDIs, 96% of the passes over it

6.5" Minie Ball = lower tone, but jumpy VDIs in the TAB-ZINC range...right where it should be

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13" Detech DD

AIR TEST:

Silver Quarter = mind blowing 15.25"

Silver Dime = 14"

Eagle button = 14.25 - 14.50"

Minie Ball = 15.50...is where I stopped getting a repeatable beep

Ground Test:

8" Silver Quarter = Jumpy VDIs but a good repeatable tone nevertheless. Jumps from the lower ID numbers, to the silver range...every pass. eTrac wont even acknowledge this target at all...even wide open screen or anything.

6" Silver dime = dime high tone....100% no change. Dead locked.

6.5" Minie Ball = Tab/Zinc bounce...100% of the time.

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I was expecting a little bit of a jump with the 13" DD but not that much....that is almost mind boggling to me. I've not had a VLF machine to be able to ID as well as the Omega is with either 11" or 13" DD coils....it is a major improvement here just running the 11" DD over the 10" concentric but the 13" sure steps that up to major performance. I can get more depth out of the T2 and F75 with the 11" coil....BUT not in disc mode. I would have to resort to motion all metal mode on those particular models to get down to and past 12 inches. The cut off for the T2 was about 6 inches with the 11" coil, in which it started to ID everything as iron....so now I have the Omega doing better than that in DISC mode...which should help quite a bit in a trashier site. For the non trashy sites....the good news here is that the Omega has just as good of a motion all metal mode, and teamed with the 11" or 13" DD...I feel I actually have a better machine than either F75 or T2 for high conductors....especially with the 13 inch.

The good news though is that they also make the coil FOR the T2 and F75s...so you guys may want to consider getting one to check out. Since this is a Greek series coil, my speculations are that it should work with the G2 as well. I have a buddy with a G2 so the next time we hunt together I will try it on his G2 and see if it works. Most of my buddies are hunting with the T2 or F75 though...so I have them readily available to test side by side...but they do not have the new coil as of yet so it really wouldn't be fair unless I use the 11" DD. Right now I was just looking for a depth edge on those mid to high conductors and I have found what I was looking for and then some. This will be interesting to test against the Blisstool machine when I get to order it and get it here.

Very impressive. thank you Daniel.

very poor results until I do not believe the video. Or weak operator

make a video!!!

Denari Wrote:
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> very poor results until I do not believe the
> video. Or weak operator
>
> make a video!!!


Don't believe it then, that's your perrogative----but Daniel wouldn't lie about it.---------Thanks for going to all the trouble of giving us that report Daniel, much appreciated.----------Del

Thanks Daniel i've been thinking about getting one myself but was waiting to hear more about it. Keep us posted with real world results,think i will order mine this week! Thanks again Paul

Denari -- How is that poor results? And dissin' on the operator part wont get you anywhere except for me hopping on a plane and meeting you to shove a US size 13 boot someplace. If I recall, your own videos just showed it reaching 40 CM with the NEL Tornado....that's just 15" there bud...guess that makes yours having poor performance too then. I quit doing videos because of jerks anyway...that very reason is why I quit doing them.

Daniel, thank you for the time & effort to do the testing. I rarely come across any Omega testing in heavily mineralized soil. So your testing is valuable to me. What is the price of this coil? I read the earlier posts about KellCo prices and the difficulty of ordering this coil from overseas.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/13/2012 01:51AM by TerraDigger.

Thanks for the info.

$199 plus about $15 shipping from Kellyco. Got it in 2 days after ordering with standard shipping.

Daniel. great testing. Your credibility is excellent. You are one the guys who I know doesn't exaggerate but tells it and shows it like it is. Thanks. Kevin

Kevin B Wrote:
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> Daniel. great testing. Your credibility is
> excellent. You are one the guys who I know doesn't
> exaggerate but tells it and shows it like it is.
> Thanks. Kevin


100% agree with that , Daniel I would buy a detector based solely on your recommendation ,not many I can say that about !!

Daniel, another question.

11"DD
"8" silver quarter = jumpy signal...iron to high tone chirp about once out of 5 passes over it"

What are the VDI number 'ranges' you refer to as jumpy?
And was the Omega dropping down to iron approximately only once per 5th pass, but then staying in the non-iron 'jumpy' ranges rest of sweeps?

Bear with my anal questions, as I do not have access to a test garden to do this myself. I have a site where I get alot of signals like your description but I am limited to how many holes I can dig as its very pristine private grounds. Thanks again!!

TerraDigger -- In the case with the 11" DD, it was bouncing between iron and then would hop around anywhere from Nickel-Tab-Quarter. It stayed on iron about 5 out of 6 sweeps and then would jump high on the 6th swing or so. Very typical of red iron dirt. I'm not referring to red clay but iron powder dirt. We have 3 different kinds of red dirt here that I know of...this at my home is the powder kind that is mixed with shallow limestone bedrock and fragments from it. Red clay is tame compared to it. lol I will do some additional playing and see how they all 3 do if I find some better soil.

As for now....the 10" concentric coil has no place for me. I imagine the 5" DD would do great, as well as the DD elliptical. The 11" DD is a huge improvement over the 10" concentric and the 13" is just as good of an improvement over the 11" DD. Have 5 days off starting at 7 a.m. in the morning....so will put it through the paces for sure.

Good Luck!!!

Daniel thaks for the report, sounds like a fine coil! Just wish it were a little less $

I really like my Omega with the 11" DD, works great in our club seeded hunts, great for demo scrapes noodling through the iron, I just wish it were deeper for our ultra deep target parks.

HH,
Brian

strong mineralization of the test [www.youtube.com]
5 "coil sharp nel is very good



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/13/2012 06:44AM by Denari.

Denari Wrote:
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> strong mineralization of the test
> [www.youtube.com]
> 5 "coil sharp nel is very good


Do you have a connection to the NEL coils? You only seem to mention them.

Thanks Daniel - I wish I had done some testing with my Omega before selling it. I do know it found many more deeper coins than my V3i did (in 3 freq) in my iron mineralized ground! But my E-Trac does even better, but my ground isn't as mineralized as yours.
I sort of regret selling the Omega...

am a professional hunter and he needs decent accessories. My 11 dd is not watertight
Make a movie with a similar brick success

Denari Wrote:
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> am a professional hunter and he needs decent
> accessories. My 11 dd is not watertight
> Make a movie with a similar brick success

You might want to check out the 13" Detech as it does seem better (in build, with EMI, sensitivity and weight) than the 12X13 NEL Tornado.
I also notice the 12X13 NEL has a higher volume when attached which I think is a sign of the wrong number of windings, but not sure if that is really a bad thing?

If you guys go to the Blisstool detector US website www.blisstoolusa.com Go to the Demo Video section. You will find a video for the Virginia Red Dirt filmed in Culpeper, VA.

In that video they show a good rendition of the same kind of soil that I have down here....red iron oxide dirt. If you note they use an eTrac as one of the test machines. The one thing I don't like about how they are doing the eTrac...is the sweep speed of it. I think they are swinging it much too fast, and they didn't say what setup they were running it, other than the Gain settings....they didn't say whether it was Deep On/Off, etc. But regardless of that....what you see with the eTrac and Deus on the coins they use...is exactly what I see here with the eTrac and other machines I've tried. They really struggle in the red dirt.

Thus is why I will be getting a Blisstool this coming week....and why the Omega is also impressing me now. Some of you that have never hunted the red dirt are clueless to how brutal it can be to VLF machines. I have honestly dug Civil War bullets (they are made entirely of soft lead and consist of about 1 oz of weight) that will typically read TAB/ZINC on an ID detector. I've dug them in red dirt that read as iron from every angle...til you got them out of the ground and be holding them in your hand. Typically on VLF machines you have to run them in All Metal and dig everything...because everything in it sounds like iron....so using discrimination is a NO NO. The Pulse Machines have really taken off for this kind of dirt. But for now....the Omega and 13" Detech are going to be a deadly combo here. The point I was getting across....was this is one of the very very very few VLF machines I've used in red dirt, in which I could still use discriminate mode and get moderate depth out of. I can always use the All Metal mode for the extreme depth like I've always had to do...but it's nice to know that when I get in a site with an over burden of signals and trash....that I can hop to disc mode and feel pretty good about cherry picking goodies down to at least 8-10 inches in it. That's deeper than my eTrac will go in red dirt.

I can only imagine in good dirt that it does even better than this...probably close to what it air tests...which ain't bad at all if you ask me. Real world tests to come. Maybe even a video....BUT I'm not a professional by any means. I am not a Hollywood production company....there will be no fancy edits or cuts....but it will be the simple and plain truth.

I am REALLY happy with the Omega right now. Used it this morning after work to go to a co workers house....his little boy had lost his eye glasses out playing in a field and the field was already knee high of grass. I had them found within 10 minutes with the Omega and the big 13 inch coil. When I pulled up he pointed to the field and it was at least a 30 acre field....I was dreading the situation I had gotten into by saying I'd come help look....but after following the recent trails from the kids running and playing in the tall grass, I found them.

Congrats on the recovered glasses, WTG!

Have you already tried the 75SE in your red dirt?

Proves to me that Daniels soil is BRUTAL !!!! What a difference air testing vs in ground.

I may pick up one for my F75 for dry sand hunting. I like the reporting on the weight of the coil. Good to know.

Kevin B....looks like that Omega may be the best bet for you down there !!! Seems it's turning out to be a heck of a unit.

And I'm the one who sold him the Omega!!!!!!!!! I may be getting another. Jury still out on the Deus. I buried 3 three ringers yesterday. One at 7 inches. One at 8 inches. One at 9 inches. It hit's the 7 inch and 9 inch one good. But will hardly touch the 8 incher. It may like only odd numbers of inches in depth. But bear in mind that I may have adjusted something and caused this anomaly.

Makes me happy I own an Omega I was curious though. Since the AT Pro is a obvious re-design of the Omega, does it perform similarly in Daniel's particular nasty red dirt as the Omega?

Hey Daniel I'm just curious,How does the Nautilus IIba handle your hot ground? I think you had one at one time? You think it could hit that 8'' Quarter with the 10'' coil? Thanks.

Harold -- I actually had the IIb and the IV...I tried the IIb first and it is just like any other VLF in bad ground....down averages everything to iron...thus you hear it on the iron side only. It was one of the worse machines for depth though. I had a 6" coil, 10" coil, and 15" coil for it. In our better dirt it rocked...but that is few and far between locally. The dealer said the IV might be better in the bad ground so I traded the IIb for one of those and it didn't do any better. They are another one of those machines that would be awesome in beneign soil but lose a lot in bad ground.

Yes I've used a 75SE....boost modes are useless here in the bad dirt. Especially in Virginia. It will false too much...thus requiring sensitivity to be lowered to below 50 if you run BP mode. Still, you have to run motion all metal mode and GB it about every 10 yards or so. It would be interesting to see what the 13" Detech can bring out of the 75 and T2 though. That coil is super light!

The AT Pro is in the top 5 for VLFs I've used in red dirt. It still down averages to iron though. I am waiting on one thing from Garrett or an aftermarket company....a bigger DD coil. Right now, coil for coil...its really close in depth to a few other machines with the 8.5x11 DD....so I am very anxiously awaiting somebody to come out with a bigger coil to see what it can gain.

Daniel I have to ask then,What is your top 5 VLF Detector's in your ground?

1. Shadow X5
2. Omega 8000 with 13" coil
3. V3i
4. F75/T2
5. AT Pro

I often wonder what the X5 could have been had Troy built an 10-12 inch roundish DD coil for that thing...even still, even with concentric coils, it tops anything I've used to date. The Omega quickly moved up the chart with the bigger DD coils attached to it. The V3i is in there as long as it is ran single frequency and in all metal...it is actually very surprising in single freq 7.5 and disc mode for relics. I've only ran the stock D2 coil on it...never had any of the bigger ones when I had the machine. I actually did a video with it where I was testing it against the TDI...using the TDI to locate bullets and then different settings on the V3i to see if I could unleash a beast out of it...and after a few tweaks, I eventually just put the TDI up in the truck and kept the V3i out. If set right...that machine is stunningly accurate and deep. The F75 and T2 gets downgraded to a lower position simply due to them lying about IDs so bad. Great all metal units...not so great at IDing in red dirt in disc mode. And as stated before, the AT Pro makes the cut of the top 5 and could potentially be improved quite a bit, if it only had a bigger DD coil available for it.

Go Omega....lol

I found the omega to really like high conductor's well...even dug some large brass deep...But I found it weak on low conductor's...Freq has alot to do with it ...But I also think they wanted us to by the G2 also...LOL!!

Dont make a machine to good...It would hurt future sell's..

Good report,,

Keith