Another park loses metal detecting

I have detected this park for about 4 years without a problem. The local Police often wave or stop and talk with me. Today I was detecting and a park patrol officer not the police stopped me from detecting and said you can't dig holes on city property. He said you could detect but not dig, He asked me for ID and went to his car and called the police. A Patrolman came to the scene and said I would have to get a permit from the mayor before I could hunt. There are no signs in the park prohibiting detecting and no articles in the paper about any changes in the law. I checked and could not find anything prohibiting metal detecting or cutting plugs in the park. This park was founded in the 1920s and is hunted very often by many detectorists While the park patrol was at the car checking my ID I filled the hole up and when he returned I asked him if he could tell where I had dug the plug. He could not tell but said that did not make any difference. It is getting pretty bad when you wrap a fortune up in metal detectors and lose more hunting grounds every day, The joggers and park users know me and consider me one of the park fixtures. I guess that is over now. The park is Baker Park in New Castle Indiana



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/06/2013 02:37AM by Coinseeker 78.

I'd go to the Parks and Recreation Dept. and buy the "permit" to hunt the parks -- that way you can wave it in his face the next time he stops you and tries telling you to leave!

Gives you access to all the other local parks too (all except where completely prohibited).

That's where we have to purchase ours around here ---- $10 annually...

Land of the Free.

Pick up that can.

Sounds like you need to start a petition to require a permit to walk the dog and jog in the parks as well.When those people object perhaps you can get them to understand and sign the real petition rescinding the detecting permit. I'd definitely talk to the Mayor in a little place like that and make sure the history of the City adopting this requirement meets the legal standards for acceptance. If this was by some sort of Mayoral or Council fiat and not to the letter of the law procedure, the cost to the City to defend their action will far outweigh what they hope to gain in revenue and that's ultimately all it's about.

Stand up to the bastards!
It's not a "permit" , it's a bribe!

Screw that.

Is there a charge for the permit first off? But from you just said a permit isnt going to resolve your problem if they wont allow digging. Does the Mayor have town meetings or city counsel meeting? If so id approach it there well prepared. I lived in Ind a good many years and grew up there. Several of the towns like Nobelsville and Shebville have stopped people from detecting there period. Why..... because its easier than telling the one person that compained its ok than telling us we cant hunt. They dont want to have to explain their decission in the news paper or to their bosses. We all know the mowers, kids, ball players and other activities do far more damage that most of us ever could. But we never seem to be willing to do anything but complain and walk away...... where as that person who originated their complaint about us digging is. It shocks me that clubs in the state and FMDAC..... never addresses this. They seem way your dues is about it. Id be willing to pay more due if FMDAC would act like they were concerned and were more proactive for us.

Dew

Beating the catch 22.....kind of thing...
First get a permit as it seems to be a sign of the times along with high fences and gated areas.

A wide screwdriver can be had at a flea market for pennies...file down both sides so it can be used as locator, next mark the handle to know where its at a flat position....takes a little practice but get a excellent pinpointing unit and find the target with screw driver tip and then slide the flat side under the coin and pop it up. Hand held pinpointer is a plus and with a little practice easy to pop some clad with little or no damage...
Certainly not applicable to deep silver coins but will get you thru the local parks even with the most pain in the butt cops, caretakers, maintenance etc...
To really make it a neat job carry a small knife and a small slit in the grass makes it easily to insert the screwdriver and pop up...
Been to a lot of parks and saw a lot of rules and regs posted but never saw a no metal detecting sign so one wonders is it a law or just the wants and needs of the powers to be...

Fight it tooth & nail! You're doing nothing wrong, except enjoying a harmless hobby.

If you don't fight it, other parks in your area might begin proposing the same thing.

Use the locals you mentioned that know you from the park to sign a petition. Try & get 100 or more names. Go to a city council/town hall meeting & give'm grief!

Losing even one park to detect is one too many

Joe

I guess we all have encountered an experience like this. I know I have.

At my age I did not think my freedom to do a simple thing would be viewed
as a violation. It's just laziness on the part of our politicians that's all it is.

Any responsible adult who has paid the taxes we have paid over our years
sofar should be allowed to MD. Speaking of taxes when I go to the beach it's
hard to spot one face that's looks like it was born here.

Most beaches around here won't allow MD'g during the season because we
infringe upon the relaxation of the bathers and tear the beach up . . . right ?

This is just but one of the ugly sides of this hobby. The rest are a story
for another day

Coinseeker 78, I believe most every town , regardless of size has a website nowadays, here is yours......

[www.cityofnewcastle.net]

there is a tab at the top to access phone numbers, etc.......Let your wisdom be your guide.


Tri

Dan-Pa. Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Beating the catch 22.....kind of thing...
> First get a permit as it seems to be a sign of the
> times along with high fences and gated areas.
>
> A wide screwdriver can be had at a flea market for
> pennies...file down both sides so it can be used
> as locator, next mark the handle to know where its
> at a flat position....takes a little practice but
> get a excellent pinpointing unit and find the
> target with screw driver tip and then slide the
> flat side under the coin and pop it up. Hand held
> pinpointer is a plus and with a little practice
> easy to pop some clad with little or no damage...
> Certainly not applicable to deep silver coins but
> will get you thru the local parks even with the
> most pain in the butt cops, caretakers,
> maintenance etc...
> To really make it a neat job carry a small knife
> and a small slit in the grass makes it easily to
> insert the screwdriver and pop up...
> Been to a lot of parks and saw a lot of rules and
> regs posted but never saw a no metal detecting
> sign so one wonders is it a law or just the wants
> and needs of the powers to be...


Sounds like a good way to get cooked like a frog to me.

It just happened to me as well in Sunnyvale CA, and the park is the best I ever hunted for jewelry. Ca law says I can hunt but each park has the right to refuse it. So now the People who work for the public in positions of power who have no Idea and don't care to research detecting are telling us we cant hunt in a sports field, Am I not a sportsman? What gives them the right to exclude a group or a person from use of the field. One soccer game tears it up more than a heard of detectorist's. Ca, Barnaby Keen act I believe code 1653.
(WE Shall Not Yield Our Sovereignty To The Agencies Who Serve Us ) ie government!
I have entered into no contract with the parks they have no right to exclude a american from using it .
As Americans we have been stupid allowing our self's to regulated out of our freedom in the name of progress. Look at England the country we rebelled from. Detectorist have more rights in a monarchy than we do with all our corrupt politicians voting there pockets not what we want. And even when we have spoken and downed bills they just piggy back them onto a bill not even related and get it passed.
This may be extreme but any politician who does this should be barred and flogged as he is not doing his job by serving the interests of the people. And has exhibited his willingness to be corrupted by special interests.

We are truly a joke in the eyes of the rest of the world!
SAD SAD SAD

All the newbie yuppie's and their shovels got are forest preserves shut down to Metal Detecting last year! I have been hunting them for about 15 years with out a problem. Like you the cop's would stop and talk and ask what I had found. Them a couple years back when silver made a jump they all decided they needed to get into the hobbie for greed and they go rite out and buy E-tracs and Shovels and dig the places up with out even taking the time to learn the machine ansd proper digging with a hand trowel and back filling. All they care about is how much silver they get a year like it is a game? They even keep track of it on another forum. At least for now we still have Chicago park's,But it is a matter of time before they shut those down. I ever catch them on any of my small remainig sites with a shovel were goin' to have a little boxing match!

I sent an e-mail to Greg York asking for the regs.
Blaming newbies and yuppies is as good as helping them put up the "No Detecting" signs Harold but if it makes you feel better --swing with it!
Coinseeker , maybe we can get you thrown out of Indiana---didn't hurt Peyton.

Well the last cop who told me to leave said they were getting too many complaints about people digging up the Preserve with''Shovel's''. So what would call it then? It was always one of those deals where you could detect ,But not dig. But there was an understanding that as long as you were out there with a small hand trowel not a shovel and back filling your holes they were fine with it.

So if a cop told you to stop driving because people were complaining about loud mufflers (when yours were quiet), would you stop driving? You're detecting , not digging and if the cop can't understand the difference it's your responsibilty( meant collectively , of course) to educate them.

Acquiesence is the quickest path to slavery!

On the same page Shoveler. I don't need politicians and cops to tell me right from wrong.

Something to keep in mind, guys...

Just because one or two people approach and claim that a park you've been hunting is suddenly off-limits, doesn't mean that's actually the case. Best to (politely) challenge authority in a case like this. I would ask the person making such a claim (cop, grounds worker, etc.) for their credentials; name, badge #, etc. Then I'd go home & do a little digging. You'd be surprised how often you were given wrong information Lets face it...

Sometimes 'people in charge' have a bad day; fight with the wife, had to take a late lunch, vacation time got screwed up. So, these 'authorities' might then feel like flexing their muscle or breaking someone's balls. Logically (in their mind) they're gonna pick on some innocent, easy target like a person swinging a metal detector. Case in point...

I've been hunting an old picnic area here in NJ for YEARS now. I've gotten tons of stuff from this site; barbers, large cents, Indians, etc. NEVER had one iota of a problem at this site. Not a one. Cut to...a few months ago, I get to this spot early, about 7am. I notice two patrol cars parked side by side to each other with the windows down. The cops seemed to be B.S.'ing (when they should've been working!). They were about two football fields away from the picnic area. Anyways...

I just had a bad feeling in my stomach. A premonition if you will - even though I don't believe in that crap, lol. Well...

Wouldn't you know, after getting my gear on & just starting to do a noise cancel on my Minelab at the picnic area, I see one of the patrol cars in the corner of my eye. I clearly remember muttering to myself; "Awww $h!t, here we go". I turn my head towards the cop car & this moron actually drives on the grassy area of the picnic grounds, stops about 20 yards from me & blares the siren once, signaling me to come on over. I take my headphones off, slowly walk toward the cop car & put on my best Oscar winning Hollywood smile. Here's the exact conversation...

Me: "Morning officer, how are ya?"

Cop: "You're not supposed to be doing that here!"

Me: "Really? Why not?!"

Cop: "Cause you're not supposed to."

Me: "I've been coming up here for years now, never had a situation. I'm just looking for old coins and stuff."

Cop: "I know exactly what you're doing, but you're still not supposed to be metal detecting."

Me: "Officer, like I said, I've been here many times. I always fill in my holes, mind my own business & I'm just looking to kill a couple of hours."

Cop: "You better not leave open holes. If I get any calls & have to come back here, I'm gonna make you leave."

Me: "No problem, whatsoever. You won't even know I was here. I appreciate that!"

Now, couple of things should be CLEARLY obvious after reading this...

1. This copper was surely having a bad morning, and/or, he was a total douche. I'm guessing a little bit of both.

2. Since I've been hitting this spot for quite a few years, and there's not a sign in existence prohibiting metal detecting AND I've never had a problem like this before, it doesn't take a Sherlock Holmes to figure out this guy was bluffing. He must be a bad poker player, though

So, moral of the (long) story is...just because someone (anyone!) claims something, doesn't make it fact. This idiot just felt like breaking some cojones & flexing his muscle...for whatever reason. I know some detectorists who would've packed up their gear at the first sighting of a cop.

People do & say stupid things for even stupider reasons. Be informed. Challenge authority. Do your due diligence. A random utterance does not a fact make



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/07/2013 10:59AM by njnydigger.

Everyone including cops, custodians, metal detectorists all have bad days.

Metal detecting may be allowed but digging can be destroying public property in the eyes of many.

Being a retired State Policeman and avid detectorist for years been on both sides of the fence.

Blame the little old lady peering from outside her window as once a complaint has been made the policeman or custodian must answer that complaint.

My advice is to be courteous and make sure the person confronting you has any authority and see how it plays out and if not satisfied go to the governing body.

Just a fact of life detect enough and you are going to be confronted so act accordingly and consider it all in a days detecting. Has it ruined a day for me ..it sure has but in most cases all it caused was a delay and situation was rectified....

Guess I'm lucky...the only parks I hit are in Stockton , Ca...if anyone knows Stockton, believe me, the cops have way more to worry about than me detecting, lol. I have had park workers try to run me off, mainly this one stupid lady, basically I just ignore her and keep on doing my thing. Ray

deathray Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Guess I'm lucky...the only parks I hit are in
> Stockton , Ca...if anyone knows Stockton, believe
> me, the cops have way more to worry about than me
> detecting, lol. I have had park workers try to run
> me off, mainly this one stupid lady, basically I
> just ignore her and keep on doing my thing. Ray

I'm going to have to try that approach! But the police may not be as busy In Sunnyvale as I see them around the park allot anyways.
I would right it off but every time I go to this park I get something good!
Best

Hey godigit, if your in Sunnyvale, then I assume your familiar with Stocktons rep and why I'm not concerned about the police, lol. More concerned about stray bullets. Good luck

Since the city doesn't allow digging that disturbs or removes vegetation I hunt the ball fields and dirt walkways and open areas without vegetation. No plants are harmed and all is well. Once the bureaucrats get wise to it, they'll outlaw that too. But for now - we're all legal.

When grass is outlawed only outlaws will have grass.

Johnnyanglo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Since the city doesn't allow digging that disturbs
> or removes vegetation I hunt the ball fields and
> dirt walkways and open areas without vegetation.
> No plants are harmed and all is well. Once the
> bureaucrats get wise to it, they'll outlaw that
> too. But for now - we're all legal.
>
> When grass is outlawed only outlaws will have
> grass.

Sounds like the frog saying "Come on in , the water's fine"
I refuse to be put in the pot in the first place!!!!

People seem to forget that an officer's job is to ENFORCE the laws already written and that are in place...NOT to write new ones. In this case, it is wise to know every rule and ordinance of your city/county/state. If there are no written rules against metal detecting...then you are in the right to be there because anything else will not hold up in the judicial court. Sometimes officer's forget that they aren't the law makers and need reminding of that fact. Some people will just go quietly and not put up a fuss...I've never been that kind of guy. When I'm in the right about something and somebody is trying to pull one over on me, they are going to meet some resistance. And if they are already having a bad day...their day is gonna get a lot worse Especially if you happen to be like a lot of people now days, and have a camera on you somewhere. All it would take is for one button to be pushed to record the whole ordeal if the officer is acting out of line...and that will be a huge piece of evidence in court. It might put you on the radar for a while but if you don't do any thing wrong, it wont matter anyway.

Really sad. I just could't find any good place for metal detecting these days. So many places lose metal detecting. What should metal detecting enthusiasts do? Going to Africa or Asia with our "metal detector"?

Better get used to it with all the detecting shows newbies and there bad digging technique's are getting in the hobby more and more. I'm thining my herd of detectors as I lost about 50% of my sites the last year or so. Their is no use in having a bunch of detectors and no where to use them. I'm talking about my area not someone else's just to clarify before someone gives me another smart ass answer!

Shelbville and Lebanon are closed as well. More cities are finding it easier to close them to detecting than to explain to a single person that no damage is being done, especially comparted to other activitity. I think some park directors are just trying to justify their pay check.

Dew

Coinseeker,

Same exact thing happened to me a few months ago. Made me very agitated. Still upset about it actually. Almost the same exact scenario to a T.

Why don't you guys just keep hitting those spots early am discretely? What's the penalty? If they put up a sign, take it down. Maybe have no jogging or no strollers signs and put them up. Not being sarcastic, we gotta fight back, and when I used to hit the bars, I used to fight dirty.