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The main problem is defining exactly what digital and analog means in terms of metal detector electronics.
Before Candy got into detectors, he was an audio electronics E. at least that is what I read somewhere.
He really knew how to get the most out of a design, like the gold detectors, then Musky, Sov and Explorers.
IMO they should have stayed with the "analog" designs and made them
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Steve(MS)
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Thomas Dankowski Metal Detecting Forum
Joe, give us a link....I am feeling somewhat lazy to find your story.
I am somewhat hoping Whites can come out with a killer machine since
it was the brand of the first detectors I used.
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Steve(MS)
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Thomas Dankowski Metal Detecting Forum
I always have hoped that ML would use the stereo to allow conduct sounds say in left channel and ferrous sounds in right channel.
Though not particularly related to this thread, I always felt I might be able to tell alum from gold if that could be done.
Ferrous sounds as you probably already know is much more volatile that conduct sounds.
Through listening to both "tunes" at the same
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Steve(MS)
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Thomas Dankowski Metal Detecting Forum
No critter, the XS has the noise cancel button on control box but it doesn't have to be used.
And it can be changed manually in menu.
When I first got my XS I noticed if I noise canceled multiple times in the same place, it would sometimes
land on different numbers....so that along with the fact that what steveg found out that it can move items on
conduct scale, I left mine at 5 from t
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Steve(MS)
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Thomas Dankowski Metal Detecting Forum
Supposedly, the way to use the learn feature on the Explorer is to make adjustments at site.
I did tests when I first got the Explorer and realized the noise channels could slightly move up or down the
conductivity scale.
The only times I used tight patterns was when I first used the Explorer, after that I decided to go by tone alone.
It's really not a big deal but running tight disc pat
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Steve(MS)
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Thomas Dankowski Metal Detecting Forum
Steve, you are right, changing noise channels can affect tones and assigned numbers on Explorer, especially the low conductors.
I have been knowing that for many years.
If you want to try using the Explorer and go for gold rings, you could use audio 1, it is sort of similar ( so I have been told) to the Sov. long drawn out sounds.
Then if you scan slowly your gold ring and then the pulltab wit
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Steve(MS)
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Thomas Dankowski Metal Detecting Forum
i think his started out as a project open for others to build as well and somewhere down the line
he decided to make his for sale.
Good to hear of yours, wish I was electronically inclined, I would try building some.
I used to follow Geo but since I don't have the skill, everything was over my head.
Who knows, perhaps he will develop it further...
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Steve(MS)
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Thomas Dankowski Metal Detecting Forum
Just a guess but according to one of his posts, he is using alum foil for shielding
so that could cause less depth.
I suppose making a proper shield is part art, part science.
Too little shielding likely would risk interference.
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Steve(MS)
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Thomas Dankowski Metal Detecting Forum
Steve, I have used some duracell 2650 for a couple of years and they gave good service up to a few months ago where
evidently one or more batteries are going bad as it runs down in a few hours.
While they were good, I could have ran almost 2 full days on one charge.
In no way am I endorsing the duracells, just thought I would give an idea of what to expect on some good fresh rechargeables.
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Steve(MS)
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Thomas Dankowski Metal Detecting Forum
Unfortunately, yes, arrogant does describe the way ML works.
Someway they knew about how successful the Explorer would be along with their elite gold machines.
Yet the arrogance really kicked in after the new owners took control.
Quickly they let go key service workers along with really good customer service reps.
But all that is old news now, what we really need is machines that will blow th
by
Steve(MS)
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Thomas Dankowski Metal Detecting Forum
I think Bruce C. got out of ML when the new company bought them out.
One of his strong points was in audio design...which I think is one of reasons for the success of the Explorer/ Etrac series.
It could be argued that most of ML detectors have great audio sound qualities except for the Xterra series.
Back during that time period, there were arguably just as deep detectors, such as the CZ seri
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Steve(MS)
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Thomas Dankowski Metal Detecting Forum
Even the so called great unmaskers...one has to learn the nuances and what to do.
For instance, get a 2 way 90 degree signal, that is a no brainer on most any model.
Then one has to find out the falses any model produces and see how it fits in to "when to go for it".
Then ground is different from one area to another, what might be great in one region may not do in another.
For insta
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Steve(MS)
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Thomas Dankowski Metal Detecting Forum
Truly one of those older detectors that has surprising performance even when compared to modern ones.
I had one and a Nauty at the same time and sold the Nauty and kept the TB for a while.
It is one of the handful of older detectors that is a deep seeker.
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Steve(MS)
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Thomas Dankowski Metal Detecting Forum
Oh, I know what Keith is talking about....that slight broken mid-tone, no VID at all...yep...got to know the machine to pull it off......
Done it a bunches of times....
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Steve(MS)
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Thomas Dankowski Metal Detecting Forum
For the price of the high end models, we should have a computer doing all sorts of analysis on the signals.
Perhaps the Whites is the only one to start moving in that direction.
Strangely, regardless of model/brand, we all do rely on the circuits to hopefully give us a clue about target ID.
Think about it....we all have to make a decision like...iron or not iron or very low non-ferrous, nickel
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Steve(MS)
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Thomas Dankowski Metal Detecting Forum
The FE on the MLs generally isn't as stable as the CO.
Very early on in marketing, especially from a particular place in Florida, it was thought (hyped) that that the Explorer could tell the diff
between a clad and silver dime based on FE readings.
Also there was some milder hype about it being able to tell the diff. between gold rings and tabs....
My thinking is the FE is similar to t
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Steve(MS)
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Thomas Dankowski Metal Detecting Forum
The key word in your post is "averaged".
EDIT:
In principal, I suppose your scan rate per second would be correct along with superior electronics.
Yet "in the ground" results tells a different story.
And scanning over a target even in an air test seems to show there is no true complete "lock on" to any one given ID number.
Perhaps the act of a moving coil caus
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Steve(MS)
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Thomas Dankowski Metal Detecting Forum
I'll throw another monkey wrench your way.
These ID numbers, whatever they turn out to be....probably on any given detector
an assigned ID number has to be interpolated by the ID circuit.
Perhaps similar to RMS.
So as one sweeps over a target besides just one number coming up, say, 45,
Something like this may occur: 37,39,42,45,47,49,51,53....but the display only shows 45 or perhaps one
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Steve(MS)
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Thomas Dankowski Metal Detecting Forum
Steve, from what I have read, which I don't know if it is true... that ML multis(vlf detectors) use a form of time domain.
Time domain usually applies only to pulse detection as Tom has mentioned above.
I think in fact Tom has referred to that ML uses a comparator of sorts(vlf detectors) for disc and ID, tone ID.
So if that is true, it uses one freq. for a "baseline" reading and
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Steve(MS)
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Thomas Dankowski Metal Detecting Forum
I think this link will get to a pdf that Carl, now at Whites wrote up some 5 years ago:
It is a real basic study and he doesn't touch on thickness, which has been mentioned here.
Yet thickness or I suppose it could be called mass does comes into play with how a metal is detected.
One can take a piece of alum. foil of any Length times width and scan it.
Then fold it once and rescan
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Steve(MS)
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Thomas Dankowski Metal Detecting Forum
Then the next step is for FT to make a digital model of the CZ and in fact DJ stated that would be only way logically to update it.
He was asked on one occasion if he was working on a digital model in which he replied he couldn't comment of what he might be working on.
Yet no doubt it would be advanced beyond the rendering of an exact digital update if that road is to be taken.
I hazard t
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Steve(MS)
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Thomas Dankowski Metal Detecting Forum
Even if his test is true, it doesn't prove very much.
Some detectors that adjust very low in the iron range can be made to signal if there is something else there besides a nail
or perhaps several nails very close together.
The problem is though typically if nails are there in abundance, likely there will be a lot of other iron types present.
So it could be signaling on odd pieces of iro
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Steve(MS)
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Thomas Dankowski Metal Detecting Forum
New ML is still profiting from old ML's models.
They really haven't come out with anything new since the new company except Etrac.(and it isn't that much different than Explorer)
Hey FT, we are still waiting...to take advantage...... Send me your proto...I'll shorten the time to get the kinks out......ready it for market!
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Steve(MS)
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Thomas Dankowski Metal Detecting Forum
It has to do with ground minerals, when ground mineral count starts to screw with high freqs ability to punch
deeper....that is the difference.
Heck, keep one of each and have all the bases covered.
I do understand about ML bothering the joints.....
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Steve(MS)
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Thomas Dankowski Metal Detecting Forum
What I have read from DJ is the CZs require a lot of internal tuning to get it to have optimum performance.
So it isn't a simple task at all.......
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Steve(MS)
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Thomas Dankowski Metal Detecting Forum
Cal, do you have any idea of how far away the 2 detectors need to be in order to avoid interference?
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This is worth a study in order to help others not to be affected by this situation.
by
Steve(MS)
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Thomas Dankowski Metal Detecting Forum