Minelab Equinox ID resolution. What do you think about it?

What do you think about Equinox narrow ID pattern?

40 non ferrous TID numbers is totally fine if the TID is accurate and stable at depth, as they claim it will be. Heck, I'd even take 10 TID numbers if it delivers good TID at depth as good as or better than the CTX/e-trac.

As a deep coin hunter, accurate TID at depth is the most important performance attribute for me. I hunt old hunted out parks and schools, and sometimes go an hour or more between targets dug. I focus on deep, round, coin-sized targets. Sound is important, but so is TID when making the did/no dig decision. The best detector I've ever used in this regard is the CTX. If the Equinox gives just as good TID at depth, and I'll be one happy puppy.

What about narrow scale, some items fall in some ID ranges... in my opinion wider should be better. For better item identification.

I really will not know until I try it.. I do love the Rutus Alter 71 with its 120 points, though 40 are for iron. It works very well picking out rings amongst the aluminum trash.

I can see it both ways.

If it has a narrower non-ferrous scale of 40 - then of course a "lumping" effect will occur naturally. Math is unforgiving in that aspect.

Dimes and copper pennies...nickels and tabs...quarters and crown caps. We already get that lumping effect with some detectors with wider scales (40 iron and 60 non-ferrous).

However, if the detector itself can overcome the smaller scale boundaries by being more accurate in its lumps and IDs - I would not think it would be a huge issue for the user.

Time will tell once it is released of course.

My YouTube - [www.youtube.com]
Website - [www.thehuntergt.com]

Not broad enough IMO.---We will just have to wait & see how the I.D.'s fall.----Maybe Minelabs "got something (new) up their sleeve" in this regard.---We'll know soon enough!

D&P-OR Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Not broad enough IMO.---We will just have to wait
> & see how the I.D.'s fall.----Maybe Minelabs "got
> something (new) up their sleeve" in this regard.--
> -We'll know soon enough!


I'd have to hope they know how important this is and that they set up the scale such that we can at least tell silver from clad. That's one nice thing about my V3i: as long as the target is shallow, you can the difference. Same with the CTX. And I hear the etrac is the same way. Accurate TID at depth is still most important to me, and I really hope the Equinox comes through in this department, especially after all the promises.

I stated this in a another thread...WHY 40??

Yet they maybe have assigned say 3 points to nickles and maybe 15 points to copper and silver??then all the rest of the stuff gets lumped into the remains..??

The Xterra 705 has 48 non ferrous but only uses even numbers so in reality that's just 24 ..


Yet still makes me wonder why if you make a two digit ID why not open it up to 99??

Might be the reason so they have a detractor if you want all out trash separation you have to get the CTX,, what if they built the Equinox and offered 99 scale then it was every bit as good as the 2 dimensional ID FBS machines trash sifting ability?? How can they sell them for 2 grand then...what if that's the only difference one works trash better beacuse fo more scale but cost a grand more??Hard to charge a grand more for a 99 scale but not for a 2d scale if they make a person think the 2d is the magic...

Keith

“I don't care that they stole my idea . . I care that they don't have any of their own”
-Nikola Tesla

Keith Southern Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I stated this in a another thread...WHY 40??
>
> Yet they maybe have assigned say 3 points to nickl
> es and maybe 15 points to copper and silver??then
> all the rest of the stuff gets lumped into the re
> mains..??
>
> The Xterra 705 has 48 non ferrous but only uses e
> ven numbers so in reality that's just 24 ..
>
>
> Yet still makes me wonder why if you make a two di
> git ID why not open it up to 99??
>
> Might be the reason so they have a detractor if y
> ou want all out trash separation you have to get
> the CTX,, what if they built the Equinox and offer
> ed 99 scale then it was every bit as good as the
> 2 dimensional ID FBS machines trash sifting abilit
> y?? How can they sell them for 2 grand then...what
> if that's the only difference one works trash bett
> er beacuse fo more scale but cost a grand more??Ha
> rd to charge a grand more for a 99 scale but not f
> or a 2d scale if they make a person think the 2d i
> s the magic...
>
> Keith


Good observation. And once the new flagship model is out, and leapfrogs back over the Equinox in capability, they could increase the Equinox TID from 40 to 99 with a simple USB firmware flash since the hardware for the LCD is identical whether it reads up to 40 or 99.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/10/2017 02:13AM by wayfarer.

I liked the Fisher CZ-5 with 6 non-ferrous and one ferrous!

Steve Herschbach Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I liked the Fisher CZ-5 with 6 non-ferrous and one
> ferrous!
Steve,

I have to admit, the segments used in the CZ's were very good and accurate.

I haven't seen anything in the Minelab info regarding if the 40 segments are all equal in 'size' or if some segments are 'bigger' or 'smaller' in order to contain certain common items . On the CZ the nickel segment was actually very narrow. Other segments larger. On detectors that bundle all coins together at the top, (Tesoro's, Sovereigns, CZ''s) I've always felt like I"m missing something.by not being able to visually separate the CU cent, clad dime, silver dime, and so forth. That said, the performance on the CZ and Sovereign offset the loss.


Rich -

------------------------------------------------------------------

Just one more good target before I go.

In a pratical detecting situation I’ve found the 24 segments of the X-terra more than ample.
Because I usually hunt in 2 tone, sometimes even single tone.

Because single tone is actually a 3 tone: Threshold, Null, Beep and you use the segments to null the targets you don’t want.

How the targets fall into these segments is KEY.

Same with the CTX, you can assign 50 tones, but you can make do with single tone and disc patterns.

Using a single tone that is just wright for your hearing, you more easily get to know target sizes and profiles during your sweep.
That alone is a great discrimination feature.

You can have 100 ID points or more, but how it handles Disced vs NON-Disced ID is much more important.

HH
Johnb

New RUTUS ARGO NE has single tone option but with volume increases from low to high ID. Scale -90 to +90. You can choose also 5 tones or your tone pattern.

When expanding the range to 99 it turns out to be simply bouncing in large VDI values ...
So there is no difference - 40 or 90

vfp7 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> When expanding the range to 99 it turns out to be
> simply bouncing in large VDI values ...
> So there is no difference - 40 or 90

+1 Exactly!

Hopefully the next tech release will tell us what TID numbers US silver coins typically fall under. hint hint

As far as tones I would have preferred 2 tone and 3 tone instead of 5 tone. Then what ever absurd number they wanted. LOL

Tom

One other request, If concentric coils work with the Equinox, make a 9" designed like the X-Terra coil. That thing slices through the water like a hot knife through butter.

____________________________________________________________________________________________________________
In a democracy, it is difficult to win fellow citizens over to your own side, or to build public support to remedy injustices that remain all too real when you fundamentally misunderstand how they see the world.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 11/10/2017 09:05AM by Jackpine.

Shelton Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What about narrow scale, some items fall in some I
> D ranges... in my opinion wider should be better.
> For better item identification.

For US silver coin hunters the top end of the scale would not have be wide. It could be done with 5 numbers.

Tom

____________________________________________________________________________________________________________
In a democracy, it is difficult to win fellow citizens over to your own side, or to build public support to remedy injustices that remain all too real when you fundamentally misunderstand how they see the world.

Doubt it will bother too many in the UK, not many here dig parks, and if you could dig parks you'd probably only use it to ID targets you didnt want to dig.

In such detectors ID will always jump, especially for oxidized targets.
If you want a good identification of targets, then you need a screen like CTX 3030, which will display expanded information about the target.
And to use only one VDI is nothing ...

We will find out in 30 days!

"With most detectors, I know what I have in the [ low to mid range i.e. above foil to small gold, lead ]
I can also recognise [ high content silver coins ]
But, where TID 'falls down' for me is there's such a wide variation for small copper & bronze Victorian, Georgian and for large coins from the same monarchs.

So, with EQX, am I looking at: 9 - 15 for small low conductive silver's, 16 - 28 for mid range coins and other targets, and 28 - 40 for the remainder of a huge variety of coinage including bronze, copper & silver. So will I have the same problem again with the bronze/copper coins banging in from 28 - 32, and coppers from 32 - 34 and silvers from 34 - 38 - 39
I've a sneaking suspicion no [ mainstream ] coin targets will produce a TID of 40, but 'Commerative or other large silver's e.g Kennedy halves might?"



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/10/2017 03:01PM by Des D.

Ok , if we want to play this game, then here it is

going by US coins

40-unknown large conductors.
39-38 large dollars
37-halves
36-silver quarters
35-clad quarters
34-silver dimes
33-clad dimes
32-memorial penny
31-wheat penny
30-28-zinc penny
28-26-indian
25-14-aluminum tabs
14-13-nickels
13-12-beaver tails
11-01-foil
0 to -9 iron

Just a guess...really!

Beyonder-Pa Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Ok , if we want to play this game, then here it is
>
>
> going by US coins
>
> 40-unknown large conductors.
> 39-38 large dollars
> 37-halves
> 36-silver quarters
> 35-clad quarters
> 34-silver dimes
> 33-clad dimes
> 32-memorial penny
> 31-wheat penny
> 30-28-zinc penny
> 28-26-indian
> 25-14-aluminum tabs
> 14-13-nickels
> 13-12-beaver tails
> 11-01-foil
> 0 to -9 iron
>
> Just a guess...really!


I would guess something similar to the Safari.

"Good guess Beyonder!

I wouldn't agree on there being any difference between clad and silver quarters?
They will be the same.
You're probably right on dimes. Up to '2 digit difference?'
I don't care too much about square tabs and ring pulls as I dig all the low to mid conductors anyway?

Hey, how 'bout Canadian coins??? What will happen there?
Sven, anyone???"

detectingMO Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Beyonder-Pa Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Ok , if we want to play this game, then here it
> is
> >
> >
> > going by US coins
> >
> > 40-unknown large conductors.
> > 39-38 large dollars
> > 37-halves
> > 36-silver quarters
> > 35-clad quarters
> > 34-silver dimes
> > 33-clad dimes
> > 32-memorial penny
> > 31-wheat penny
> > 30-28-zinc penny
> > 28-26-indian
> > 25-14-aluminum tabs
> > 14-13-nickels
> > 13-12-beaver tails
> > 11-01-foil
> > 0 to -9 iron
> >
> > Just a guess...really!
>
>
> I would guess something similar to the Safari.
>
>

I hope not, my father had a safari and everything was grouped in "89". Pennies dimes quarters halves all 89.

What I already have is looking better all the time!

D&P-OR Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What I already have is looking better all the time
> !

I couldn't agree more.
I already have two fast recovery machines with "2 star" discrimination and see no reason to add a third.
If it means waiting a few months to confirm or deny , so be it.

Des D Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "Good guess Beyonder!
>
> I wouldn't agree on there being any difference bet
> ween clad and silver quarters?
> They will be the same.

but this is where the 'running' depth gauge could help differentiate them...

as to Cdn coinage I really doubt it will be very good on any of our post 2000 steel core stuff, and no gripes there....

just so it hits the pre 2000 (nickel) coinage and loonies and toonies (pre steel core) I'd be happy...

loonies and toonies could pay for it in short order, eat your hearts out yanks, lol

Gonebeepin' Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Steve Herschbach Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I liked the Fisher CZ-5 with 6 non-ferrous and o
> ne
> > ferrous!
> Steve,
>
> I have to admit, the segments used in the CZ's wer
> e very good and accurate.
>
> I haven't seen anything in the Minelab info regard
> ing if the 40 segments are all equal in 'size' or
> if some segments are 'bigger' or 'smaller' in orde
> r to contain certain common items . On the CZ the
> nickel segment was actually very narrow. Other seg
> ments larger. On detectors that bundle all coins t
> ogether at the top, (Tesoro's, Sovereigns, CZ''s)
> I've always felt like I"m missing something.by not
> being able to visually separate the CU cent, clad
> dime, silver dime, and so forth. That said, the pe
> rformance on the CZ and Sovereign offset the loss.
>
>
> Rich -


Always loved foil/nickle bouncers on my CZ70, good chance of being a gold ring. And that faint high-tone ping = deep silver

IMHO I think a machine with a well designed lower count TID # schema would work fine.

All of the digital machines I've used, with the exception of the CZ70, Sovereign and Etrac, all used the "standard" 0-99 TID. Hunting relic sites or coin shooting, these machines tend to be jumpy (Fisher, Teknetics, Garrett, Makro, Nokta, etc), if they tighten the numbers so their more locked on, IMO that would be great. Almost all machines are stable on shallow targets, but once they get 6"+ most VLF units will struggle to have solid TIDs on smaller objects (dime sized and smaller), throw in some iron and mineralized soil, and things change even more.

A good friend of mine who's an excellent detectorist, loves the old White's XLT (he has many machines, V3i, CTX, Etrac, F19+, lots of Tesoror's, and knows how to use them all very well). He claims the number system is so solid on the XLT that it can discern between a clad and silver dime, IHP, zincoln and copper small cents, and so on and so forth. On say the F75, Racer2 or Impact, I wouldn't say it's that accurate. You may get a general idea that it's an IHP, but zincolns and IHPs tend to be about the same TID#, whereas copper pennies and clad/silver dimes share about the same TID#. Heck I dug a seated quarter on the Impact that was bouncy, but mostly coming in at 96, thought it was either going to be iron wrapping, big silver or another big target, but it had nice tight zip zip sizing of a coin and that unmistakable pure audio sound you get from silver on the Nok/Mak machines (96 on the Impact seems ok, but if you see a 97+ you can be sure it'll be iron).

We'll see how Minelab did, but the common theme I'm observing is there's a lot of X-terra DNA in the NOX, and from what serious users of the X-terra line have reported, it's a darn good machine, so if this platforms base DNA is built on the X-terra I suspect this machine will make most everyone happy.

Keith Southern Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I stated this in a another thread...WHY 40??
>
> Yet they maybe have assigned say 3 points to nickl
> es and maybe 15 points to copper and silver??then
> all the rest of the stuff gets lumped into the re
> mains..??
>
> The Xterra 705 has 48 non ferrous but only uses e
> ven numbers so in reality that's just 24 ..
>
>
> Yet still makes me wonder why if you make a two di
> git ID why not open it up to 99??
>
> Might be the reason so they have a detractor if y
> ou want all out trash separation you have to get
> the CTX,, what if they built the Equinox and offer
> ed 99 scale then it was every bit as good as the
> 2 dimensional ID FBS machines trash sifting abilit
> y?? How can they sell them for 2 grand then...what
> if that's the only difference one works trash bett
> er beacuse fo more scale but cost a grand more??Ha
> rd to charge a grand more for a 99 scale but not f
> or a 2d scale if they make a person think the 2d i
> s the magic...
>
> Keith

I think the answer is there if you "look a bi"t Keith. My thinking is that these Equinox's are "mid level" models. They are going to come out with an E-Trac replacement is my guess, maybe later next year, Summer-ish.
They had to leave some room for higher end models. Look at how long the CTX has been out. 5 years now? About time for a lighter and less expensive replacement? Something in the 1200 dollar or so range...
Yeah, I'm hoping...

Albert