American Metal Detector Manufacturers

Geotech Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> rustic charm Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > These are simply my beliefs Rick from my expe
> riences and what I have seen in the industry...[/i
> ]
>
> The problem, Rustic, is they are beliefs an
> d based on no first-hand experience. I worked for
> White's for 6 years, now work for FTP, and have to
> ured both the Garrett and Tesoro factories. I beli
> eve I have personally invited you to FTP in the pa
> st to show you, firsthand, just how wrong you are.

YES - I remember - thank you

However I was told by someone I trust within FT - Two Bounty Hunter models were being produced in China (by Chinese manufacturer) under strict supervision by FT to produce two of the biggest selling FT metal detectors - I believe Mr Rick stated the BH Jnr & I was told also the BH VLF 2.1 - I know my math aint good but that's the two models there. The two I was told FT get made in China -

Secondly, I am not here attacking your industry however perhaps you could tell me why Whites gets all their promo gear made in China when they make out they staunchly support American made? Also not long after the MXS fiasco, Whites announced that they were getting one of their models made in China as well - Kinda makes you think with all those delays in getting the MXS right, was it also manufactured off-shore? It matters not however this Proud to be American company has had to go off-shore to survive as well

Same as Garrett -

It only takes one to go running to China and the rest have to go to survive - Well done

Thank you Geotech for your kind invitation - I had not forgotten as my daughter and i will be doing the factory tours one day - My daughter had a choice between Disneyland & FT Tour and she wants the FT Tour - She don't detect mate, but she is very caring - Been fighting health insurance for a little over four years now, probably closer to five - Hopefully soon we will be in a position to take up your very kind invitation Sir - Thank You

[www.earthscan.co.nz]

RC

This is your clearest statement of your main point.

”You will quite easily find that there is more than one model involved and they are FT biggest sellers made to exacting specifications set down by FT - IMO, It would stand to reason that over time those numbers and models would have increased, otherwise FT Board should be sacked for not doing their job

More than one model
They are FT biggest sellers
Over time those numbers and models would have increased.

I contacted Tim Mallory, the VP of Sales and Marketing at FT and asked him if my information that only one FT model was made in china was correct. turns out that I was wrong - there are in fact two - although, I confess I have never heard of the second one. Here is a quote from the email he sent me today (Sunday, guess he thought it was important to set the record straight)..

”We have 2 metal detector models that we make in China. The BHJR and the VLF 2.1. The BHJR is our best selling model, at XX.XX wholesale. The VLF 2.1 is very slow selling....We have no intention of expanding our ‘made in china’ products.“

In a follow-on email, he explained that the VLF 2.1 is the same as the BHJR, but in an adult package.

I redacted the wholesale price since that is proprietary information - but it’s awfully low.

So congrats - I was wrong - there is not one model - there are two - the Bounty Hunter Junior plus another one - the VLF 2.1 which lists for $65 on Amazon.

By the way, Page 11 of the manual of the VLF 2.1 states “Made in China”. Pretty clear.

No subterfuge, no fraud, no false claims of “Made in USA” Just a company which makes dozens of different models which qualify for their correct US origin labeling by being assembled and tested in El Paso Texas from imported and US sourced parts - and sells two models where - in the case of the GHJR - part of the production is in China (others are from El Paso) and in the case of the slow selling VLF 2.1 all are “Made in China”. All packageing is clearly labeled with the correct information as to “country of origin” in accordance with US Federal Trade Commission requirements.

You have been at this insinuation and accusation campaign a long time now...Here’s a quote from your post of 17 August 2015 on this forum

[www.dankowskidetectors.com]

Can you name the two Bounty Hunters they make in China? - from what I was told they are Bounty Hunters biggest sellers & why would they stop at just two of their models being made there? - Do they tell their customers that those models are Made in China?
Its my opinion that there is a lot more than meets the eye with not only First Texas products but Garrett as well - Are they being completely honest with their customers as to where their products are made?

So congrats again - I told you then about the BHJR, but my information did not include info on the VLF 2.1 (as if anybody here ever heard of it anyway) - score one for you. But as to the rest of your insinuation that they - and Garrett - are fraudulently labeling made in china units - as the Queen would say - “Utter Rubbish”

Interestingly, the same thread goes on - where I post links to a discussion someone posting as “synchtoad” had with Dave Johnson on the same subject over on treasurenet

Don’t know if you ever posted as “synchtoad”, but here’s some more quotes from that thread in August 2015 - maybe that’s the Dave Johnson quote you are looking for...

Here’s a cut from my response to you in that August 2015 thread

Since you state that Dave J. (AKA Dave Johnson Chief Designer at First Texas) is someone you respect, I'm pasting in this text from a post he made on Treasurenet on 08 Jul 14 under the name he uses there "Woof"

He's answering the same sort of question about FT product origins. The question was posted by someone going by the name of "sycotoad". This person lives in New Zealand and his writing style greatly resembles yours. Any connection? Here is what Dave J. Posted in Jul 14.

Originally Posted by sycotoad
”Well Larry if you knew what you were talking about you would realize that the 'good cheap bounty hunters' you speak of are MADE IN CHINA”

Like so much of corporate america's manufacturing these days -
There are two BH models designed in the USA and manufactured to our specifications under contract in China: the BH Junior and the new VLF. The BH Junior we also manufacture in El Paso depending on supply and demand. All other BH's are made in El Paso, as are all Teknetics and all Fishers.

--Dave J.

Here's the link, the post is #19 in the thread.

[www.treasurenet.com]

This sycotoad again On Friendly Forum in November 2013, he was on the same bone - BH's made in China. That time Bart of Big Boys Hobbies posted a response from Mike Scott, Marketing Director of FT. Here's that thread. it's post #17 Full text follows.

[metaldetectingforum.com]

The following info, Mike Scott of Fisher and Teknetics asked me to post for him.

All Teknetics and Fisher products are made in USA
The Bounty Hunter Jr and VLF 2.1 also known as the Prospector is the only model made in China due to the quantities required especially during fourth quarter. Sometimes these same units are manufactured in USA. The boxes for these products clearly call out by law ‘Made in China’ when we make runs in USA we put a ‘Made in USA’ sticker over the ‘Made in China’ label.
All of our metal tubes and metal parts come from our supplier in NJ USA and all our plastic comes from our supplier in AZ with a small amount coming from CA-these accounts for about 98% of the detector. Our boards are manufactured in our own warehouse so that’s 100% of our detectors not made overseas.
The other 2 percent for boards which are electronics components are purchased from US companies like Mouser but they probably source them from hi tech Asian companies since the majority of electronics components come from there. We do directly purchase a very small amount of our electronic components from these Asian companies like S Korea, Japan and China for manufacturing our own boards.

Counterfeit products are a problem and run by organized crime in China. USA and most of the civilized world in general enforces IP and Trademark infringement laws. They also advertise products they don’t have and either send nothing or not what you ordered in a classic bait and switch.
China does not care and protects criminals and organized crime that steal property from others around the world selling inferior products branded with others hard developed, researched ingenuity and Trademarks.
Supporting criminals and counterfeiters by buying their products is supporting thieves and organized crime no matter how you look at it. I would never support a thief or criminal because when you do that makes me no better than one myself…..

Thanks,
Dig Deep!
Mike Scott @ FTP

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 11/19/2018 01:01AM by lytle78.

All the italics are hurting my eyes.

good point,, but I wanted to emphasize that they are direct quotes - I’ll have to figure out something else.

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold

BeachBum Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Bruce Candy/Halcro/Minelab have been applying for
> and receiving patents for multi-frequency, complex
> waveform(BBS/FBS), and PI technology since at leas
> t 1990.
>
> [www.geotech1.com]
> 2360.pdf
>
> [www.geotech1.com]
> .pl?page=metdet&file=patents.dat
>
> [patents.justia.com]
> andy
>
> The current Minelab development team is staffed wi
> th a significant number of PhD level physicists.

Your (U.S.) tax dollars at work here (military defense contracts for mine detectors).

Wayne

thanks for that Mr Rick -

did you notice this?

"Like so much of corporate america's manufacturing these days -
There are two BH models designed in the USA and manufactured to our specifications under contract in China: the BH Junior and the new VLF. The BH Junior we also manufacture in El Paso depending on supply and demand. All other BH's are made in El Paso, as are all Teknetics and all Fishers.

--Dave J. "

is that TWO Models?

Twice as many as you originally stated Mr Rick -

Just sayin ........

[www.earthscan.co.nz]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/19/2018 09:02PM by rustic charm.

You are (for once) absolutely, positively right.

I said one model - and there are two. Pretty much everything you said and/or implied about skulduggery at First Texas was wrong.

You also stated that the two were “bestselling” models. That is true of the BHJR - acccording to Tim Mallory, VP of Sales and Marketing, the other one, the VLF 2.1 is a very low seller nowadays.

One other interesting point, the two detectors are the same electronically, only the mechanical package is different.

Hopefully you now have all this out of your system. When you are not going on about what decievers First Texas are, you often have interesting information and opinion to contribute - hopefully you will continue to do so.

Interestingly, Tim also mentioned in his email that with the Trump tariff war with China, the production there might end.

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/19/2018 09:01PM by lytle78.

lytle78 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> Interestingly, Tim also mentioned in his email that with the Trump tariff war with China, the production there might end.


The tariff war is doing a number on the stock market....FB isn't exactly helping either....

lytle78 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You are (for once) absolutely, positively right.

Again you have a problem with numbers NOT me
>
> I said one model - and there are two. Pretty much
> everything you said and/or implied about skuldugge
> ry at First Texas was wrong.

Re-read my initial post by which I still stand by - it starts with a question - "Could it be ........?"
Then you spun out in all maner of direction over old ground on which I have corrected you on every occassion - How are those Vikings going that are still being sold by FT Distributor in the Ukraine? - remember that? - All tied in with those GF2's everyone stated as a copy to the T2? - So what is the point of rehashing old discussions when I simply corrected you on product count in this thread?

Do you live by stirring up a @#$%& storm waiting for others to join in? - I am not attacking FT, however what you are continuing to do is to highlight stuff that has already been put to bed - If you do not like being corrected on posts then do your homework first or accept what others have to say without the hysteRICKs -
>
> You also stated that the two were “bestselling” mo
> dels. That is true of the BHJR - acccording to Ti
> m Mallory, VP of Sales and Marketing, the other on
> e, the VLF 2.1 is a very low seller nowadays.

At the time Mr Rick and according to another reputable member of FT, therefore I am NOT going to get those two disagreeing with each other simply because you do not like to be corrected & out of respect for those gentlemen.
>
> One other interesting point, the two detectors are
> the same electronically, only the mechanical packa
> ge is different.
>
> Hopefully you now have all this out of your system
> . When you are not going on about what decievers
> First Texas are, you often have interesting inform
> ation and opinion to contribute - hopefully you wi
> ll continue to do so.

Hopefully now you can get on with life knowing that FT has TWO (2) of their models being made off-shore not one Something you Sir should have been well aware of before spinning out

No need to apologize - I wouldn't want you to break tradition
>
> Interestingly, Tim also mentioned in his email tha
> t with the Trump tariff war with China, the produc
> tion there might end.

I haven't spoken with Tim today Mr Rick however I am positive he "might" be right - He is a clever man

[www.earthscan.co.nz]

Geotech Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> rustic charm Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > These are simply my beliefs Rick from my expe
> riences and what I have seen in the industry...[/i
> ]
>
> The problem, Rustic, is they are beliefs an
> d based on no first-hand experience. I worked for
> White's for 6 years, now work for FTP, and have to
> ured both the Garrett and Tesoro factories. I beli
> eve I have personally invited you to FTP in the pa
> st to show you, firsthand, just how wrong you are.

Well said Carl!!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/21/2018 04:48PM by SeabeeRon.

Cal_cobra Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> It'll be interesting to see how the China tariffs
> will affect detector prices.
>
> Starting 01/01/2019 - Finished goods made in Chin
> a 25% tariff, components sourced from China, 15% t
> ariff. That means you can expect a min. 15%-25%
> increase in "Made in America" detectors (and prett
> y much anything else that takes electricity to run
> ), unless vendors are willing to absorb the cost.
>
> These tariffs will put a lot of people out of jobs
> . Don't ever expect to see electronic component m
> anufacturing to come back to the U.S., that ship s
> ailed 40-50 years ago.
>
> Here's an interesting article for those that are i
> nterested to educate themselves on U.S. manufactur
> ing: [qz.com]
> t-manufacturing-thats-cost-americans-millions-of-j
> obs/

Amen Brian!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/21/2018 04:51PM by SeabeeRon.

lytle78 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> RC
>
> This is your clearest statement of your main point
> .
>
> ”You will quite easily find that there is more
> than one model involved and they are FT biggest se
> llers made to exacting specifications set down by
> FT - IMO, It would stand to reason that over time
> those numbers and models would have increased, oth
> erwise FT Board should be sacked for not doing the
> ir job
>
> More than one model
> They are FT biggest sellers
> Over time those numbers and models would have incr
> eased.
>
> I contacted Tim Mallory, the VP of Sales and Marke
> ting at FT and asked him if my information that on
> ly one FT model was made in china was correct. tur
> ns out that I was wrong - there are in fact two -
> although, I confess I have never heard of the seco
> nd one. Here is a quote from the email he sent me
> today (Sunday, guess he thought it was important t
> o set the record straight)..
>
> ”We have 2 metal detector models that we make i
> n China. The BHJR and the VLF 2.1. The BHJR is our
> best selling model, at XX.XX wholesale. The VLF 2.
> 1 is very slow selling....We have no intention of
> expanding our ‘made in china’ products.“
>
> In a follow-on email, he explained that the VLF 2.
> 1 is the same as the BHJR, but in an adult package
> .
>
> I redacted the wholesale price since that is propr
> ietary information - but it’s awfully low.
>
> So congrats - I was wrong - there is not one model
> - there are two - the Bounty Hunter Junior plus an
> other one - the VLF 2.1 which lists for $65 on Ama
> zon.
>
> By the way, Page 11 of the manual of the VLF 2.1 s
> tates “Made in China”. Pretty clear.
>
> No subterfuge, no fraud, no false claims of “Made
> in USA” Just a company which makes dozens of diffe
> rent models which qualify for their correct US ori
> gin labeling by being assembled and tested in El P
> aso Texas from imported and US sourced parts - and
> sells two models where - in the case of the GHJR -
> part of the production is in China (others are fro
> m El Paso) and in the case of the slow selling VLF
> 2.1 all are “Made in China”. All packageing is cle
> arly labeled with the correct information as to “c
> ountry of origin” in accordance with US Federal Tr
> ade Commission requirements.
>
> You have been at this insinuation and accusation c
> ampaign a long time now...Here’s a quote from your
> post of 17 August 2015 on this forum
>
> [www.dankowskidetectors.com]
> .php?2,90736,90868#msg-90868
>
> Can you name the two Bounty Hunters they make i
> n China? - from what I was told they are Bounty Hu
> nters biggest sellers & why would they stop at jus
> t two of their models being made there? - Do they
> tell their customers that those models are Made in
> China?
> Its my opinion that there is a lot more than meets
> the eye with not only First Texas products but Gar
> rett as well - Are they being completely honest wi
> th their customers as to where their products are
> made?
>
> So congrats again - I told you then about the BHJR
> , but my information did not include info on the V
> LF 2.1 (as if anybody here ever heard of it anyway
> ) - score one for you. But as to the rest of your
> insinuation that they - and Garrett - are fraudule
> ntly labeling made in china units - as the Queen w
> ould say - “Utter Rubbish”
>
> Interestingly, the same thread goes on - where I p
> ost links to a discussion someone posting as “sync
> htoad” had with Dave Johnson on the same subject o
> ver on treasurenet
>
> Don’t know if you ever posted as “synchtoad”, but
> here’s some more quotes from that thread in August
> 2015 - maybe that’s the Dave Johnson quote you are
> looking for...
>
> Here’s a cut from my response to you in that Augus
> t 2015 thread
>
> Since you state that Dave J. (AKA Dave Johnson Chi
> ef Designer at First Texas) is someone you respect
> , I'm pasting in this text from a post he made on
> Treasurenet on 08 Jul 14 under the name he uses th
> ere "Woof"
>
> He's answering the same sort of question about FT
> product origins. The question was posted by someon
> e going by the name of "sycotoad". This person liv
> es in New Zealand and his writing style greatly re
> sembles yours. Any connection? Here is what Dave J
> . Posted in Jul 14.
>
> Originally Posted by sycotoad
> ”Well Larry if you knew what you were talking a
> bout you would realize that the 'good cheap bounty
> hunters' you speak of are MADE IN CHINA”
>
> Like so much of corporate america's manufacturing
> these days -
> There are two BH models designed in the USA and ma
> nufactured to our specifications under contract in
> China: the BH Junior and the new VLF. The BH Junio
> r we also manufacture in El Paso depending on supp
> ly and demand. All other BH's are made in El Paso,
> as are all Teknetics and all Fishers.
>
> --Dave J.
>
> Here's the link, the post is #19 in the thread.
>
> [www.treasurenet.com]
> 070-china-metal-detectors-not-copied-priate-models
> -2.html
>
> This sycotoad again On Friendly Forum in November
> 2013, he was on the same bone - BH's made in China
> . That time Bart of Big Boys Hobbies posted a resp
> onse from Mike Scott, Marketing Director of FT. He
> re's that thread. it's post #17 Full text follows.
>
> [metaldetectingforum.com]
> 0223
>
> The following info, Mike Scott of F
> isher and Teknetics asked me to post for him.
>
> All Teknetics and Fisher products are made in USA
> The Bounty Hunter Jr and VLF 2.1 also known as the
> Prospector is the only model made in China due to
> the quantities required especially during fourth q
> uarter. Sometimes these same units are manufacture
> d in USA. The boxes for these products clearly cal
> l out by law ‘Made in China’ when we make runs in
> USA we put a ‘Made in USA’ sticker over the ‘Made
> in China’ label.
> All of our metal tubes and metal parts come from o
> ur supplier in NJ USA and all our plastic comes fr
> om our supplier in AZ with a small amount coming f
> rom CA-these accounts for about 98% of the detecto
> r. Our boards are manufactured in our own warehous
> e so that’s 100% of our detectors not made oversea
> s.
> The other 2 percent for boards which are electroni
> cs components are purchased from US companies like
> Mouser but they probably source them from hi tech
> Asian companies since the majority of electronics
> components come from there. We do directly purchas
> e a very small amount of our electronic components
> from these Asian companies like S Korea, Japan and
> China for manufacturing our own boards.
>
> Counterfeit products are a problem and run by orga
> nized crime in China. USA and most of the civilize
> d world in general enforces IP and Trademark infri
> ngement laws. They also advertise products they do
> n’t have and either send nothing or not what you o
> rdered in a classic bait and switch.
> China does not care and protects criminals and org
> anized crime that steal property from others aroun
> d the world selling inferior products branded with
> others hard developed, researched ingenuity and Tr
> ademarks.
> Supporting criminals and counterfeiters by buying
> their products is supporting thieves and organized
> crime no matter how you look at it. I would never
> support a thief or criminal because when you do th
> at makes me no better than one myself…..
>
> Thanks,
> Dig Deep!
> Mike Scott @ FTP

Thanks for the links Rick!!

To me it comes down to cost. American companies don't wish to invest money into new ventures, so they pull a re-boxing and hope they get away with it.

This is the modern age, and we are just now producing detectors than can compete with the stuff from the late 1990's. So USA is about 20 years behind in detector tech.

Truth is, there is little faith when having huge profits with detectors from the USA manufacturers. So while they drag their feet the foreign market is creating new innovations and taking notes from what real customers want. If you feel that Nokta has no new innovations, then you aren't experienced to know the difference.

IF I was an American manufacturer wanting to get back into the market, I would focus heavily on R&D. The beep/dig and guess days are well into the past.

American manufacturing: While I would agree, it would be nice if America stepped up in the manufacturing world, It is a moot point as long as these greedy CEOs/management's profits are in danger. The very thing that built this country(capitalism) Will be the very thing that destroys it because it, like anything in life, is being abused.

A lot of good points were made above, being an American, I say that the country is more than just manufacturing. It's a set of ideals. We take the best from everything and become the best...when we want to. Currently, I believe, we have huge oil reserves and large amount of shale oil under the ground that we don't use. America has a doctrine that we deplete the resources of the world first, then we use our own. We buy all outside the USA and what do we lose? Some paper. Pretty smart.

well said

[www.earthscan.co.nz]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/21/2018 10:49PM by rustic charm.

If it hasn't already done so, maybe the US government should support their detector manufacturers by offering tax incentives on R&D rather than taking the easy way out by simply hiking tariffs on imports just to make them competitve.

Why do Minelab have such an aggressive R&D program, maybe it's since they can get up to 43.5% of their R&D costs reimbursed via a government R&D Incentive scheme. Turkish manufacturers also have a similar support from their governent to aggressively pursue R&D.

So it's not a case of propping up or providing protection for companies, it's more about rewarding those that actively pursue innovation and the resultant products from that innovation.

Tom_in_CA Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Cal_cobra Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
>
> >
> > Yet you choose to use an overseas machine, when
> yo
> > u could be using a White's V3i (probably the mos
> t
> > similar to your Explorer from a U.S. vendor) or
> CZ
> > or other (not many to choose from) MultiFreq mac
> hi
> > ne
>
>
> Correct. But notice I'd clarified that ..... like
> you say ..... there are similar American made mach
> ines. Nothing vastly superior there vs here. T
> hey're all good machines, once you're comparing ap
> ples to apples.


Tom,

Do you and Brian ride in the same vehicle on your outings? Or do you take separate vehicles?


Rich -

------------------------------------------------------------------

Just one more good target before I go.

Dan B Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> A lot of Americans think that Henry Ford invented
> the car. He didn’t. He didn't invent mass producti
> on either. He was the first person to marry the tw
> o together and founded the Ford Motor company afte
> r a couple of failed attempts (out of the second a
> ttempt sprang Cadillac). The car was invented in G
> ermany.
>
> Electricity may have been pioneered in the US, but
> if it wasn’t for the Serbian Nicola Tesla we would
> n’t be where we are today. Edison pushed for direc
> t current but it was Tesla that discovered the con
> cept of alternating current, fluorescent lighting,
> radio control, etc.
>
> The telephone was invented by the Scottish born Al
> exander Graham Bell while living in Canada, althou
> gh it seems that there were around 18 other people
> who also were working on that concept as well, and
> led to several lawsuits. But simultaneous discover
> ies are not that uncommon in science. Also, the su
> bject dear to our hearts, metal detecting, was als
> o invented by Bell in 1881.
>
> At least the US gave us basketball, right? Not exa
> ctly.
>
> Hip hop. There you go. As American as baseball and
> apple pie (oops, thats from England).


So what is America good for Dan? Inquiring minds want to know.

------------------------------------------------------------------

Just one more good target before I go.

So what is America good for Dan? Inquiring minds want to know.

Representing the best of what a country, a people ,a duly elected government, a society can be.
Oh, and everything that comes out of that.

Gonebeepin' Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
....
>
>
> Tom,
>
> Do you and Brian ride in the same vehicle on your
> outings? Or do you take separate vehicles?
>
>
> Rich -

Huh ? What's the point ? We carpool. And trade off whose vehicle we use, depending on specifics of the drive (he has better 4wd ability, if we're going to be going off-road). Are you referring to subjects talked about on long drives to our spots?

We each have our talents, bees-in-bonnet, etc... that we bring to the table. He proposes some spots that turn out to be lame, as have I. But each of us has come up with some reconn's that have turned out to be memorable spots (busts, gold coins, reales, seateds, etc....) .

Post-script to add to this post in general : It still seems that the implicit "given", is that the USA has failed to keep up with whatever-is-being offered from foreign makers. I still disagree with that . Unless someone is being lured by the whiz-bang ads promising to show shape and composition (with is B.S. for the coin/relic hunting purposes), then I say that American made detectors can accomplish anything being put out by the foreign makers.

In fact, in the last 20-ish years, it's only been whistles and bells improvements for ALL detectors, no matter WHICH continent. JMHO



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 11/24/2018 03:06PM by Tom_in_CA.

this is basically accurate! speeding up processors (clock speed) is significant
for trash laden sites (just about everywhere!).ability to "pick out high conductors" amongst trash,utilizing "iron audio" is significant.sufficient depth was accomplished back in the 80's with the introduction of (v.l.f.),so you HAD "great" depth back then!..other than these improvements pretty much all else is "window dressing"

(h.h.!)
j.t.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/24/2018 04:52PM by jmaryt.

Gonebeepin' Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Dan B Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > A lot of Americans think that Henry Ford invente
> d
> > the car. He didn’t. He didn't invent mass produc
> ti
> > on either. He was the first person to marry the
> tw
> > o together and founded the Ford Motor company af
> te
> > r a couple of failed attempts (out of the second
> a
> > ttempt sprang Cadillac). The car was invented in
> G
> > ermany.
> >
> > Electricity may have been pioneered in the US, b
> ut
> > if it wasn’t for the Serbian Nicola Tesla we wou
> ld
> > n’t be where we are today. Edison pushed for dir
> ec
> > t current but it was Tesla that discovered the c
> on
> > cept of alternating current, fluorescent lightin
> g,
> > radio control, etc.
> >
> > The telephone was invented by the Scottish born
> Al
> > exander Graham Bell while living in Canada, alth
> ou
> > gh it seems that there were around 18 other peop
> le
> > who also were working on that concept as well, a
> nd
> > led to several lawsuits. But simultaneous discov
> er
> > ies are not that uncommon in science. Also, the
> su
> > bject dear to our hearts, metal detecting, was a
> ls
> > o invented by Bell in 1881.
> >
> > At least the US gave us basketball, right? Not e
> xa
> > ctly.
> >
> > Hip hop. There you go. As American as baseball a
> nd
> > apple pie (oops, thats from England).
>
>
> So what is America good for Dan? Inquiring min
> ds want to know.

The right to speak your mind and pretty women.

Aurelic Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If it hasn't already done so, maybe the US governm
> ent should support their detector manufacturers by
> offering tax incentives on R&D rather than taking
> the easy way out by simply hiking tariffs on impor
> ts just to make them competitve.
>
> Why do Minelab have such an aggressive R&D program
> , maybe it's since they can get up to 43.5% of the
> ir R&D costs reimbursed via a government R&D Incen
> tive scheme. Turkish manufacturers also have a si
> milar support from their governent to aggressively
> pursue R&D.
>
> So it's not a case of propping up or providing pro
> tection for companies, it's more about rewarding t
> hose that actively pursue innovation and the resul
> tant products from that innovation.

Awesome - Not only identified a huge problem with US manufacturing but also provided an answer on how to fix one aspect of staying competitive -

One has to wonder why the mighty US Govt cannot come up with incentives like this?

[www.earthscan.co.nz]

And who do you think pays for "incentives like this?" HH jim tn

E-Scan - They do come up with them. Mostly at the state and municipal level where tax breaks and infrastructure improvements are common. We save the big incentives for pro sports arenas however- lol.

Who pays? Our grandchildren - None of us are very good at living within our means – that goes for the population – look at the levels of consumer credit debt – and government – look at the current national deficit.

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold

Tom_in_CA Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Gonebeepin' Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> ....
> >
> >
> > Tom,
> >
> > Do you and Brian ride in the same vehicle on you
> r
> > outings? Or do you take separate vehicles?
>
> >
> >
> > Rich -
>
> Huh ? What's the point ? We carpool. And trad
> e off whose vehicle we use, depending on specifics
> of the drive (he has better 4wd ability, if we're
> going to be going off-road). Are you referring t
> o subjects talked about on long drives to our spot
> s?
>
> We each have our talents, bees-in-bonnet, etc...
> that we bring to the table. He proposes some spot
> s that turn out to be lame, as have I. But each
> of us has come up with some reconn's that have tur
> ned out to be memorable spots (busts, gold coins,
> reales, seateds, etc....) .
>
> Post-script to add to this post in general : It
> still seems that the implicit "given", is that the
> USA has failed to keep up with whatever-is-being o
> ffered from foreign makers. I still disagree wit
> h that . Unless someone is being lured by the whi
> z-bang ads promising to show shape and composition
> (with is B.S. for the coin/relic hunting purposes)
> , then I say that American made detectors can acco
> mplish anything being put out by the foreign maker
> s.
>
> In fact, in the last 20-ish years, it's only been
> whistles and bells improvements for ALL detectors,
> no matter WHICH continent. JMHO


Sorry Tom, i should have clarified. I was just referring to the interesting discussions the two of you must have along the way, if you're riding together. Nothing more.


Rich

------------------------------------------------------------------

Just one more good target before I go.

jim tn Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> And who do you think pays for "incentives like thi
> s?" HH jim tn

the very same people who are paying for it to be made off-shore now ..... US

it must work - you only have to look at those manufacturers who are getting R & D relief from their Govt's to know this

[www.earthscan.co.nz]

goodmore Wrote:

>
> The right to speak your mind and pretty women.


Almost all countries have pretty women

Cal_cobra Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> goodmore Wrote:
>
> >
> > The right to speak your mind and pretty women.
>
>
> Almost all countries have pretty women


Give us a list of the ones that don't (have pretty women).

D&P-OR Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Cal_cobra Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > goodmore Wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > The right to speak your mind and pretty women.
> >
> >
> > Almost all countries have pretty women
>
>
> Give us a list of the ones that don't (have pretty women).


I don't have a list , had to add the "almost" as beauty is in the eye of the beholder and all that

Tom_in_CA Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Gonebeepin' Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> ....
> >
> >
> > Tom,
> >
> > Do you and Brian ride in the same vehicle on your outings? Or do you take separate vehicles?
> >
> > Rich -
>
> Huh ? What's the point ? We carpool. And trade off whose vehicle we use, depending on specifics of the drive (he has better 4wd ability, if we're going to be going off-road). Are you referring to subjects talked about on long drives to our spots?
>

Tom since when did you have 4WD capability, did you get a new vehicle?? Please say it's so

Not to put words in Richs' mouth, but I'm sure our online bantering could be construed as for making insufferable driving conditions, if we were say, locked in a vehicle for 8 hours at a time

Although Tom and I are as different as they come, we have great conversations on our adventures. Both having a passion for west coast history, and enjoyment of researching (to a fault) we sleuth some great sites, and occasionally make some decent finds. Adventurous souls, great scenery, great travels and great friendships are all benefits of this great hobby