Micro gold hunting on lake beaches

Ive got an earring like that larger hollow one there (third from the bottom)........ NO my Xcal and CTX WONT hit on it. I see three or four pieces that someone with experience MIGHT get with the Xcal. Smallest piece ive found was a .3 gram thou. Also..... you better have the coil on the bottom. MOST hunters arent going out to micro hunt either. They are running in AM and getting down the trough as fast as they can. To do this kind of hunting you have to be willing to sacrifice other heavy pieces of gold and high conductors...... you would be working in a very narrow TID range.... and it would be a planned hunt.... and mind set.

Dew- what kind of small gold are you finding w the 18kHz Tarsacci?

TARSACCI - “Digging deeper, BEHIND the competition!”
[forums.tarsaccisales.com]

dewcon4414 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ........ NO my Xcal and
> CTX WONT hit on it. ....

Yup. Standard coins machines used-for-the-beach (like the CTX, Excal, CZ's, etc... ) will miss such things.

I had a very high-end touristy dry sand beach area (Truly a beach that millionaires frequent) that had .... to my knowledge, ... only ever been worked by standard machines. Perhaps some people have dilly-dallied through it with pulse machines, at best (and no doubt spent lots of time digging bobby pins, nails, etc...). So when the Nox 800 came out, which touted simultaneous iron rejection (as could be expected on coin machines), while at-the-same time capable of micro-jewelry (without being punished by iron), I figured this high-end affluent beach zone would be a good test spot.

Mind you I've pulled over 100 silvers from this zone (long after others had likewise pounded it), and un-told #'s of wheaties, buffalos, etc.... And now, all these years later, there's entire zones of nothing but silence, when using standard machines. It stood-to-reason that there *must* be micro-jewelry there.

And I was simply amazed at the machine gun fire of so-many-targets. Checking each one, you're right : Tteeennnsssyyy conductive targets that standard machines wouldn't even get a whisper on !

But as said : I soon learned that the "devil is in the details". I have no doubt that .... eventually .... yes ... an earring stud or post or tinsel thin chain would turn up. But after nearly an hour, I found myself subconsciously passing those super low #'s, willing to gamble on "slightly larger micro-jewelry". Yup, kiss that earring stud or tinsel thin chain goodbye

IIRC when Nasa Tom published his article on hunting for micro jewelry, it wasn't for the pathetic amount of gold that's been alluded too, it was for the stones set in the gold. Even a high end quarter carat diamond can fetch a decent price, but the price starts to escalate when you get into the one plus carat high quality diamonds.

Cal_cobra Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> IIRC when Nasa Tom published his article on huntin
> g for micro jewelry, it wasn't for the pathetic am
> ount of gold that's been alluded too, it was for t
> he stones set in the gold. Even a high end quarte
> r carat diamond can fetch a decent price, but the
> price starts to escalate when you get into the one
> plus carat high quality diamonds.

The question is.....how much micro jewelry contains decent size stones? If I was a betting man (and I am) I would go all in on rings and necklaces containing more valuable stones. Sure there are exceptions. But over all it has to be a run away.

Is there an opportunity for micro hunting? I would definitely say yes because of the tedious work involved.

Would I switch to it because of the lack of large targets? Nope! I would rather not hunt. That is my opinion.

I salt water hunt. Been plenty of days of nothing but clad. But every tide brings new opportunity. So I keep telling myself.

This is an excellent thread. Equipment to use. How to set it up. All great info for those that want to micro hunt. I remember Toms video on the stud he found with the great stone. Fantastic find. So I would say yes it can be done. My point is just know what you are getting into. Know yourself. I know I couldn't do it.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/08/2019 11:01PM by goodmore.

Wish I could rock that foil to gold ratio!
cjc

I agree there is always room for some selectivity. This below 6 range will eat you alive--especially in that many of these new machines discriminate as much by size as by conductivity--these micros can be anything...cjc

Way to go, Aaron--it's a good system for checking consistency. It's hard enough above 6. cjc

Aaron Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> 2.5 hrs this evening at the lake using the EQX in
> 40khz, Park #1. If it was loaded full of micro or
> gold of any kind, my coil didn’t go over it. In fa
> ct, I only dug 1 piece of aluminum, Pharmaceutical
> capsule foil. Very unusual. I ended up finding ALO
> T of quarters, 2 dimes 2 copper pennies and 1 zinc
> . No nickels. Somebody’s workin it hard not even b
> othering w the high conductors.
> There was a elderly gentleman in the water who’s b
> een detecting since 77’ We both have been hunting
> this lake for many years and agreed that water det
> ecting has become a very commonplace now at the la
> kes, not like it was even 10yrs ago. Hate to see w
> hat it be like if gold was $2k a oz.
> Next week I’ll go back w the 15”x12” an cover more
> ground @ 40khz.
>
> Aaron

Aaron I’ve just not taken but a couple of days to use the 18khz. I did find a cross last month and ring using it in the dry sand. I’ve shown the tiny stuff I dig....and that’s using 9khz. I’m chasing recent drops currently in the water....nothing real tiny coming from out there. I’m impressed with Harry’s finds. Tell me it’s out there but no on wants to....or is able to find it. I do a little more of that in the winter. TIME.... something you never have enough of out there on a larger beach. Micro gold hunting to me has to be planned.....

goodmore Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

>
> The question is.....how much micro jewelry contain
> s decent size stones? If I was a betting man (and
> I am) I would go all in on rings and necklaces con
> taining more valuable stones. Sure there are excep
> tions. But over all it has to be a run away.
>

I would bet the same.

A way to test the theory, is to simply go into a swanky well-stocked jewelry store. And ask the clerk : "Out of all the high end diamonds here, do you have any that are set in things like earrings, fine-dainty necklace settings, etc...". I'll bet that the clerk could show you very few, that are of any high value. BUT ON THE OTHER HAND: If you asked to see "high end diamonds" fashioned in rings , I'll bet that the clerk would have no difficulty showing you a wide array of large diamonds set in rings.

Are there exceptions ? Sure. But if you are faced with a limited # of targets that your time allows you to dig in-a-day, then .... sometimes you have to make tough choices @ strategies. And sometimes "strip-mining" is not the best strategy.

There are rings that would be difficult to pick up with standard machines : "wire rings". But those would be the very rare exceptions. Because even dainty ladies rings are typically picked up by standard machines (albeit ... you have to be more careful listener )

Lake beaches and saltwater beaches are two totally different animals. Besides the obvious water content difference, most freshwater beach areas are very small. One of my biggest beach/swim areas is just approx 50-60 yards long. The dry sand areas are imported in here...and nobody sets up chairs or umbrellas in it. Everyone opts to stage and setup in grassy and shaded areas adjacent to the sand and water. It doesn't take long to cover the hot spots on a freshwater beach. Last summer when my work schedule was great, I would hit the beaches in a rotation schedule and could do 2 or 3 before the swimmers started to arrive. That was my cue to leave when they started to arrive.

Another thing...sometimes its just fun to get out and detect, without worrying about making some big find to make it "worth the effort". Micro jewelry hunting ain't for everyone but I don't see why others have to knock people for doing it. Fired civil war bullets are practically worthless in monetary value but some times we just get the itch to go find something old and a change of pace, so we go spend a day and dig fired bullets. I see the same with micro jewelry hunting. Sometimes it's just fun to get out and go detecting, and some times the challenge is fun. I like bass fishing with all the latest gear, but sometimes its fun to go out with an ultralite rod, some bobbers and some red worms. Might be a waste of time in some people's eyes but it's my time to waste.

goodmore Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Cal_cobra Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > IIRC when Nasa Tom published his article on hunt
> in
> > g for micro jewelry, it wasn't for the pathetic
> am
> > ount of gold that's been alluded too, it was for
> t
> > he stones set in the gold. Even a high end quar
> te
> > r carat diamond can fetch a decent price, but th
> e
> > price starts to escalate when you get into the o
> ne
> > plus carat high quality diamonds.
>
> The question is.....how much micro jewelry contain
> s decent size stones? If I was a betting man (and
> I am) I would go all in on rings and necklaces con
> taining more valuable stones. Sure there are excep
> tions. But over all it has to be a run away.
>
> Is there an opportunity for micro hunting? I would
> definitely say yes because of the tedious work inv
> olved.
>
> Would I switch to it because of the lack of large
> targets? Nope! I would rather not hunt. That is my
> opinion.
>
> I salt water hunt. Been plenty of days of nothing
> but clad. But every tide brings new opportunity. S
> o I keep telling myself.
>
> This is an excellent thread. Equipment to use. How
> to set it up. All great info for those that want t
> o micro hunt. I remember Toms video on the stud he
> found with the great stone. Fantastic find. So I w
> ould say yes it can be done. My point is just know
> what you are getting into. Know yourself. I know I
> couldn't do it.


Totally agree, if I was playing the odds, I wouldn't kill myself hunting for ice, I'd also go for rings, big chains, pendants, etc. There's probably better odds that you'd get a nice stone in a ring or pendants as there would be in earring studs.

My friend TomCA has done a lot of beach hunting (decades) and I don't believe he's ever found an expensive stone piece of jewelry, and heck he lives and hunts some of the most touristy (read rich people hang outs) places in California.

Cal_cobra Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

>
> My friend TomCA has done a lot of beach hunting (d
> ecades) and I don't believe he's ever found an exp
> ensive stone piece of jewelry, and heck he lives a
> nd hunts some of the most touristy (read rich peop
> le hang outs) places in California.


Ouch. I've been "outed". Yup. This is the running cruel joke in my sphere /circle of beach-storm erosion hunters here : I've seen it "as good as it gets". Yet in all these decades, think I've found a single diamond @ ~ 1/3 karat. A few @ ~ 1/4 karat (which are hardly worth fretting over for appraisals). So I've concluded that : High end diamonds don't like me

It's not for lack of targets (eg.: coins, rings, right conditions, oodles of "low conductors", etc...). I just never got any high end stones . One of my peers, who's been down the same evolutionary track as myself (all the same beaches and storm-years , etc...) has several diamonds that approach 1 karat (or more ?). And also has more platinum.

I evolved to be more land/relic hunting . Others evolve to be more beach hunting. It stands to reason that you'll end up with more jewelry, if your focus is beach hunting. Still though : I've been gypped , when it comes to jewelry/stone odds. Given the relative hours/years involved Oddly, I've gotten the better "old coin episode" odds trophy holdings, for some reason. Eg.: the most silver coins in a day. The most gold coins found @ beach erosion, etc.... But for some reason: Beach jewelry hasn't been my stomping grounds. Doh !

Is it possible the type of beaches we all hunt makes a difference in what we want to hunt based on what is found? We here in Florida have a lot of fluffy fine sand in the golf ..... the other side of the island is grany and deep. Calf.....has a much different coast line than say NJ as well. Daniel....... we think a like. Apparently ..... we have convinced the detector companies we only want to find RING....... deep RINGS on the beach. In the same light...... in the dry sand why do you need a detector to go 20"....... most are just looking for recent drops....... big coils for coverage, swinging a foot off the sand and covering as much beach as they can FAST........ and they run their machines as HOT as they can while doing it. Im just as guilty....... i cant say ive ever found a ring 14" deep in the dry sand. Sooooo to me id rather kick some foil and see what pops out in the first 6 to 8" of sand. You arent digging to China for these micro gold targets...... and its a smaller TID range. But most of our issue is ....... we still want to DIG IT ALL......no matter the TID....and most of us are using AM to boot. Also...... its not normal to micro gold hunt...... why? Because it required a gold machine to do which limited us to the dry sand in most cases.......... not any more, thats changing. Many .... see this as nickel and dime hunting...... yet they chase high conductors all day long. Now thats something i dont get......... if you are looking for gold no matter the size... all your settings, a pattern, and the type of machine you use should be geared toward that.... ignore most everything else. Ive not seen much gold up-scale..... and rarely gold even in the penny range unless its a class ring....... and deep, even those will come in lower. To me...... its way to time consuming to hunt for EVERYTHING.

Aaron...... doesnt park knock out digits 1 and 2? As far as the MDT...... im not certain how the machine was designed. I know Tom mentioned its superior depth on all gold rings over most of the machines we currently use at the beach. 18khz...... vs 40khz.... may or may not find most of the gold Harry found in the dry sand. I tried about an hour yesterday in the rain with the Nox using a very narrow pattern .... there is a lot of fine foil, but its not deep,most i could kick with my foot. I did notice a lot of it came in as TID 1 ..... where as on the MDT small foil was coming in it seems at 4.... so just what does come in 1 to 4 on the MDT. I may give it a run today to see. But man.... that system in the Gulf has the wind blowing and rain rain rain all week.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/09/2019 10:56AM by dewcon4414.

dewcon4414 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> Is it possible the type of beaches we all hunt mak
> es a difference in what we want to hunt based on w
> hat is found? We here in Florida have a lot of f
> luffy fine sand in the golf ..... the other side o
> f the island is grany and deep. Calf.....has a mu
> ch different coast line than say NJ as well.


this is true for wet-sand inter-tidal zone. But for dry-sand zones (above all recent storm/erosion episodes), this wouldn't seem to hold true.


> not any more, thats changing.....

Correct. I recall the era when: If anyone ever wanted to angle for fine-dainty chains/studs, he HAD to have a pulse machine . Which, of course, wasn't capable of disc'ing out iron. Thus ... heaven-help that poor soul if he landed on a iron laden beach. But now there's machines that can A) pass iron, but B ) get micro-jewelry. All at the same time. It's debatable as-to-whether this feat can be done @ the wet-salt inter-tidal zone (versus dry sand). But .... still ... vast leaps forward.


> .... Now thats something
> i dont get......... if you are looking for gold no
> matter the size... all your settings, a pattern, a
> nd the type of machine you use should be geared to
> ward that.... ignore most everything else. Ive n
> ot seen much gold up-scale..... and rarely gold ev
> en in the penny range unless its a class ring.....

Ok. But this is still things that "normal coin machines" can accomplish . You don't need machine capable of "micro-jewelry", to accomplish such goals.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/09/2019 10:52AM by Tom_in_CA.

But...... my point was more that you mentioned salt water machines like the CZ, Xcal, and CTX. Machines that operate in the salt water........ not many are finding these kind of micro gold targets unless you put the coil on them. We are talking in some cases 1/2" depth on some machines at best. From watching most hunters on the sand....... that aint happening lol. We dont agree a normal coin machine is going to find those targets in the dry sand...... unless they have adjustable freqs.... then i wouldnt call them NORMAL. Micro gold hunting is a nitch ....i dont believe someone hunting for EVERYTHING that beeps is going to dig much in the foil range for very long. I believe most of those would fall in that 1 to 4 TID on the Nox....... and its one sensitive machine. But even it using multi freq wont hit the micro gold that deep as compared to higher freq use. Its certainly a type of hunting not for everyone..... most dont see the pay off vs the time and trash dug. Another big factor like i said ...... is TIME and maybe beach location....... Fl vs Calf. Different mind set and sand.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/09/2019 11:55AM by dewcon4414.

I'm with Goodmore, I hate Micro hunting and the beach's I do hunt have it. Recently hunted with a Nox owner, he scored a small piece of gold chain. He swung it past the excalibur, not even a squeak. Rubbed on the coil, Nada.

Location can play a big part also, has to be there for you to find it, after 4 years of searching for a spot I stumbled onto it 10 days ago. Could be my beach of the year. 3 hunts 13 gold rings, less then 12 hours hunt time. High tides are keeping me at bay, just have to slip in when they are low, been rare of late.

Blood Member of RingKeepers
2020......Gold Rings....73....Misc Gold 1 .......Silvers ...110

I really like how good this conversation has been about this topic.

In the small freshwater pond beaches here, the bed does not change significantly.
Where I have found more than one and a half dozen medals, there are only 2-3 chains. Some of these will probably be found.
In the first round, the coins and silver and the various rings, silver chains came out. Over the years, the targets have gone out and the area has become quiet. Small jewelry was the focus of attention.
That's it.

Thanks to everyone for the tips.
It was necessary to change the equipment to find small objects.
I put a plastic net on the bottom and the lower side of the scoop. glued with silicone, works fine. I saw the scoop edge in several places, catching the chains. I put a plus layer plastic net with small holes on the sifter.

Is it possible that what I thought of as ground noise (with Nox) is all of the tiny things? Even if some of them are just ghost objects, they are amazing.

dewcon4414 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> But...... my point was more that you mentioned sal
> t water machines like the CZ, Xcal, and CTX. Mac
> hines that operate in the salt water........ not m
> any are finding these kind of micro gold targets u
> nless you put the coil on them. We are talking in
> some cases 1/2" depth on some machines at best.
>

I will grant you that : Even though I have utterly no use for "micro-jewelry" hunting @ zones that are potentially littered with tiny-foil-turds, yet :

You're right : There can be times, on the inter-tidal wet-salt-sand zone, where : Mother nature might have washed away all light weight targets (ie.: zero foil-turds). Yet left heavier items, like earring studs, charms, chains, etc..... And yes: The CZ's, excal, CTX, etc... will not find those. In those situations, ...... yes .... I would not belittle having a machine like the 800. Where : you can act like you're normal coin/jewelry hunting (passing iron, dealing with salt, etc....) YET AT THE SAME TIME capable (if you so elected) to get micro-jewelry.

For example: I once heard of some guys @ a So. CA beach, after storm erosion, who were going crazy digging coins and targets. And one of the eyeballed a tinsel thin chain right on top of the ground ! He passed his detector over it, and it wouldn't even produce a peep ! So ... as the day progressed, he kept his eyes peeled for more eye-ball finds like that. And found another couple of chains ! That likewise: Didn't produce a peep . Barring, of course, if he saw them first and knew exactly where to swing. So he went and fetched a pronged garden rake, and proceeded to comb this entire eroded zone. On a hunch that there might be more chains that he simply wasn't seeing. He was rewarded with several more chains, by simply raking the beach.

In cases like that, I could see how the 800 might come into play. Granted: You have to "dumb it down a bit" to deal with the wet salt. But on the other hand, it will get teensier stuff than the Excal, Explorer, CTX, etc....

Not sure if there's going to be other ttteennnsssyyy slag stuff that comes into that range though. Also, for those-of-us who study and chase storm erosion, there's a lot of times where ........ when those type conditions hit, it's a game of SPEED. Ie.: You might be in conditions so-thick that .... if items "fell through your scoop", you don't even bother scratching and clawing the ground to find them. You simply move over a few feet to the next beep.

Hence I have still not found a niche for it. But ... I'm willing to be converted. I keep bugging cal-cobra to get out for some side-by-side testing. But he keeps coming up with non-sense higher priorities . Some dribble about having a baby daughter to dote over, etc... Sheesskkk, where's a man's priorities, eh ?

Not really Tom. As long as you aren’t going in and out of the water the Nox is pretty hot in beach1. I played around a little in the towel line today raining and the beach was as flat and compacted. IMO a very good time to micro hunt. It really gains you inches plus the damp sand really lights up target response. Also....eyeball finds are more likely. I was running a limited window ...like 1 to 10 in gold 1 40khz. Then testing beach 1. I marked off a 20X20 square....you would be surprised how many targets there are. Beach hit a good many of them just not nearly as deep as gold mode. Really fun to play with. Yes I ended up with one heck of a foil ball. But a couple of gold earring backs after 4 hours. Digging for the most part was simply a few inches down. I’m guessing Harry is using beach 1 opting to loose a little depth and some tinsel gold allowing him to cover a little more beach and the wet sand. Have to say....gold mode is deep.

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold

I don't beach hunt so i can't add anything to the discussion but I've enjoyed the read.

HH
Mike

Hummmm 28 grams to an ounce.... average gold find 4 grams I’d guess.... then consider are you finding more 10 or 14k or even higher. Just looking at it thou that’s about 7 gold rings. The average hunter likely won’t get that in a month. 42 hours ....that’s about 6 days hunting for me. I assume his assumption is based on a productive site too? Even busy productive gold beaches can go cold....from competition, depositors, and weather. Sounds like the raw gold hunters have better odds.....but if u r in the wrong spot for raw gold...I like my odds lol. Then here we go....he’s surly talking professional hunters .....over say our 10% who may get most of the gold.

Dewcon: You find the gold earring back with Beach 1 or Gold mode? Have you used an 11" coil? There was salt water wet sand?
I'm going to repeat this test in a shallow freshwater area. The 20x20 square mean the 6x6 meters square?




dewcon4414 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Not really Tom. As long as you aren’t going in a
> nd out of the water the Nox is pretty hot in beach
> 1. I played around a little in the towel line to
> day raining and the beach was as flat and compacte
> d. IMO a very good time to micro hunt. It reall
> y gains you inches plus the damp sand really light
> s up target response. Also....eyeball finds are m
> ore likely. I was running a limited window ...li
> ke 1 to 10 in gold 1 40khz. Then testing beach 1.
> I marked off a 20X20 square....you would be surpri
> sed how many targets there are. Beach hit a good
> many of them just not nearly as deep as gold mode.
> Really fun to play with. Yes I ended up with one
> heck of a foil ball. But a couple of gold earrin
> g backs after 4 hours. Digging for the most part
> was simply a few inches down. I’m guessing Harry
> is using beach 1 opting to loose a little depth an
> d some tinsel gold allowing him to cover a little
> more beach and the wet sand. Have to say....gold
> mode is deep.

Gold mode....40 kHz for beach hunt the 11” I just like as an overall coil. I was hunting just above the current towel line. It had rained so the sand was very wet and very flat and hard packed. We don’t have a lot of minerals so the machine ran pretty smooth.

Thanks the info! I will test in shallow freshwater, the bottom is gravel with lot of minerals and tiny iron pieces.

Ok, the Equinox 800 w/ 6" coil can micro gold hunt. From my test on the 10k 3mm white gold earring, Gold 1 worked the best and the horseshoe needed to be on. All metal mode. Recovery 4 was the best in my mild ground. It got a nice small hit all around with the earring laying on the ground. No id. A nail on the ground screamed out. So seems it could be used for micro gold hunting.

Interesting results. Is that a 3mm ball on a stud? I assume without the back clasp?

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold

3 mm 4 pin with a cz in it. Very small. Yes pin only.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/18/2019 12:07AM by Rick, N. MI.

You want this machine to pick those up.... but most seem to not want all the trash that goes with dedicated gold machines. This one does a good job. Just curious....was this a found target?