XP DEUS-2 FIELD-TEST

I don't have the D2 and don't anticipate ever getting one BUT I enjoy & learn from NASA Tom's & everyone else's feedback & discussion on it & every other subject. It is what makes this forum so interesting & valuable to me.

Chris

Gary in Daytona Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Tom,
> Good to see you have a D2 in hand and giving it a
> go. Interesting to note that you have (very early)
> setting on many of the same settings I have set in
> my custom program. Looking forward to the ‘tweakin
> g’ stage and want to try some of the settings that
> you are having success with since our conditions a
> re so similar. A few notes from my experiences:
>
> 1. The ‘stand’ is a joke, it just doesn’t work, it
> ’s too small. I’ve suggest to some with 3D printin
> g capabilities to create a ‘slip over’ larger stan
> d solution. None that I know have been produced.
> 2. The lower shaft flex is real. But it doesn’t se
> em to bother me, however, the length of the shaft
> was off putting to me too. I bought a NM Simplex s
> tock lower (I couldn’t find the Carbon Fiber after
> market) and have been using it since it adds about
> 3 inches to the shaft and doesn’t seem to have the
> flex, at least with my swing speed.
> 3. The antenna is annoying at best. It does have t
> o be there as you know, because you just lose comm
> unications with the coil in just 2-3 inches of wat
> er. Many have already done some internal wiring, a
> nd I probably will to. I’d rather have a shaft set
> up with the antenna already wired, and another for
> inland hunting so I don’t have to bother having it
> on the D2 all the time. Steve mentioned he may lea
> ve holes in his shaft set up for that purpose if h
> e could get enough feedback that it would be usefu
> l. Maybe Steve can comment on that.
> 4. I have a 9” coil setup, but I have no problem ‘
> scrubbing’ the coil on the wet salt sand. I am not
> as disciplined as you are, but I do scrub quite of
> ten and I don’t have problem you described.
> 5. I have had very good success with custom progra
> ms built on BEACH and DIVE (tweaked up) that don’t
> include the ~45khz frequency. I think it’s because
> those progs quiet it down a bit around the water’s
> edge - more so than messing with Salt Sens. In som
> e tests I ran on deepies that turned out to be gol
> d or nickel type targets, I switched from one (cus
> tom) program to another (without 45khz) did not r
> esult in a significant loss of signal response for
> me.
> 6. I’m wondering if they chose to use “notch” with
> it’s extreme customization like others may use dis
> crimination (as you mentioned it’s more a tone bre
> ak), but not sure. I run flat out most of the time
> , to me, the less filtering the better. I too can
> hear the difference in targets like iron and bottl
> e caps.
> 7. I’d rather set Sensitivity down, rather than Sa
> lt Sensitivity. I note a loss in depth/sensitivity
> more-so with the latter.
> That’s my .02. Your mileage may vary.
>
> Will be enjoying this thread, especially in your o
> bservations with 11” coil. I’ve done very good wit
> h my 9” but have no comparison. Don’t think you ca
> n order extra coils yet, so I’m just waiting for t
> hem to become available.
>
> Gary

Gary,

You mentioned me a couple of times in your message, and I want to reply to your specific questions. I won't get into great detail here, as this is a thread for operation of the Deus 2, and not about the shaft per se, and so I don't want to "pollute" the thread with information about my upcoming shaft (I don't want to "thread-jack," and run the discussion of the D2 operation/function off into the weeds)! I'm going to make a post called "Steve's Detector Rods Deus 2 Shaft Project," where I'll give more detailed preliminary information. Anyone with thoughts, questions, or comments will then be able to discuss, in that thread.

For now, though, in response to your questions, I will say that the stand issue you mentioned has been addressed; the stand associated with the carbon-fiber arm cuff I've developed for my Deus shaft will be taller, and as such, I expect it to function properly as a "stand." The shaft "flex" will also be eliminated, and longer lower rods (and/or a longer middle shaft section, if one so desires) will of course be available -- I'm always happy to customize. And, as for the antenna wire running up/inside the shaft, YES, that is something I plan to offer. Not being a DEUS user myself, I don't have a feel for what would be the best way to accomplish this; I've talked to a few folks about how this might be best done, but certainly, a "simple" solution of a small "entry" hole in the underside of the lower rod, and then a similar, small "exit" hole on the underside of the middle shaft section, up near the control box mount, is easy to do. There are other options/ways to handle this, but right now it's where I'm leaning. If this is the way I seek to facilitate the "inside the shaft" wire run, I would seek to procure some small rubber "grommets" to line the holes, so as to add a bit of extra "protection" for the cable, to keep it from rubbing on the edges of the shaft holes.

That's all I'll say here, for now; I'll start the thread I mentioned about my Deus 2 project momentarily, for anyone who wants to discuss shaft issues specifically...

Thanks Gary!

Steve

With all respect, tnsharpshooter has a lot of very good (instructive) vids out there. He has spent a lot time on them and has found some very interesting things most us would never discover.

I have just loaded Deus-II 0.71 software. Immediately I have found a software problem whilst in BEACH Mode. A Quarter ID's as '97'. Hmmmmmmmm! Sooooooo........ a Half Dollar ID's as '99'. When the Half Dollar is 'on-edge'..... it ID's as 'iron'. There is a bit of a discrete window to see/witness/verify this. Whilst sweeping the coil longitudinally over the Half Dollar on-edge....... start to rotate your sweep about 20-Degrees off of longitudinal axis of the Half Dollar. Coil height is not that critical to see this error. ((( I have yet to test other modes......and somewhat suspect it is isolable only to BEACH Mode))).

I have learned: It is CRITICAL to read the Owners Manual...... if you desire peak-performance. This detector is FAR from K.I.S.S. theory (especially after reading the owners manual).
((( But it still took me 40-minutes.....in the real-World...... to find which sub/sub/sub-menu where SILENCER was located......so I could make on-the-fly adjustments. )))

I'm a bit short on time...... and must bulletize my response(s):

* I genuinely like that the detector is still 'hot' (up-in-support) whilst in nearly all of the settings modes. You can continue sweeping/detecting/TESTING whilst in the middle of changing settings. So far..... it appears the detector is off-line ONLY whilst in Ground Balance Mode. Example: You can invoke: Magnetic Ground: on/off/on/off/on/off/on/off whilst continuously sweeping over a target...... to instantly determine which mode is better.

ALL IS NOT LOST!!!........yet; there is mild performance delta's with the newly discovered/invoked/implemented (somewhat hidden sub-menus) setting applications.

* All previous wet-salt beach testing was performed (and documented) with the Silencer on a factory preset of '2'. Dropping it to '0' was/is the correct move for wet-salt applications. About 70% of the click/tick/snap/crackle/pop audio was 'smoothed-out' by virtue of dropping Silencer to '0'. Here's the weird/unsuspecting end-resultant: While Silencer has nearly nothing to do with depth performance........ it has a marked improvement on human audible intelligibility enhancement; which, in turn..... allowed for a Sensitivity increase of 1-to-2 points higher........ simply due to better artificial audio intel. This also made for the threshold-depth targets to NOT be a 'click/tick/snap/crackle/pop' audio....... and became more intelligible. THIS is what added a tad more real-World usable depth. (Data to follow).
I'm still encountering too much 'clipped' audio; yet, I'm (somewhat) more inclined to believe that it is the detection of 'salt'. My doubts are what's invoking the desire to set Discrim on -1.7 or -2.0. I am CERTAIN that you could never encroach -6.4 in a conductive wet-salt environ.

* Magnetic Ground. A bit of a paradox ensued here. I was nearly CERTAIN this setting/adjustment (alone) would be responsible for quite a bit more depth...... as nearly all of the Eastern United States Coast....has little/no black-magnetic sand. BUT.... it was only responsible for about 0.3" greater depth on a U.S. Nickel. Sooooooooo. I'm glad that I did NOT delete this entire thread.
BUT = NEW DATA:

All settings maxed out..... unless otherwise specified:

* Beach Sensitive: With Silencer NOW on '0'.........and Magnetic Ground (Black Sand on Tarsacci) on ACCEPT (in other words: NOT compensating for any black/magnetic sand........ ALLOWING for black/magnetic sand to interfere!)...... my Florida beach would now allow for a max Sens setting of '80'. I can (now) detect a U.S. Nickel to 13.8" deep in this configuration.

* Switching over to BEACH Mode (not Beach Sensitive)........ a Sens setting of '86' is nearly exactly equiv in depth performance to Beach Sensitive with Sens on '80'...on a Nickel. ALL OTHER SETTINGS EXACTLY THE SAME!!! (((You MUST compare Apples-to-Apples))). BUT...... here's the caveat: BEACH Mode would allow for a max Sens setting of '90'...... in my exceptionally high salt-concentrate Florida beach geophysics conditions. Soooooooo.......... Deus-II will NOW detect a U.S. Nickel to 14.1"......with this different mode ...in concert with different authorized settings.
Robbing Peter.....to pay Paul. What I lose in sensitivity to small/low conductors (gold) by switching over to BEACH......which is a less-sensitive mode to low conductors....... is restored/regained (made back).... by the authorization of higher Sensitivity settings.
Also...... there are fairly large jumps in performance..... with each single increment of Sensitivity adjustment. BUT..... in these (my) local conditions..... a jump in Sens from 90...to 91......,,,,,,, and the unit is formidably 'chatty' ....unstable.
BEACH Mode (VS Beach Sensitive Mode) allows for the coil to be much closer to the ground; yet, still NOT allowed to touch/bump the wet sand.

Deus-2 is quite a bit better performer over EQX-600/800 in a beach environment. Technological advancements/strides being made.

I am anxious to transition to inland dirt; yet, I need to master the beach first.

MUCH more to post; yet, out of time.

I TOTALLY change my mind on this 0.71 software problem. How often do you find Half Dollars 'on-edge' ...... on the beach.
I would MUCH rather have the HIGHLY expanded/excessively-aggressive ID range on the low and mid conductors whilst in BEACH Mode........in lieu of this tiny/unique 'on-edge' Half Dollar problem.

For the record....... I am finding a lot of small costume jewelry with Deus. Costume jewelry is 'high conductor'. Usually silver...... or silver plated copper.

* I feel Beach Sensitive ..... in non-linear proportion (as compared to BEACH)...... is too hyper-sensitive to salt. A bit more 'salt' engineering time/labor/effort in this arena will: euphorically open doors to the unknown! (In unsuspecting magnitude).

Dave....... yes. You are ABSOLUTELY correct in needing ACCURATE ID....... VS raw depth. This is absolutely paramount for inland/turf/dirt hunting.
What if you have two detectors. Detector A can detect a dime to 16"; yet, there is no ID of the dime...beyond 10". Detector B can detect a dime to 13"..... with flawless ID down to 12".
You would dig infinite VOLUMES of trash between 10" to 16" with detector A. = = NOT worth it!!!
BUT....... on the wet-slope beach...... I would clearly choose Detector A...,,,....,,,,,.......,,,,,,,.......,,,,,,, as..... there are plenty of audible signature 'clues' to deep non-ferrous targets. Well worth the tradeoff.

TNSS...... I tried higher Disc settings whilst in Beach Sensitive & Beach Modes. The only delta I encounter is..... more audible 'clipping'.......,,,,,,,which is everything I am trying to avoid...... especially in a conductive salt environment. (Am I missing something)?

Dew.............. I did not forget! Just needed more (final) data. D2 will acquire a Nickel to 14".......with a 11" coil. Tarsacci...... with 1" larger coil (which is a 12" coil)....... will acquire a Nickel to 15". To me........ that 1" coil size difference...... enters into: Apples-to-Oranges comparison condition. I'd be willing to bet that if D2 had a 12" coil....... they would 'compare'. (If you hold back-to-back..... Tarsacci's 12" coil....to D2's 11" coil....... the Tarsacci coil appears HUGE..... even by 'visual' comparison!!!).

I have mixed feelings about the complexities of the Deus-II. I am EVER-SO-GRATEFUL to have ALL of these adjustable features for extreme customization; yet, there are plenty of detectors/platforms that are POWERFUL; yet, simple (K.I.S.S.).

Still following you here. I notice you haven't talked much about dive program. I also notice you are talking about ID at depth. I brought this up on another forum early on. Remember I have zero experience on salt beach detecting. But I will again mention this. I know you will indeed test and give real deal info on. Realizing no system is necessarily deemed fool proof when it comes to detecting. Can Deus 2 by virtue of comparing targets in the wild on salt beach..can a skilled user place good odds on if a target is higher conductor vs lower conductor by comparing Deus 2 signal strength and or ID presented comparing beach sensitive to dive program in a wet salt sand environment (not in water). When I brought this up the ole subject of Mr T's gold ring could be missed as well as silver jewelry. But could a deus 2 user by doing the comparison and weighing signal strength/ID presented(or not) and limit their digging yet have better this average chance of recovering "gold rings". And leave the higher conductive clad and yes even some silver rings behind. And wonder if we did bury Mr T's big gold ring at depth on sqlt beach wet sand what would we see and hear with deus 2 comparing dive program to beach sensitive program? The above post assumes hunting using beach sensitive and checking targets with dive program. Checking only targets yielding no ID or weaker signal using beach sensitive program. With any suspect target giving no ID yielding equal signal strength when comparig to dive mode be an automatic dig scenario.


PS
I only suggested you try raising your disc to see effects. Most folks I have talked to don't run 0 disc. You are the first to really report on deus 2 in salt beach scenario running 0 disc. But



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 08/26/2022 09:54AM by tnsharpshooter.

I was made wider stand:

[omnitron.pl]

Without you need to lay it on side. That is my project.

Thanks...... again i use the term ACCEPTABLE LOSS with any detector..... what will it get ... what wont it get, then does that suit you objective. Coming out of the water these current multi use machine with their high Khz have some advantage. In the water ..... thats debatable since you cant really judge target depth..... but generally we know when they slap a larger coil on things can change. Tenn..... something MOST beach people cant do is dig coils..... they just tune their ear to them and the time spent has to be considered. Also most machines have that point where audio can give good info..... or at least enough to move a little sand. Im a digger..... but the one target i try to figure out is .... bottle cap, hate them things.

Another beach hunt today. Same identical performance results again...... but: different day. Different time. This is what starts to build confidence in a unit: Consistent repeatability.
Nutshell:
13.8" depth on a Nickel whilst in Beach Sensitive Mode. (Max Sens 80).
14.1" depth on a Nickel whilst in BEACH Mode. (Max Sens 90).

Deus-II Ground Balanced on '83' in either Mode....... both yesterday & today. Consistency again. (A good sign.....and a critical/paramount indices for me).

I have not tried DIVING program (yet). I am still in the: confidence & competence building phase.

EQX does have slightly better low conductor sensitivity in wet-salt. "Low conductor" meaning..... around the chewing gum foil range.
With a womans 14Kt simple (comfort-fit) gold wedding band ...... Deus-2 is about 1.4" greater depth.....over the EQX.
Deus-2 REALLY tries to 'hang on' to any form of an ID.... even with really weak/deep signals. About the last 20% - 25% of its fringe-depth...depth-range...... the ID's are quite 'splattered'. The SALT feedback really starts to dominate.

There's been a few times that the Deus-2 incurred EMI. One of the EMI incursions..... the 6 Noise Cancel channels .....made absolutely no difference.
Another EMI incursion...... and 4 of the 6 noise cancel channels .... made absolutely no change/difference.,.,.,.,., yet.... one of the channels completely mitigated the EMI.

Audio Response. "7" is the maximum setting. When dropped to '6'..... the last 2.5" - 3.0" of detectable range...... is almost impossible to hear. TOO steep of modulated audio.

Ground Balance/Ground Grab........ is still 'slow' to START 'catching' the salt mineralization. I've varied my coil height....... varied coil pumping velocities......and varied the 'stopping distance' above the ground; .........yet, the first 13 - 16 pumps......and the detector doesn't even know a Ground Grab is even being attempted. After about 16 or 17 pumps...... THEN it 'starts' to see the intent.
If Ground Balance is 2 (or more) points out-of-cal....... the detector is fairly 'chatty' (reactive) to the wet-salt.

Tom,
Your numbers seem off on a nickel for max depth.
Try the following.
Beach sensitive reactivity 1 sens 95 salt sens 7 disc around 6 p-8 keep audio response at level 5.
Listen to a 16" deep nickel. Then sweep around for stability check. Bet it sounds good.
I asked you about Nox settings few months ago when Calabash was going to compare Deus 2 to Nox. You recommend speed 3. Not the lowest speed setting.
Well deus 2 using beach sensitive likes reactivity 1-1.5 it seems. One can run high sens and run salt sens at 7. Maybe even 8 or 9 with some getting use.
These recommendations are what a whole lot of other folks with deus 2 hunting East coast of Fla are using.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/27/2022 12:39AM by tnsharpshooter.

David....... I'll give it a shot.
And THIS is "why" I have not tested DIVING program yet. TOO, TOO many other settings (with nearly infinite combinations)...... just in BEACH ....or BEACH SENSITIVE Modes.
I've been sticking to a Reactivity of '0'..... due to factory recommendations for exactly such. ((( Both in owners manual.... AND in Factory Preset. )))

tnsharpshooter Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Tom,
> Your numbers seem off on a nickel for max depth.
> Try the following.
> Beach sensitive reactivity 1 sens 95 salt sens 7 d
> isc around 6 p-8 keep audio response at level 5.
> Listen to a 16" deep nickel. Then sweep around fo
> r stability check. Bet it sounds good.
> I asked you about Nox settings few months ago when
> Calabash was going to compare Deus 2 to Nox. You
> recommend speed 3. Not the lowest speed setting.
> Well deus 2 using beach sensitive likes reactivity
> 1-1.5 it seems. One can run high sens and run sal
> t sens at 7. Maybe even 8 or 9 with some getting u
> se.
> These recommendations are what a whole lot of othe
> r folks with deus 2 hunting East coast of Fla are
> using.

Audio response at 5, will NOT pull-out deep targets on a salt beach. Like Tom, I am running 7, if too chatty then 6.

Also, ANY type of increase in reactivity during my/our testing only LOST depth. However, if a reactivity of say "1" can somehow gain you sensitivity there "maybe" a tradeoff [but I doubt it]

An important note: add ANY amount of Black Sand to this equation and get less results, and potentially MUCH LESS.

NASA-Tom Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Another beach hunt today. Same identical performan
> ce results again...... but: different day. Differe
> nt time. This is what starts to build confidence i
> n a unit: Consistent repeatability.
> Nutshell:
> 13.8" depth on a Nickel whilst in Beach Sensitive
> Mode. (Max Sens 80).
> 14.1" depth on a Nickel whilst in BEACH Mode. (Max
> Sens 90).
>
> Deus-II Ground Balanced on '83' in either Mode....
> ... both yesterday & today. Consistency again. (A
> good sign.....and a critical/paramount indices for
> me).
>
> I have not tried DIVING program (yet). I am still
> in the: confidence & competence building phase.
>
> EQX does have slightly better low conductor sensit
> ivity in wet-salt. "Low conductor" meaning..... ar
> ound the chewing gum foil range.
> With a womans 14Kt simple (comfort-fit) gold weddi
> ng band ...... Deus-2 is about 1.4" greater depth.
> ....over the EQX.
> Deus-2 REALLY tries to 'hang on' to any form of an
> ID.... even with really weak/deep signals. About t
> he last 20% - 25% of its fringe-depth...depth-rang
> e...... the ID's are quite 'splattered'. The SALT
> feedback really starts to dominate.
>
> There's been a few times that the Deus-2 incurred
> EMI. One of the EMI incursions..... the 6 Noise Ca
> ncel channels .....made absolutely no difference.
> Another EMI incursion...... and 4 of the 6 noise c
> ancel channels .... made absolutely no change/diff
> erence.,.,.,.,., yet.... one of the channels compl
> etely mitigated the EMI.
>
> Audio Response. "7" is the maximum setting. W
> hen dropped to '6'..... the last 2.5" - 3.0" of de
> tectable range...... is almost impossible to hear.
> TOO steep of modulated audio.
>
> Ground Balance/Ground Grab........ is still 'slow'
> to START 'catching' the salt mineralization. I've
> varied my coil height....... varied coil pumping v
> elocities......and varied the 'stopping distance'
> above the ground; .........yet, the first 13 - 16
> pumps......and the detector doesn't even know a Gr
> ound Grab is even being attempted. After about 16
> or 17 pumps...... THEN it 'starts' to see the inte
> nt.
> If Ground Balance is 2 (or more) points out-of-cal
> ....... the detector is fairly 'chatty' (reactive)
> to the wet-salt.

I think you are on the right track Tom. I also think you need to give Tracking GB another try. I have not experienced the issue you stated. Maybe try a manual GB, then switch to tracking so the machine is close to begin with?
I also have not Experienced that with the Equinox running horseshoe mode for three years either.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/27/2022 06:00PM by midalake.

A 6 level audio response may work, Max is too much.
See this video.
Also some other deus 2 users post their comments as far as settings.

[m.youtube.com]

BEACH & BEACH SENSITIVE:

On the bench...... and in the test-garden. , . , . , . , . , there is a very clear and distinct (and formidable) loss-of-performance when Reactivity is raised above '0'.
On the bench...... and in the test-garden. , . , . , . , . , there is a fairly clear loss of performance when Salt Sensitivity is dropped from max performance of '9'.
In the real-World...... there is a very clear and distinct loss-of-performance when JUST Reactivity is raised above '0'.
In the real-World...... there is a fairly clear loss-of-performance when Salt Sensitivity is dropped below its max setting of '9'. (This is more readily apparent to/with small, low-conductor type of targets. Nearly impossible to see/witness with Nickel/ring-sized targets. ,,, Remember = Salt ....and very low conductors..... like fine gold jewelry. , . , . , . , . are nearly the exact same conductivity).
BUT.
BUT. "Collectively"...... (altering Salt Sens & Reactivity simultaneously)..... 'might' present a situation that will THEN (unsuspectingly) allow Sensitivity to be boosted ...back up to the Factory Preset (and recommended) level of Sens '95'. I do have serious doubts about this; yet, the possibility does indeed exist. Look at what's happening with BEACH Mode........ VS .......... BEACH SENSITIVE Mode.
On the bench...... and in the test-garden. , . , . , . , . , BEACH SENSITIVE is quite a bit more sensitive to small, fine gold jewelry.......all the way up to the conductivity of a Nickel.
On the bench...... and in the test-garden. , . , . , . , . , BEACH is a marked degradation in performance to small, fine gold jewelry.......all the way up to the conductivity of a Nickel.
YET, , , , IN THE REAL WORLD..........there is a (unsuspecting) non-linear/disproportionate authorization of: allowing Sensitivity to be driven WELL ABOVE the exact point where BEACH Mode 'matches performance' of: BEACH SENSITIVE Mode. Soooooooo. There is hope (albeit: small).... that TNSS recommendations might work.

One of the primary reasons/rationale 'why' I am posting all of my PRELIMINARY findings with the Deus-2....... is for the exact reason that: (I deliberately WANT) you can see & witness ME learning-curve/struggle/epiphany/discovery/happy/sad ......................the workings/performance of the Deus-II....... in the learning-curve TIME-LENGTH....... that it takes ME to ascertain. By virtue of folks TELLING me the hottest/best performance settings of the Deus-II...... REDUCES MY LEARNING-CURVE TIME!!! There is good AND bad to this. (((And one does not outweigh the other))). nnnnn Yes, , , I WILL (eventually) try any/all possible combinations with the Deus-II..... to discover peak-performance..... (because life is short).......yet, it does (logistically) take time. I like to perform said function..... in unbiased fashion. (((There is a possibility that I may discover something.... that has yet to be discovered))).

FYI = It is a 2-hour drive for me....for a beach excursion (round-trip). There's some 'logistics' involved! (Usually: domestically !!!)

On a TOTALLY different subject = There is indeed mode/means/methodology to "K.I.S.S. theory" ... to a (otherwise) very complex detector that has hundreds of available settings/adjustments (with nearly infinite combinations thereof).....can indeed, RETAIN all the individual/complex settings-adjustments; yet, in K.I.S.S. fashion. (((You are going to see some of this...... in a new Minelab product.....in (unspecified) time))).

It will allow the sens to be boosted...I know a lot of beach hunters and good many are in FLA....Your beach settings IMO are not good but hey what do I know...The guy who owns XP told me when I started testing it on the beach a good starting point and what they had found that works.

I know things can be discovered and you might just do that...but some of the things that you said like beach sens could not be used effectively in wet salt sand is just not the case...
You should read the comments in my video from OTHER beach hunters...I agree with one of them if I tried to use your beach settings I would throw my Deus II in the ocean and leave it..
BEACH SENS is the deepest mode on gold on the machine....
Dont let word sens fool you its for the small stuff but it is also for the gold RINGS...

Look for to seeing what you come up with.
[youtu.be]



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 08/27/2022 02:38PM by calabash digger.

calabash...... obviously I'm an idiot in your eyes.
I'm still on a 'coming-up-to-speed' learning-curve phase with Deus-2.
I merely want folks to 'see/witness' my learning-curve.....FOR A REASON.
I know that you want me to do exactly as you do......and 'follow' you........ but my brain 'thinks' differently than the norm.

No ! I have always valued what you have said...I just dont agree with running a detector in a crippled way and posting data on it...I guess you have your reasons and I am trying to understand them.
I saw your KISS post...So will I need to learn and test my Manticore like your doing with the Deus II to understand what your trying to show us?

Your IQ is way higher than mine I am just a Ole Simple Minded Country Boy with poor grammer skills..

I can say one thing Ive learned over last few years with these newer units is my settings for my soil may not work for your soil.

MDT is one like that.

Manufacturers know to get more in ground depth they have to overcome the soil if there staying with available transmission system we have.The soil has alway's been the force holding back deeper finds.Newer units seem to be attacking the soil problem in ways we can control it enough to make sense of of the signal from overload.MDT for one uses the Salinity as an extra window in the soil not just phase shift old school ground balance.Instead of discing out the soil which is basically all were doing for year's now were getting ways to neutralize the soil somewhat.Instead of soil being a piece of black paper were getting a piece of screen to see through.

Deus is doing it with a more bleedy less filtered audio to make ground noisy but allow targets to bleed through with silencer settings ..I see Tom talking about a Salt balance on D2 and not sure yet what that is if its just allowing ground balance to move to salt but still phase shift or if its a new setting for inland hunting also?

Anyhow these newER units coming seem to be trying to tackle the earth.they have the disc down they have for decades but now they're pushing for better soil penetration.



Keith

“I don't care that they stole my idea . . I care that they don't have any of their own”
-Nikola Tesla

calabash..... maybe I have not stated it enough..... but I am on my 'learning-curve' with the Deus-II. , . , . , . , which is a 'discovery phase'. I am not 'perfected' yet. I have not 'mastered' it yet. I'm hoping NOT to implicate that I have tried every possible configuration with Deus-II..... and I am still 'coming up-to-speed' with it. The Deus-II is a very complex instrument..... that I may not be able to INSTANTLY discover peak-performance.....with 'pinnacle' settings.
I HOPE I can hit the beach again .... SOON..... so I can continue testing/modifying/learning.
More to follow.

kEITH the Deus II is unlike anything you have ever used...I get the settings part and your soil..I am in contact with people around the world that detect in very harsh dirt...You might want to try deep hc in your hot dirt or relic ...There is a reason I said that....Please let us know your findings..

Tom is having a battle of Wits with an UNARMED opponent.LOL

You got me his IQ is higher than mine...I got enough smarts not to argue that..

TNSS has some merit!!!! He must be an avid/skilled beach detectorist! I hit the beach today .... with all of his recommendations to test. A couple of his ideas had merit. Although I would have tested exactly what David (TNSS) recommended....... he got me there: 2 beach trips earlier. I would have preferred to discover this on my own..... BUT...... it saved you guys 2-days (2 hunts) worth of time.......so......you are going to get the data 2 beach-hunts sooner.

Here goes:

Beach Sensitive.
Reactivity '1'.
Salt Sens '7'.
Discrim '6'.
Audio Response '5'.

Every time I have gone to the beach....and performed a Ground Balance...... it always lands on '83'. I love seeing/witnessing/experiencing this kind of reliable 'consistency'. . . . and for many reasons. (If I'm higher up the slope..... the G.B. numbers will be different by a few points).

Commentary:

Audio Response '5'...... TOO low. Even for a 12" Nickel. Unit will detect the 12" Nickel; yet, the volume/amplitude of the audio report (signal) is even lower in volume than the small/false chirps from Salt. Completely indiscernible.
Audio Response '6'...... TOO low. Even for a 13" Nickel. Unit will detect the 13" Nickel; yet, the volume/amplitude of the audio report (signal) is even lower in volume than the small/false chirps from Salt. Completely indiscernible.
Audio Response '7'...... Intelligible SUCCESS!!!

Discrim '6'. Too many click/tick/snap/crackle/pop from threshold-depth conductors.... wet-salt...... and 'ghost signals from actual iron...which causes you to 'chase the ghost' ; subsequently, wasting time.
Returned to Discrim '0'. Nearly all click/tick/smap/crackle/pop mitigated.

Salt Sens '7'. Nearly pinnacle setting. I could get away with '8'...... which would gain more performance with a non-linear lessor amount of added distortion.

Reactivity '1'. THIS is where things were interesting.....just like TNSS stated that I had reported (multiple times) with EQX Target Recovery Response Speed. Somewhat of an unsuspecting paradox.
When I was running Reactivity on '0'.... the max Sens I could run was '80'. By running Reactivity of '1'... and a Sens of '80'.... I lost over 2" depth performance on a Nickel. BUT...... Reactivity '1' authorized a higher Sens setting. (Somewhat akin to EQX.... in certain circumstances). When I hit Sens '90'.... I had gained back ALL depth/performance that was lost because of switching to Reactivity of '1'. BUT...BUT.....BUT. Then the question became: Can I adjust Sens any higher.... and still retain acceptable stability. I was able to run Sens on '91'....... and..... under certain unique circumstances...... I could run Sens on '92'. (I may have been a bit zealous/hyped/overdoing/pushy.....and wanting additional performance).
When Sens was on '91'....and in Beach Sensitive...... Deus-II will now detect a 14.7" deep Nickel !!!! TNSS had merit in his statement.
With Reactivity on '1'..... and Sens on '91' (and a positively revalidated/reverified Grnd Bal of '83')...... IS WHEN I tested Disc '6', Audio Response '5' and Salt Sens '7'...... to verify if/what/how these settings (individually) would affect peak performance.
EVEN THOUGH I am unable to detect a 16" Nickel (or even a 15" Nickel)...... 14.7" is VERY formidable. . . . . . . to the point of nearly paralleling the Tarsacci's performance! THAT is euphoric! NOT to be underestimated. (((Florida salt is...unsuspectingly.... very debilitating))).
Although Beach Sensitive, Reactivity '1'.....and Sens '91' will acquire a 14.7" Nickel. , . , . , . , it appears there is no additional gain on low conductors (fine jewelry). And maybe even a slight loss in performance. More analyzation required.

Then I tested BEACH Mode. ALL settings landed on nearly the exact same setting..... with the exception of Ground Balance being '84'...... and Sens was able to be driven to Sens '95'. Again.... unit would detect a 14.7" deep Nickel! (How ironic). But..... indeed a verified slight loss in performance on low-conductor fine gold jewelry.

FINALLY (Dewcon)..... I tested DIVING Mode. Nutshell: It is even less sensitive to low-conductor gold jewelry; yet, ....... AGAIN...... with similar settings (as above) ...... I could run Sens on '99'..... Ground Balance again on '84'....... DIVING Mode would detect a 14.1" Nickel ...very near the waters edge. (((But NOT in the water. Not tested))).

"WHY" does Reactivity '1' make so much of a difference in performance? Same reason as EQX. There is a symbiotic harmonious quiescence (electronically) that..... an electronic 'balance' between wet-salt .... VS .... peak synchronous (balanced) resonant frequency(s).... must be adhered to! If the two are mismatched....... reduced performance ensues.

midalake...... I did try Tracking. It does quiet down the unit another notch. And..... It appeared to NOT 'track out' a deep Nickel; YET/BUT...... it DID track-out a very small stud silver earring.

When the coil battery is low...... will it flash a red LCD light..... or signify in any means/way/form? (Other than having to look at remote LCD indicator)?

Outta time.... again!

I have not hunted a salt beach ever. So no. Not avid salt beach Hunter. I was following your reporting and had seen reports from others. And yes
I did think a lot about what you have dose about EQx as far as setting it up for max depth Bewch 1 yet useable settings. Glad you made progress. I don't know as much as you do when it comes to what is happening with change in speed setting with vlf detectors. What I will be interested in is this winter if youngest Deus 2 with 11" coil on burned nickel does max detection depth (with useable settings) change any for the better.

I would like to hunt a salt beach just one time. Someday.

I wished default reactivity setting in beach sensitive program was 1 instead of 0, XP could change this with update. Would be a good move IMO.

I also wonder. And you might know the answer to this. Would you expect to see different GB number on same beach this winter albeit slightly different than on your recent outings?

Keep the info coming.

Naturally many here I think are awaiting your take on the Manticore. Myself included.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 08/29/2022 10:14AM by tnsharpshooter.

TNSS.....Yes. In the winter time.....when water is cooler...,,,,...,,,, it'll hold less salt-in-solution......and the Grnd Bal numbers will indeed be slightly different.

I have yet to comprehensively test Reactivity 1.5.....or 2.0....... or 0.5 . , . , . , . . , and find 'best performance'. WHAT IF. What if Reactivity 1.5 turns out to be pinnacle depth performer! I have tested these other settings; yet, failed to do so...to a validated/certified magnitude.
Now that I know that: Salt Sens, Discrim, and Audio Response have a (nearly) "constant"..... in their pinnacle settings...,,,,...,,,,......,,,,,,..... THIS makes for a MUCH easier testing platform whereby....SOOOOoooooo many potential 'variables' can be made into a "constant"..... removing the bulk of "infinite adjustable settings"..... down to a do'able level.

I'll start a Manticore thread.....soon. Artemis-I rocket launch to the Moon...... is EATING MY TIME!!!

calabash digger Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> ...I just dont agree with running a detector in a crippled way and posting data on it...

This has got to be one of the most ironic statements ever made.

NASA-Tom Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> TNSS has some merit!!!! He must be an avid/skilled
> beach detectorist! I hit the beach today .... with
> all of his recommendations to test. A couple of hi
> s ideas had merit. Although I would have tested ex
> actly what David (TNSS) recommended....... he got
> me there: 2 beach trips earlier. I would have pref
> erred to discover this on my own..... BUT...... it
> saved you guys 2-days (2 hunts) worth of time.....
> ..so......you are going to get the data 2 beach-hu
> nts sooner.
>
> Here goes:
>
> Beach Sensitive.
> Reactivity '1'.
> Salt Sens '7'.
> Discrim '6'.
> Audio Response '5'.
>
> Every time I have gone to the beach....and perform
> ed a Ground Balance...... it always lands on '83'.
> I love seeing/witnessing/experiencing this kind of
> reliable 'consistency'. . . . and for many reasons
> . (If I'm higher up the slope..... the G.B. number
> s will be different by a few points).
>
> Commentary:
>
> Audio Response '5'...... TOO low. Even for a 12" N
> ickel. Unit will detect the 12" Nickel; yet, the v
> olume/amplitude of the audio report (signal) is ev
> en lower in volume than the small/false chirps fro
> m Salt. Completely indiscernible.
> Audio Response '6'...... TOO low. Even for a 13" N
> ickel. Unit will detect the 13" Nickel; yet, the v
> olume/amplitude of the audio report (signal) is ev
> en lower in volume than the small/false chirps fro
> m Salt. Completely indiscernible.
> Audio Response '7'...... Intelligible SUCCESS!!!
>
> Discrim '6'. Too many click/tick/snap/crackle/pop
> from threshold-depth conductors.... wet-salt......
> and 'ghost signals from actual iron...which causes
> you to 'chase the ghost' ; subsequently, wasting t
> ime.
> Returned to Discrim '0'. Nearly all click/tick/sma
> p/crackle/pop mitigated.
>
> Salt Sens '7'. Nearly pinnacle setting. I could ge
> t away with '8'...... which would gain more perfor
> mance with a non-linear lessor amount of added dis
> tortion.
>
> Reactivity '1'. THIS is where things were interest
> ing.....just like TNSS stated that I had reported
> (multiple times) with EQX Target Recovery Response
> Speed. Somewhat of an unsuspecting paradox.
> When I was running Reactivity on '0'.... the max S
> ens I could run was '80'. By running Reactivity of
> '1'... and a Sens of '80'.... I lost over 2" depth
> performance on a Nickel. BUT...... Reactivity '1'
> authorized a higher Sens setting. (Somewhat akin t
> o EQX.... in certain circumstances). When I hit Se
> ns '90'.... I had gained back ALL depth/performanc
> e that was lost because of switching to Reactivity
> of '1'. BUT...BUT.....BUT. Then the question becam
> e: Can I adjust Sens any higher.... and still reta
> in acceptable stability. I was able to run Sens on
> '91'....... and..... under certain unique circumst
> ances...... I could run Sens on '92'. (I may have
> been a bit zealous/hyped/overdoing/pushy.....and w
> anting additional performance).
> When Sens was on '91'....and in Beach Sensitive...
> ... Deus-II will now detect a 14.7" deep Nickel !!
> !! TNSS had merit in his statement.
> With Reactivity on '1'..... and Sens on '91' (and
> a positively revalidated/reverified Grnd Bal of '8
> 3')...... IS WHEN I tested Disc '6', Audio Respons
> e '5' and Salt Sens '7'...... to verify if/what/ho
> w these settings (individually) would affect peak
> performance.
> EVEN THOUGH I am unable to detect a 16" Nickel (or
> even a 15" Nickel)...... 14.7" is VERY formidable.
> . . . . . . to the point of nearly paralleling the
> Tarsacci's performance! THAT is euphoric! NOT to b
> e underestimated. (((Florida salt is...unsuspectin
> gly.... very debilitating))).
> Although Beach Sensitive, Reactivity '1'.....and S
> ens '91' will acquire a 14.7" Nickel. , . , . , .
> , it appears there is no additional gain on low co
> nductors (fine jewelry). And maybe even a slight l
> oss in performance. More analyzation required.
>
> Then I tested BEACH Mode. ALL settings landed on n
> early the exact same setting..... with the excepti
> on of Ground Balance being '84'...... and Sens was
> able to be driven to Sens '95'. Again.... unit wou
> ld detect a 14.7" deep Nickel! (How ironic). But..
> ... indeed a verified slight loss in performance o
> n low-conductor fine gold jewelry.
>
> FINALLY (Dewcon)..... I tested DIVING Mode. Nutshe
> ll: It is even less sensitive to low-conductor gol
> d jewelry; yet, ....... AGAIN...... with similar s
> ettings (as above) ...... I could run Sens on '99'
> ..... Ground Balance again on '84'....... DIVING M
> ode would detect a 14.1" Nickel ...very near the w
> aters edge. (((But NOT in the water. Not tested)))
> .
>
> "WHY" does Reactivity '1' make so much of a differ
> ence in performance? Same reason as EQX. There is
> a symbiotic harmonious quiescence (electronically)
> that..... an electronic 'balance' between wet-sal
> t .... VS .... peak synchronous (balanced) resonan
> t frequency(s).... must be adhered to! If the two
> are mismatched....... reduced performance ensues.
>
> midalake...... I did try Tracking. It does quiet d
> own the unit another notch. And..... It appeared t
> o NOT 'track out' a deep Nickel; YET/BUT...... it
> DID track-out a very small stud silver earring.
>
> When the coil battery is low...... will it flash a
> red LCD light..... or signify in any means/way/for
> m? (Other than having to look at remote LCD indica
> tor)?
>
> Outta time.... again!

Hi Tom

Enjoy your soul searching. I think your finding out what some of us have. Lots of variables!

Imagine mine, when I engaged the same beach and due to Black Sand, I could not even run "beach mode" and had to learn two new modes Diving, and Beach Pitch. The journey......continues!

I'm just returning from the beach.....am short on time..... and may incrementally post.

The intent today ...was to stick with Beach Sensitive.....and test/analyze/try various Reactivity settings..... to see if more performance can be gained. I tried Reactivity....all the way up to 3.0. In a nutshell..... in my conditions..... it appears that a Reactivity of 1.5..... with all other settings harmonized to peak/pinnacle performance to Reactivity '1.5'...... performs the (bottom-line) best. I was able to run Salt Sens on '8' for most of the time..... and a Sens of '94'. Now the Deus-II will ascertain a 14.8" deep Nickel. I tried Reactivity settings of 0.5, 1.0, 1.5, 2.0, 2.5 and 3.0. There is a law-of-diminishing-returns with Reactivity settings above 1.5.....to include with all other settings at pinnacle 'matched' performance to each specific Reactivity setting. As Reactivity is sped-up (increased)...... Sens was authorized to be run higher; yet,..... once again..... the law-of-diminishing-returns ensued. Same with Reactivity settings below 1.5. Long/tedious test; yet, well worth the time/effort.
In one of the beach programs on the new Minelab MC..... a Target Recovery Response Speed of '4'..... presents pinnacle performance.

Interestingly........ with the Deus-II........ ,,,,,,,,,, especially if you are on a Reactivity '0', Salt Sens '9' whilst in Beach Sensitive. , . , . , . , . , . , . if you overdrive Sens to (say) '97'..... and let the coil rest on the wet-salt sand..... fairly close to the waters edge......... you can hear the low & high PRF oscillations of the subsurface water-table.

Last night (late!).... it struck me. I was able to run Sens on '99' whilst in DIVING Mode. My gut told me....that I wished I could run Sens even higher. Then the lightbulb went 'ON'...... and I realized: I can! I was able to drop Reactivity to 0.5......and only had to drop Sens to '98'..... with Salt Sens on '9'........ to NOW discover that this control-panel configuration would now detect a Nickel to 14.6"...... in the wet-sand. For a IN-THE-WATER program...... that's formidable! I do NOT know if this depth is retained...if you are actually IN the water.

I used the coil wire today. Easy to install. VERY 'thin' wire! I verified that signal was never lost... regardless how deep the coil is submerged. At one point-in-time...... the coil wire clip popped off of the coil. Hydrodynamics & hydraulic action caused it to pop off. BUT....... I may not have had the clamp positioned exactly right. For now....... I shall blame myself.....VS......hardware issue.

More later.

Some good reporting Tom.
Here's short video I did.
Comparing Dive, deep high conductor and 4 kHz use. The quarter is under the foil. Detector is set up the same speed wise, silencer, etc for each mode. Reactivity level 2.
[m.youtube.com]