Who calibrated your CZ ???

Trying to do some comparisons to narrow some things down. Those who have your build sheets care to share ??

My machine CZ-21 2010 build date

Calibrated by Lupe

I heard you brought some heat on the guys
:-)

The mumbles can come in many forms

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<")))))<>(

Tuffy indeed !

Does not have some sort of quality control in place to hold someone responsible...It would be as easy as a sticker on the inside of the case with an inspection number....

If legitimate mistakes are made in calibration or assembly you could cross check upon return to the factory and see where the fault's are coming from...

Don't get me wrong everyone makes mistakes..and that's to be expected but when it becomes a common occurrence it would make it alot easier to find the problem/source...

They might have some sort of QC I don't know but in any company that manufacturer's high end electronics it is most surely needed....

I have always had it in my mind they use the same crew to assemble the wal-mart detector's that also assemble the word class detector's and there in lay's the biggest problem,,,,They ( the Line worker) see them as just toy's and I am not even for sure they have an idea that they are providing a product to meet some very serious minded passionate people who use the detector for more than clad at the tot-lot....


Keith

Keith, My CZ-21 has that. It's a QC build sheet with name of who built it, calibrated it etc. I'm trying to figure out why my CZ is hotter than others ? or are other CZ just as hot ? Ill post a video later today of the test we did.

Interesting thread!!

So now we need to look for the ones calibrated by Lupe.....Lol

Wouldnt it be nice if you knew someone who worked there calibrating detectors. When they came across one that seemed to be ultra hot they could buy it with their employee discount and give it to you at a good deal.........Dont really know if they really could do that but it would be nice........;o)

Wouldn't it be nice if they had a hot one come across their bench...... then figured out 'why' it is hot.............. and then figured out how to make all of the new production units just as hot?

Yes it would........;o)

NASA-Tom Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Wouldn't it be nice if they had a hot one come
> across their bench...... then figured out 'why' it
> is hot.............. and then figured out how to
> make all of the new production units just as hot?


This +100

How do we know a hot CZ wasn't the last one of the day to be adjusted. Extra time left on the clock to super tune but not enough to start a new one. =0p

I would venture to say parts come into play and the components of one CZ versus anothe CZ(same model and same calibrator) would certain vary in performance so I really don't care as long as I am satisfied and it seems like the original poster that started this thread has a hot one which is a plus.

I do like Toms idea of finding out why one particuliar unit is hotter than another and duplicating same to manufacture superior units as certainly a step in the right direction.

We are dealing with 2 entities that when meshed together, can come up with billions of different results. Those entities are humans and electronic components ( made my humans !).

No wonder one unit can have 1/2 inch better depth than another...or even 2 inches better. Are we then going to say a CZ that get's 10 inches on a dime is inferior to one that gets 10 1/2 inches ?

For me, any CZ that gets 10+ inches on a clad dime in an air test with the 8 inch coil is a good one, because based on certain ground conditions, sweep speeds, coin/ground matrix, conductive properties of the target, etc. , the depth can be much greater in real world circumstances. I have hit some targets at crazy depths with my CZ6a and 8 inch coil in wet sand, and I can't get 12 inches on a clad dime in an air test with it. But it will hit in the 10-11 inch zone.

My 2 cents.

therover61,

"For me, any CZ that gets 10+ inches on a clad dime in an air test with the 8 inch coil is a good one, because based on certain ground conditions, sweep speeds, coin/ground matrix, conductive properties of the target, etc. , the depth can be much greater in real world circumstances. I have hit some targets at crazy depths with my CZ6a and 8 inch coil in wet sand, and I can't get 12 inches on a clad dime in an air test with it. But it will hit in the 10-11 inch zone. "


I will be comparing my 6a to EZ's CZ21 tomorrow .......What I find interesting is that I have always heard that the more powerful CZ's are the ones that can air test at 10 inches or more on a dime .......I saw with my own 2 eyes that this CZ21 hit that 7.5 grm gold ring at 15 inches in wet salt sand that my AT Pro GB'd at 14 could NOT hit ... .......A modded Excal with an amp couldn't hit it either .....

Just so you guys know , EZ's CZ21 can NOT hit a dime , or a quarter , at 10 inches in an air test .......It's lucky if it can hit either coin at 8 inches ..... So much for theories ....... My 6a air tests just like EZ's 21.....8 inches on each coin at best ....... .......When we take both the 6a and the 21 out to the beach tomorrow , I will better be able to judge if my machine is a hot one or not ..... I know that for sure EZ's 21 is a hot one ...... It's really a shame that there can't be more folks trained to set these older machines up to run properly ..... We're getting these cheaper , stamped out , digital machines, pushed on us that in most cases can't touch the older analog machines .......Then we send off our great analong machines for repair only to find that they come back enemic ..... This is just not right !!.....Jim

BTW ...Just so you guys know ....I was able to GB my AT Pro at 14 in this particular wet salt sand ......This is a single frequency machine .....I was STILL able to hit this same ring at 9 inches in the wet salt sand .....It did not read as gold , but did give me a solid repeatable signal ..... Not too shabby for a machine that everyone loves to hate ....LOL !!...

Jim,

That was where I was going with my post. Air testing can be a gauge, but we should not get too caught up in it where it becomes paralysis by analysis. I am not surprised EZ's CZ21 would hit a target 15 inches down and still not air test well. I am not even sure if my 6a's can still air test a clad dime at 10+ since I have not air tested them in a while. But I do know they work great at the beach and on inland sites and snag DEEP targets, so why bother.

I also realize that some CZ's I have had in the past ( and my current CZ20) goes deeper in discriminate mode than in all metal. Maybe it is because I can hear a target better in discriminate due to silent search whereas in all metal, I cannot distinguish a threshold change.

Either way, North/South/East/West, a CZ that works well in real world conditions, is STILL a hard to beat detector. Granted there are some spots where other units will fair better, and that is with anything really. Want to play the blues, use a Strat. Want that country twang, bust out the Tele.

As they say, horses for courses and for me, a CZ is Secretariat

I'd like to see a video of any unit hitting a ring at a measured 15" in wet salt sand. That is deep!

Okay, saw the video in another thread... but not measured at 15".



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/18/2012 11:55PM by schultzie.

shultzie
The video that is right on one of these theads shows 3 gold rings on strings that go down in the sand 12" , 13" , and 15" ...... There were 4 of us there that saw the measurements as the rings were placed in the ground ....Look at the video ......You can see if for yourself .....I know it was wet , salt , sand because the sides kept caving in when being dug ..... and my AT Pro GB'd at 14 .......My AT Pro GB's in the 80's in the dry sand .....Jim

therover61.

I understand the point you were making , but I'm still wondering what kind of "gauge " we're talking about ......From everything I've been reading , a longer length air test would indicate a deeper machine .........I'm not sure what kind of "guaging " an air test could really be if EZ's machine went so deep and can't air test worth squat ......?????.......Maybe the CZ's that air test badly are the hot ones in real life conditions ? ....... I've never been one to hold any strength's one way or the other when seeing an air test ......To me its a contest to see which machine can air test the longest , but it surely doesn't indicate to me what machine is deeper in real world conditions ..... I'm pretty much convinced that there are tunes, and adjustments and components in these detectors that tell the REAL story as to how deep a machine can go ..... Air tests to me are becoming more and more hype to me than anything else .....Jim

Shultzie, The test targets were on the end of seamstress tape measures. Not mine but another members of this forum. They were on the money.

I think Fisher uses the 8 inch air test while calibrating the machines. I remember Tom talking about how it was done. a dime rotating on the end of a dowel. I think people are confusing that with end result. Synth is right though. I'm lucky to get 8 inches on a quarter in my house. Ive always treated air testing as nothing more than a way to listen to tones. Depth to me is measured in the real world environments.

Jim,

Sent you a message. Basically I am in agreement with you about air testing, and only mean a 'gauge' as a possible way of insuring that a unit may be working properly. An air test up to a certain depth range is valid, but after a point, I don't think it matters much. If it can't air test a dime at 6 inches, something is not right. If it air tests a 10 1/2 inches , but not at 12 inches, is something really wrong ?

I just get a little upset reading where the companies techs wont admit you the user might be correct when you have concerns about your equipment. Did i hear it properly that it didnt GB ..... might be in the factory default salt setting.

Dew

Dew,

A lot of times my CZ20 ( and my 6a's when in salt mode ) will not GB on certain NJ beaches. I usually keep the GB in the middle at 5 and go on my way and never had any problems. I hardly every hunt in autotune mode, but I am thinking that if the GB is off a tad, that mode may not be optimal. Only reason I state that is that I find hunting in discrimination mode 0 gets me better depth that autotune in most circumstances.

Only time I hunt in autotune mode is when the beach is sanded in or targets are scarce, and I want a more wider footprint to cover more ground. Once I hit a spot where there are targets, I switch over to discrimination mode.

Only other time is when I hunt this one beach where on occasion, there is a certain type of hot rock that hits mid tone in discrimination mode. In auto tune these rocks do not make a sound, so I have to hunt that way.

TR61,

Question for ya ......If you are turning your GB knob DOWN from 10 to the lower numbers , and you STILL can't hit a good GB at 1, why would you go back up to 5 ? .......To me ( and I'm just guessing here ) it would make sense to me to leave the GB knob as low as you could go since you never reached the proper GB to begin with .....In other words "1" GB would be closer to the optimal GB setting than " 5" would be in my theory ......

Just so you know also when we were doing these depth tests , EZ's CZ21 would NOT hit the 15 inch target in Autotune which is completely in line with your statement about you getting more depth in descimination "0" mode ....Interesting statement about the "Hot Rocks" though ....Thanks for the tip .....Jim

Jim,

In all honesty, I never really thought about how 1, 5 or 10 on the GB setting when I can't GB in the wet sand, affects the discriminate mode. Shoot, there were some times when the GB knob was moved from the middle position to either 1 or 10 when I was hunting, and I never knew, and I didn't see or hear any differences in how the detector was working. At least I think there wasn't a difference !

I am going to run it a 1 next time I can't GB and listen to a few fringe targets and then move it to 5 and see if there is any difference.

On other thing I just thought of....I always do the bobbing method when ground balancing and next time, when I can't in the wet sand, I am going to see if the push button method has a different result. It shouldn't, but I never tried it.

Therover61, one thing i made sure to try during the NJ hunt with the guys. Was trying the two diffrent ground balance while hunting. I couldn't tell a diffrence and both ways got the same result. Even in the dry where i could GB. Both ways gave the same GB number. I just find the PP method faster to do.

Therover..... the reason i said factory default was that the DFX if it cant GB it will go to a factory default. Been awhile since i raw gold hunted, but some set their GB at + or -.

Dew

there are a couple of beaches up here my CZ20 won't GB on either and I set it on 5 too and hunt and I find stuff, wonder what I'm missing, these beaches are where they built ships in the 1700's, lots of iron in the sand, I'm just waiting for another big Noreaster

Remember to put your sensitivity on '10' (maximum) whilst in auto-tune mode on a CZ.

A Sens setting of '6' in ID mode............ vs ................ a Sens of '6' in auto-tune mode are COMPLETELY different.

Yikes! I'm a dummy. That's why I thought my cz was deeper in disc mode, Tom, thanks for pointing that out. Back to the test garden.

NASA-Tom Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Remember to put your sensitivity on '10' (maximum)
> whilst in auto-tune mode on a CZ.
>
> A Sens setting of '6' in ID mode............ vs
> ................ a Sens of '6' in auto-tune mode
> are COMPLETELY different.


In my depth video with the CZ-21. I did try Autotune with max Sens "When even i run Autotune i run at 10". It still wouldn't pick up the 15in target hard enough to stop on.