MINELAB MANTICORE: DATA & PERFORMANCE

Kingfish Wrote:
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> Tom, Why are you not allowed to talk about Mantico
> re, yet, Minelab Debbie can post a 20 minute VIDEO
> all about the Manticore?

Because he can then drag out the subject for eternity to keep people following and asking questions. Once the information is out the subject dies.... The need for more information is what keeps people here asking questions. So when he drops little tiny tidbits it's like dropping honey on an ant hill. When the honey is gone the ants go eat somewhere else.

OUCH !!!!!!!!!!! I guess men can have periods/get pregnant.

doc holiday Wrote:
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> OUCH !!!!!!!!!!! I guess men can have periods/get
> pregnant.


Yes I've seen that lol. Liberals are actually installing tampon dispensers in men's restrooms. Wtf lmao. Don't worry, I'm not.. I'm a Trump conservative 2nd amendment loving American man.

Please post a link to that video--would be VERY interested in viewing it.-----Kingfish Wrote:
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> Tom, Why are you not allowed to talk about Mantico
> re, yet, Minelab Debbie can post a 20 minute VIDEO
> all about the Manticore?

[youtu.be]

Thank you Bill---very informative video.-------basstrackerman Wrote:
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> [youtu.be]

Thanks Tom for answering the question about the extra support webbing on the coil not being a winding itself. But why the extra support? I never knew this was the weak area of the coil? Also in the last video there was mention of the "soft keys" which I think is a great idea. Was there any talk about adding an fe number to the co number?

Quote:" Why the extra support? I never knew this was the weak area of the coil?"
I suspect it's not for strength, but rigidity. Anything that disturbs the careful alignment of the coil windings ( the Induction Balance ) can upset the detector operation. Most commonly being bumped against sand/stones/vegetation, the bump moves the housing and the wires within, giving a false signal. Thermal drift, such as that caused by sunshine/shade changes, can also cause these problems, and a stiffer housing may reduce the effect.
Water hunting may also disturb the coil shape enough to give a signal, perhaps at the end of each swing?

Pimento Wrote:
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> Quote:" Why the extra support? I never
> knew this was the weak area of the coil?"
> I suspect it's not for strength, but rigidity. Any
> thing that disturbs the careful alignment of the c
> oil windings ( the Induction Balance ) can upset t
> he detector operation. Most commonly being bumped
> against sand/stones/vegetation, the bump moves the
> housing and the wires within, giving a false signa
> l. Thermal drift, such as that caused by sunshine/
> shade changes, can also cause these problems, and
> a stiffer housing may reduce the effect.
> Water hunting may also disturb the coil shape enou
> gh to give a signal, perhaps at the end of each sw
> ing?
That makes sense. I just never had any issues with any brand's coil stiffness. However my wife would love the extra stiffness.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/28/2022 08:58PM by khouse.

Kingfish = If it makes any sense = Most probably because Minelab Debbie is OUTSIDE the Manticore. I am INSIDE the Manticore. (A formidable difference). I could also speak about MC...... but in more 'generalities'.

basstrackerman = Hand on the Bible...... I am NOT trying to 'drag things out'......... and am NOT trying to change the numbers/counts on this forum.

khouse = Pimento is correct. The extra longitudinal bars added to MC coil ..... is required for enhanced rigidity ,.,.,.,.,., due to higher power // tighter tolerances // electronic stability enhancement (((requirement!!))).

So far that's the best video I have saw of it. Extremely simple menu navigation for settings. I like what I see; especially with the screen ID info. I definitely want one now!

Shipping Now!

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Let me speak in some 'generalities'. (NOT from a physicist or engineer standpoint).

There is no FE-CO readout on Manticore; yet, the 2D screen does express (X-Y axis) the FE-CO readout.......graphically. The center-line is the pure NON-FERROUS line.
Again...... there are 99-points of iron ID.............. and 99-points of non-ferrous ID.
Something called "Ferrous Limits" is your Fe & F2 controllability. On the 2D graph...... the Upper level (upper line) is Fe. On the 2D graph...... the Lower level (lower line) is F2. Fe (the upper part of 2D graph) is all of your general/common iron implements. F2 (lower part of 2D graph) is sheet-steel, tin, steel bottlecaps (sometimes called: crown caps).
You may be wondering how much more "ID splatter" (numerically) will take place....... because the non-ferrous (and ferrous) numbers now span 0-99. You will find out there is very little ID splatter. Co-locate targets will ID splatter. A new shiny Nickel ID's as '27'..... and will very clearly lock on to 27. A new clad Quarter ID's as '88'...... and does not jump around...... unless it is steeply tilted. A new clad dime ID's as '78'. A silver dime ID's as '80'..... unless it is heavily worn down. These are just a few examples. Magnetite/lateritic iron-oxide dirt will cause ID's to 'up-average'..... to a certain point (depth)...... then at the deeper depths....... ID's will then begin to drop.
The 3 softkeys (I call them: Hot-Keys). My biggest recommendation is to assign the Upper Left assignable hotkey as: Noise Cancel. The Upper Right assignable hotkey as: Ground Balance. The (Right side (((Right edge of control pod))) lower key...... assign it as Iron 'ON/OFF' hotkey. This will make life a LOT easier for you. ((( We may implement this as a software upgrade.... at a later date ))).

Some of the overall/general Factory Presets...... are a bit 'hot'.

The mechanicals of the entire shaft.......arm cup......... coil yoke.......camlocks .,.,.,.,.,.,. are now the industries best. No more seized-up collar-locks. NEVER break another coil/coil-ear.
You can run regular wired headphones (of your flavor) on Manticore AND....... SIMULTANEOUSLY...... run the bluetooth ML105 wireless phones (on a nearby buddy...... for training)....... all at the same time.

Non-specific (for now)........... and speaking in 'generalities'....... Manticore is deeper than EQX, faster than EQX, better unmasking than EQX, more accurate ID than EQX, handles wet-salt better than EQX. ((((And............ can I say this now? Deeper than XP Deus-2 in dirt AND wet-salt)))).
I'm getting 10-hours battery run-time on the beach. And 7-hours run-time.... inland. I run the unit ridiculously hot, inland.,.,.,.,., so normal hunters will acquire longer battery run-time, inland.

NASA-Tom,

I appreciate the "introductory" information.

One question, that hopefully isn't pushing you beyond what you can say, yet.

In lateritic iron-oxide dirt, you said a bit of up averaging through mid depths, and then a decrease in VDI a very deep depths. My EQX will up-average in my Oklahoma moderately hot red clay, but doesn't down-average, even to fringe depth -- ever.

Can you give just a very rough/approximate idea as to the general degree of change, on say that "88" quarter? Are we talking maybe low 90s, roughly, in dirt like I have here, for the moderate-depth up-averaging? Would it go lower than, say, low 80s, in terms of the ID drop at fringe depth?

Just trying to get a feel for what I might expect in terms of range of VDI deviation, as I start testing the unit...

Thanks!

Steve

For NASA Tom... can you give us more details on its depth advantages over the xp deus 2 and how does it compare to the xp in separation in heavy iron? If you can disclose your experience if you can't yet I understand.

Steve, Will it even matter? If it down or up averages you're still going to have a tight dot on the non-ferrous line that will have you digging regardless.

Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/30/2022 03:01AM by tnsharpshooter.

NASA-Tom, also along with the question of separation in heavy iron. Does the Manticore get false hits in iron and when the signal is checked, nothing is there, like the Equinox does?

How about, how deep on a gold ring in dry sand?

Interesting detector.

sumrtym Wrote:
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> Steve, Will it even matter? If it down or up aver
> ages you're still going to have a tight dot on the
> non-ferrous line that will have you digging regard
> less.


Not necessarily; if up-averaging or down-averaging is occurring, that is USUALLY accompanied by some ID splatter, with most machines -- which in this case would ALSO mean some degree of target trace "smearing..."

In any case, for me personally, the way I learn a machine, and develop confidence in it, is to seek to assimilate as precisely as possible how the unit behaves with respect to the targets I am interested in. Obviously, that means learning, over time, how the machine behaves with respect to those targets I'm seeking, and how the response changes when those targets are at various depths, in various orientations, etc. etc. To "train" myself, I ALWAYS interrogate a target fully, rotating around it as I sweep, watching and listening very carefully and trying to absorb ALL of the information that the unit is providing me, as best I can. Then, I "call" the target in my mind -- i.e. make a "forecast" of what I thinkthe target is most likely to be. And then I dig it, and that then "verifies" my "forecast" -- I was either "correct," or "incorrect." At that point, learning commences...when I'm correct, I try to lock into my memory the way the machine behaved over the target, prior to digging. When I'm incorrect, I spend a bit of time trying to decipher WHY I was incorrect. Was I "close" (i.e. I called "penny," but it was a copper washer)? Were there co-located targets? Was the target on edge? Were there iron/rust flakes nearby?

Anyway, for me, this is how I approach learning a detector. And SO -- my reason for asking was simply to get a bit of a "head start" perhaps, on knowing what the "range of possibilities" might be, on a coin residing at various depths, in my particular dirt. Eventually, I'll learn this for myself, of course, but having some of this knowledge ahead of time, moves me forward a bit as I think and ponder...

Steve

@NASA-TOM

This has been asked before on other detectors so might as well get it out of the way.

Does any Minelab SMF or SMF+ truly process all OEM listed frequencies simultaneously? Are they all fired into the ground at once, shotgun like and then the detector process what is ‘reflected’?

Seems many say it is either sequential or only several at once.

Not sure if it matters but always been curious.

Regards

The question is how a 2D graph is accurate... and how it works. I was watch some movies and higher conductors are also not easy to define - no sweet round shape. Especially near iron... it could be an only marketing advantage. Not really a feature. Like with sound. You need to dig to check it. And I understand it... but it does not help at all. It only shows what you hear, so you don't get more data.

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steveg........ I did not use a '88' Quarter, but/rather....... I used a '78' dime. I have one very specific place in Florida...... that is a 5-6 hour (round-trip) drive.... whereby..... I do "fixed-constants" (variables removed) testing. This is 4-to-5 bar dirt on F75. In a nutshell...... the dime ID'd as a: "78 lock-on" down to 4.7" deep. Then from 4.8" deep..... down to 6.9" deep.,.,.,.,., the ID linearly/proportionately started to climb into the mid-90's. Right at 7" deep..... the dime started to (rapidly) drop in ID. At 7.7"..... the dime ID'd as iron. Ironically..... from 8.1" deep....down to 8.8" deep.....the dime ID'd as '78'..... BUT..... it was a NEGATIVE 78! ((( The number '78' was underlined in RED ))). Pushing the dime even deeper..... and the dime was a total ID 'splatter'....... until the dime was completely undetectable.
YOUR DIRT MAY/WILL BE DIFFERENT RESULTANT!!!

Jesse...... not yet! But do NOT forget this question!

Rick...... I have the time to answer one of your questions. I'm getting 21" on a man's gold wedding band in the dry sand. (((This is in: All Terrain High Conductors))). Your iron (falsing) question is critical. Remind me.

Florida Son..... there are usually 2 primary freq's in multi-freq platforms that are heavily analyzed; yet, 'harmonics' can 'add' to the multi-freq O.S. ..... on a secondary analyzation basis..... to make up for additional enhancement.

Shelton...... I need to answer this.

NASA-Tom, got it! Thank you. I'm guessing that dirt you described is hotter than mine, but it gives me some good information.

Steve

@ NASA-Tom Thank you!

NASA-TOM thank you as well trust me I won't forget to ask.Iron separation and depth are my two top concerns with a new detector

Jesse Wrote:
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> NASA-TOM thank you as well trust me I won't forget
> to ask.Iron separation and depth are my two top co
> ncerns with a new detector

When it comes time to ask, if you don't mind, add recovery speed to that question also.

I have 2 minutes....... and want to say something:

The ENTIRE PREMISE LIFE-BLOOD of the 3-year Manticore project was to aggressively attack:
1. EMI
2. Beach gold

MISSION: ACCOMPLISHED

You have no idea HOW much this has helped. (On both counts).

Yes....... there's other things that were invented/enhanced.........,,,,,,,,,,,...........but EMI & beach gold is pinnacle/euphoric attributes.

SEVERAL small/different enhancements to improve EMI mitigation........has.........(cumulatively/collectively) attributed to the inland life-blood of the platform.

CRITICAL STATEMENT = I am going to explain MANY things......... (that most folks may never even 'think' to ask.... ----and for unsuspecting rationale----) so as to better: launch folks at a higher (initial/baseline) initiation . , . , . , . , . , time permitting.

Here is one (for example) = Select a program that you desire to hunt with. (For example: All Terrain High Conductors....... which will be a 'primary Mode' for MANY folks......for obvious reasons). Set Sens 2 points higher..... INTO the audible EMI. Press AND "HOLD" the Noise Cancel softkey for about 13 seconds. [[[ Holding the Noise Cancel button pressed...... for any length of time..... is called: LONG PRESS]]]. The detector will cycle through ALL of the 19 Noise Cancel channels every (approx) 2-Seconds. WATCH the faceplate...... looking at the Noise Cancel channels that the unit keeps landing on. You will see the detector narrow down the 19 channels........ down to about 3 Noise Cancel channels.....in short order. The unit will be toggling between these 3 channels. Then....... a few seconds later (continuing the LONG PRESS).,.,.,.,., you will see that MC has narrowed the NC channels...down to 2 channels. Keep continuously pressing the Noise Cancel softkey. You will THEN see the unit 'lock-on' to ONE particular Noise Cancel channel. When the detector stops toggling between NC channels (for a few cycles)...... let go of the Noise Cancel softkey. THEN....... if the detector is too quiet...... bump UP the Sens to: JUST BELOW audible EMI. Go hunt!
If the detector becomes 'chatty'...... do another LONG PRESS. ((( It's a Godsend ))). You've entered into the premise/life-blood of MC. NEVER, NEVER be afraid to use the HECK out of LONG PRESS Noise Cancel. It is the heartbeat of MC.

NASA-Tom -- it may be too soon to ask this, but...

Were any of the details of this noise cancel process you described above, related to one of the "two things" you wanted to see get "wrapped up" before the EQX launch, and which you subsequently said DID INDEED get wrapped up?

Steve

Nasa tom you kinda hurt my soul with the emi and beach gold comment...I don't hunt the beach I only relic hunt and normally emi isn't a problem where I go.So I guess I'm probably just fine with my xp???