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ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000

Posted by NASA-Tom 
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 03, 2019 11:52AM
Cliff- I agree, those round targets tend to hit a lot harder, though still getting the bounce.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 03, 2019 02:06PM
NASA-Tom Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> In furtherance...…… due to the "30%"...…………. the T
> arsacci will not ID targets the way YOU think it "
> should". The Tarsacci is a very different archite
> ct (platform). "Why" this becomes difficult...…. i
> s...…… YOU (an me) need to unlearn our (possibly d
> ecades) of rote-skillset ID 'expectations'...….,,,
> ,,,,,,,,,...……. then: take on a paradigm-shift UNc
> omfort-zone new skillset.
>
> For the past several decades...….. we have had onl
> y two choices of metal detectors to choose from: V
> LF and PI. The Tarsacci is neither; (((FINALLY! A
> third choice!)))
>
> Embrace "change"! - (Read: Technological advan
> cement).
>
> ((( #4 is in-the-works; yet, one huge difficult hu
> rdle to overcome. Guesstimate: 2-years to go.)))

I hope #4 will be able to disc between aluminum and gold...and finally put that au21X tech to good use!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/03/2019 03:02PM by Aaron.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 05, 2019 02:41PM
First trip out using the MDT-8000 with CDV at my favorite beach. First thing I gotta say is this detector is really a different beast compared to all the others I have owned as I first started out detecting 6 years ago with a AT-Pro then I got a Seahunter MKII as my hunting turned from land to almost exclusively beaches. Found enough stuff to get a CTX and then the Equinox came along and I currently have 2 of them. Now I own the MDT-8000 and set it up just as others here have posted 6.4khz SB on at about 27 - 35 GB at 550ish and in Mixed mode. I would of used 9khz but hunting with CDV who was in 9khz the interference would be horrible. Hit the dry sand and the first thing I noticed was how deep it would hit nickels and quarters at 8 to 10 inches. I did notice that on bottle caps in Mixed mode I could nose the coil to them just like on the Equinox and hear the iron tone first and easily ID them as such. We then hit the water which was a bit rough for my liking but toughed it out. On the first run North I was having a tough time getting the detector to run smooth but finally got my settings dialed in. We did a south run down the wet sand and I switched to 12Khz and it ran nice and quiet. Back in the water for our last run North and back to 6.4Khz and immediately found a Mother Mary pendant that had a TID of 6 turned out to be junk Stainless. I did a quick recheck of the hole and hit another target with a TID of 4-5 which ended up being a second pendant of mother mary except this one is unmarked 14K 2.36g. Ended up with $4 in change a silver/10k earring. Oh and a check for $4089 that is endosed on the back of it. I am assuming that it was phone deposited and tossed on the sand,

Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 05, 2019 03:15PM
Todd...….. you are off to a good start! Don't quit!!!!
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 05, 2019 03:27PM
Thanks Tom
cdv
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 05, 2019 04:41PM
Todd, that was a fun hunt, always is fun getting out with you....for the first time out with the machine, you did real good....

Cliff
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 05, 2019 06:44PM
Ok 4 of us that I k ow in Fl now.....no more machines lol. Did you feel you were missing anything using the lower freq that cliff might have gotten? Gold is always a good thing.....sounds like ya got a good handle on it. Conditions aren’t good with those S and W winds.....but it could get us some flip up targets in the wet sand. We have a whole lot of sand to move off the high bank beaches.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 06, 2019 12:03AM
The only thing I think I was missing was my Equinox 800 in beach 1 as I know there had to be a chain somewhere close by those 2 pendants but it is what it is. I think I could of tried 18khz to locate the chain but the frequency I was running had no problems locating targets.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 06, 2019 09:31AM
Funny how those chains go missing .... dang surface moves those targets a good ways. BUT..... ya id spent some time with 18khz looking for those babies. GL with the machine...... and dont assume beach 1 will be anymore effective than the MDT on those chains. You just have to find gold and test it against both machine when you find it.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 08, 2019 01:57AM
Dew...…… My AquaStar-II...….. BEFORE ANY OF MY MOD'S...… could (very slightly) exceed 18" on a Nickel. And that's with a small 10" coil. Now...… my AquaStar will only detect a Nickel to about a foot. . . . . because it has been multiple-tweaked to very small gold. It is running around 8.8uS. The coil is my limiting factor..... precluding me from dropping below 8.8uS. The Tarsacci 'matches' the small-gold performance of my AQ; yet, the Tarsacci far out-performs this AQ on Nickels (and dimes).
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 14, 2019 11:00AM
Dont tell me you are digging those dimes Tom.....lol? Im trying to avoid those higher digits. But i have noticed a bit of upsizing on some targets ..... good example is a penny. good ones are say 13..... but left in the water even deep they can read 17. Few pull tabs have as well..... and they are a bit bouncy..... i assume depth and angle. If you pay attention thou.... ive found those bouncy signals giving high plus digits and a few - digits all most always turn out to be iron. Has anyone found a non-ferr target when seeing some form of a repeated negative digit? Good thing to me because im digging some really deep targets. I cant tell you what every target is going to be ..... but im getting better at the ferr vs the non-ferr. The machine does well on round targets ... like rings digits dont jump around much. First and most important to me is just finding a target...... this machine seems to do that very well..... so if you are into digging it all ..... have fun because you will be digging some deep ones. It really sounds off even at depth limits so i cant say im getting a lot of what we often call "weak" signals. Unless some of those pops we get as a digit changes over minerals are really deeper targets. Most dont repeat...... and for the most part in 9khz the machine is almost silent on most of my beaches. If it gets a little chatty...... the Nox would be REALLY chatty in the same conditions ran at my normal settings for both. I run this machine MAX sensitivity and threshold in AM...... so when i talk about jumpy digits thats definitely a factor. Im looking for a target.... ill figure out what it is after i find it.... obviously there are reasons i shouldnt and in most cases like other machines id likely have gotten the target anyway with a more stable digit. Dug a good very expensive looking gold claddagh earring today with impressive stones........ BUT turned out to be ... again gold plated SS.... ugh.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 14, 2019 11:34PM
After another coin hunt last night where I picked up two more nice rings, I thought I'd share this:

One thing about the MDT I noticed early on is...It hates small/thin foil...a dead giveaway of some form of pulse technology.

So, just for fun today, I cut up the thin foil wrapper from a piece of cheapo Easter candy, and made some small foil targets.
I'm sorry, I didn't measure thickness as I've misplaced my micrometer...but it's extremely thin. (Candy wan't any good either.)

Results:
The MDT won't even see a (roughly) 3/8" square...or even a piece about 3/8" x 5/8".
Same pieces of foil that the Equinox will gladly hit at over 5-1/5".

Bigger sized pieces of foil, the MDT is still a little 'numb' to, and still has some trouble picking up. (Which is a good thing.)
EQ really 'perks up', and will gladly have you digging deep for the same thin foil.
(Huge foil targets, of course, become annoyingly visible to everything.)

Since a lot (probably most) gold jewelry hits in the foil range, this make the MDT a serious ring/jewelry magnet.
(Ironically, my very first target ever with the MDT was a wedding band.)

I really like that ability/feature, as I can't tell you how much time I've wasted over the decades trying to chase down a stupid little bit of foil.
smiling smiley
mike
cdv
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 15, 2019 12:04AM
Mike, I've noticed the same thing on the dry sand where there is an abundance of foil targets on the surface although I never seriously tested them as you did.
Thanks for the testing and post.
Cliff
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 15, 2019 02:00AM
This is correct. When you are in the 'Salt' Mode..... the Tarsacci does ignore chewing gum foil more readily. Come out of the 'Salt' Mode...…. and the foil is back (detectable).
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 15, 2019 02:49AM
Dimitar explained this to me a couple weeks ago, sure enough it works, as long as it’s not a balled up and flatten piece of foil.

No gold yet though...
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 15, 2019 05:42AM
Salt, small aluminum - if the salt mode ignores these well - well, goodbye to tiny gold. It’s the curse of salt water detectors apparently. Guess you will just have to settle bor big gold jewelry! Lol

Rick Kempf
Gold Canyon AZ- where there is no gold
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 15, 2019 09:37AM
I assure you ..... this machine hits the VERY VERY tiny aluminum pieces IN the salt water and on the wet sand........as well as the Nox. Foil isnt normally a big issue in the water or for that matter there isnt a lot in the wet sand either Rick. Thats a dry sand issue..... mostly it gets blown up and buried in the rises. Ive tested this machine on MOST of the gold ive found with all my beach and water machines...... only a very tiny thin cross and part of a chain wasnt detectable......BUT the nox barely got it in multi freq... and the Xcal and CTX didnt either. Now ...... define TINY GOLD? One of those chains i have is a .3 gram chain...... POINT 3 grams..... thats tiny to me. I think you will also find this machine was designed not to chase micro gold...... why .... because most beach hunters were annoyed and found the trash to gold average just not worth it. Currently i believe ive found or at least shown more small gold than JAG has and ive only had the machine about 3 mos and hunted with it about half that. By the way those 4 items on top are 22 to 24 K gold.....that figure 8 earring is also 24K. Im one of the few who would really like a machine that gets TINY gold...... but most are looking for nothing smaller than this just because of that last photo....trash. This machine is deeper on most of the gold rings ive tested than the Nox.... and much better if the ring is on edge or at an angle. Those rings that move...... many get pushed up against a rise, buried, and end up on an angle just like coins.

Tom...... you just hit me on the back of the head with your post. Ill be...... ive been hunting the dry sand in the higher freqs with the SALT BALANCE ON...... duh. Ya know i dont think ive ever turned it off to see how it runs. I know with the Nox if there is a lot of moisture just under the dry sand .....say after a rain, it doesnt like some of the high freqs or even some of the modes in multi that dont have a salt setting run chatty. I dont hunt a lot of dry sand...... but now ive got to see what it does especially on those gum wrappers.







Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 05/15/2019 10:08AM by dewcon4414.
cdv
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 20, 2019 06:51PM
Tom, has there been any progress on waterproof phones for the MDT yet or has/is that something not being pursued now?

Has anyone else experienced a sound the machine makes when the control unit first meets the water? Never really noticed it previously until today, not a loud sound but more like a soft background buzz that goes away soon after immersion. I know the Aquasound had a similar noise/sound it made when the control box first contacted the water and I do not believe this to be a problem, more just a curiosity and thought I'd mention it. I am presently using phones with Audiosear speakers and that may be the reason I am hearing it over the other phones which has piezo's installed.

Cliff
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 21, 2019 01:42AM
Cliff...… no. In fact, there have been very few requests for us to make UW headphones. What is requested the most (and by a large margin) is..... the M8 waterproof pigtail.,.,.,.,.,.,.,. so folks can create their own (favorite/s) headphone adaptation.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 21, 2019 10:34AM
I wanted to pass this on for those of you using the machine in the water. The RED Orings ..... if you need to replace yours ..... you a can get them from McMaster's PN 1173N018. The black ones come with the cap...... so we are going to have to run this one down..... it to me is VERY important to know. I know its MM so our hardware stores dont seem to have it ..... and this is one time close like hand grenades wont count. Also ... i like to see if anyone has a part number for the washer that goes connects the lower shaft to coil connector?

Id suspect you are right. Speakers seem to limit the amount of modulation...... and up the volume as well as what you hear. Im using Tony's just because they do give me a little more modulation. Harolds phones ... audiosear speakers.... i didnt seem to be able to tell large deep targets. Do you think you are getting DEEP targets with the speaker better than with the piezo? To me its like working a trashy park with a machine that has GAIN. You would use max gain (speaker) to bring the weak targets out..... but in an open area you want a bit more modulation (piezo) on those weak targets to determine depth on a target thats not quit identifiable..... dig or no dig.
cdv
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 21, 2019 12:37PM
Dew, I'm no audio expert by any means but I think you may be misusing the word modulation. We can debate that off line..lol

With my current Minelab modified phones (piezo's), I have to turn up the volume to max to hear properly, with the Audiosears (Harold's), my volume is much lower usually at 10 I can't say I'm hearing deeper targets with the speakers vs the piezo's mainly because you would need both sets to swap on a given deep target to test. Any answer to that would question would be subjective at best. Since I only use the piezo's when I intend on snorkeling, I use the audiosears 95% of the time and in that time period have used/learned the machine more on them... swapping to the piezo's does require a short learning period since the machine sounds "different".....again, which is better is subjective and depends on ones hearing quite a bit.

Cliff
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 21, 2019 02:10PM
I see a debate coming ....remember I’m hard headed and OLD lol. Modulation: variation in the strength, tone, or pitch. I use this term because i believe the Explorer used it when referring to the use of the Gain.

Hey on that sound you get when the box enters the water. Is it possible you are getting some salt water in your M8 Causing a temporary grounding issue....or is the coil nearing the hard pan? I had an Xcal that used to do that every time the tubes entered the water.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/21/2019 02:20PM by dewcon4414.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 21, 2019 03:30PM
From owning/using about 5 Excals over the years I've found that some would false when they first touched the salt water and some would not. Various theories have been suggested, but the reality is just that. Not all did it and we could not find a common thread to predict or cure it.

Past(or)Tom
Using a Tarsacci MDT 8000, an Equinox 800, Deus/ORX & others...
with my brilliant Corgi, Sadie
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 21, 2019 06:00PM
We did however seen an attempt Tom. Some of those machines had a third wire.....it was connected to the board...... went into the headphones.. NO WHERE...... so lord knows why lol. By the way...... 18k running in the dry sand with NO salt setting works pretty well. I was afraid i might get a bit more EMI response....... but didnt seem to. Now a group question.......i seem to get a popping sound intermittently ..... i notice the diggits jump..... like you might get from EMI. So do you guy try and run the sensitivity....... lower to keep the digits from jumping? I know on some machines running HOT affects PPing as well as what digit it might throw.... i dont seem to have an issue with that even HOT. I do see aluminum up-sizing the digits .... say DEEP part of a pull tab...... and a penny will do it ... 13 to say 17 depending on the condition and depth. Anyone paying attention to the response of DEEP gold?
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 21, 2019 06:03PM
We did however see an attempt Tom. Some of those machines had a third wire.....it was connected to the board...... went into the headphones.. NO WHERE...... so lord knows why lol. By the way...... 18k running in the dry sand with NO salt setting works pretty well. I was afraid i might get a bit more EMI response....... but didnt seem to. Now a group question.......i seem to get a popping sound intermittently ..... i notice the diggits jump..... like you might get from EMI. So do you guy try and run the sensitivity....... lower to keep the digits from jumping? I ask that because if its EMI.... it doesnt seem to affect a target....and runs very quiet with just this slight popping. I know on some machines running HOT affects PPing as well as what digit it might throw.... i dont seem to have an issue with that even HOT. I do see aluminum up-sizing the digits .... say DEEP part of a pull tab...... and a penny will do it ... 13 to say 17 depending on the condition and depth. Anyone paying attention to the response of DEEP gold?
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 21, 2019 11:13PM
I am trying to catch up to you guys. Yes...… I get a bit of a hum when I submerge my MDT coil in the saltwater..... right at the point of contact. This may be because I am shoving the coil at a fairly good speed into the water. I have not tried this at a slower submersion speed.

Also...… "sometimes"...…. when the M8 connector on the back of the control box touches the saltwater...…. I'll also hear a short buzz. It is very minor...… and does not happen very often.

Dew...…. if there is ANY audio response (master)……. the VDI (slave) will also follow. What you are asking (in actuality) is...… not about the jumping VDI; but/rather, about the occasional audio pops/chirps. The cause:

Very faint targets.
Subsurface damp spots (saltwater) whilst not in Salt Mode..... and hunting the dry sand.
Mineralization delta's.
EMI
ESD
cdv
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 23, 2019 03:59PM
Best day in the water to date with the MDT. Five rings, (three gold) couple of silver earrings that had been in there awhile. The one 10k ring is similar to a coin ring but has some 10k disc inside it, picture attached. Anyone have any idea what the disc symbolizes?
Spent over 5 minutes digging that 10k ring, it was the deepest (or most elusive) gold ring I've ever dug (in the water)….between waves, current and my questionable pinpointing ability it took a long time to get.

Cliff





Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 23, 2019 04:58PM
Looks like you found a spot that really paid off. You are having a better month than me. Congrats on the gold. On a roll buddy.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 24, 2019 11:27PM
Man that’s awesome, congrats!
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 25, 2019 08:14PM
VERY nice Cliff! And it's only May. Not the middle of August/summer! I think your finds will increase....as we phase out of Spring.... and go into Summer.
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