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ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000

Posted by NASA-Tom 
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
April 06, 2020 02:44AM
YubaJ Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Keith, The video stopped before you were finished.
>
> Did you have the iron audio turned off when y
> ou were going over the hammer head?
>
> Thanks, Joel And great reporting!!!!! I 2nd
> the request for a smaller coil!


Sorry for short video.It was a text message video and they are short..But upload quick also.!!

Basically the last word was that hammer head is under coil same time penny is under coil.

Yes I had iron tone turned off so that's why hammer head was silent when I swung it without penny in field of view of the coil.

That's what I was getting at on the Tarsacci in iron its pretty dang quite on things like that hammer that should be poppy sounding on most machines.Once you learn to ignore the pings from certain small bent iron and or larger iron falses the good stuff just jumps out at you.Just go slow.

A small coil on this thing will be most welcome.

I know its a short grainy video but its just to show what's going on.

Keith

“I don't care that they stole my idea . . I care that they don't have any of their own”
-Nikola Tesla
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
April 06, 2020 10:08AM
I wonder how other detectors would perform on that hammer test compared to the Tarsacci.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
April 06, 2020 11:08AM
Hello From France

Soon i will make a nex vidéo with small hamer. I can compare Deus, Vanquish 540, Minelad Equinox 800, and the Tarsacci.

What i would like to see from US it's a video who show how to make GB and Salinity balance with the Tarsacci. I already ask it from Dimitar.
But no vidéo !
May be if i now how i can do this GB, i can show that Tarsacci is better than Equinox

I have a lot of sucribers and a lot of people follow what i can show.

29000 views for this video !
[www.youtube.com]

Magus.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
April 06, 2020 12:23PM
Thanks Keith. . . .. . .. . Sounds like the salt balance is like a typical manual ground balance procedure, no biggie. That penny next to the hammer was an eye opener.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
April 06, 2020 12:24PM
Magnus,

Were looking forward to seeing the results your comparison video! Please note that the hammer Keith is using is NOT a modern hammer, it’s a 1850’s style blacksmith hammer, NOT a HOME DEPOT high carbon hammer, it’s the REAL deal iron.

Also, I’ve never known Dimitar to post a video, however I think we can help out there......
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
April 06, 2020 12:24PM
I dont know that you are going to show that one is BETTER than the other unless you define the conditions and targets. Like most of the better mouse traps...... each has their place where they perform best. We arent talking about the middle of the line detectors performance here on either machine. Design purpose and where they are used still will determine which machine to grab. So i dont think its a matter of showing the MDT is ALWAYS the better choice over the Nox.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
April 06, 2020 04:52PM
I'm wonder how the Tarsacci would do with the gold ring test using some highly mineralized bags of black sand along with the nails/gold ring test that is shown in the video for the Manta. One thing the seems pretty certain from Tom and many users post for the Tarsacci , is that , it is a very versatile unit.

El
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
April 06, 2020 05:33PM
Elbert,

Checkout Teresa aka “CoilPower”’ posts. She’s down in New Zealand working highly mineralized black sand beaches. She has has posted many really deep, ((SMALL)) gold items in that NASTY black sand!

[www.detectorprospector.com]

Were hoping to get Teresa to join us here SOON!


HH! Aaron
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
April 06, 2020 08:55PM
Little more info.

Now I'm slow to catch on.

I got to testing some other units on the hammer Head last night and the units false on the hammer Head but miss the penny.

So after I went to bed i was laying there thinking then the scenario came clear to me.The tarsacci is operating in time domain.The things it exhibits is very much like say a GPX timing settings.

The little dead pan pings on tiny nails or even some soil ping.They are a by product of the technology.timing trickery's.Yet it's dead on on discrimination of like say that hammer head.Very quiet exact ID .

The tarsacci is a unit we've been wanting for years and its hear.

Its a discriminating pulse unit!!

Im slow to catch on but the whole unit to me now makes sense.And why it does what it does .especially the Punch and see around in iron.Pulse units can exhibit great things in iron in terms of see around.BUT they don have disc The tarsacci does and its using time domain.

Now no ones verified this to me but it's my gut feeling.A new door has been opened.

Like I said before this is Real tech and now I have a greater respect for it.As I feel I know whats going on.Things will drive me crazy till i know how they work.In a moment of clarity it made sense to me.We are in a new era of technology !!

The machine is actually easier to run in iron and produce with less falsing than a VLF.you just got to know the language which isnt difficult.Things happen because it has to be that way when working in time domain.

Keith

“I don't care that they stole my idea . . I care that they don't have any of their own”
-Nikola Tesla
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
April 06, 2020 09:42PM
My problem with disc mode is those pings/falses from the soil. In some areas of bad ground, they are so numerous that it really bogs you down trying to cipher if what you heard was a false or actual target. Thus why I run in mix mode most of the time. The little pings are still going on, but by being able to hear the all metal audio, I know what is a false and what is a target. Almost all the falses on my machine seem to be +28s, +29s, +30s. I really wish there was a way to silence those particular numbers.

What we have in the Tarsacci is indeed new and unique. But I wont go so far as to say it is matching a GPX. For depth and stability, coil for coil, the GPX is still the best at handling bad ground IMO. The kicker there is, by having so many coils for a GPX you can really trick one out. The 15 inch Spiral on a GPX is the deepest machine I've ever used to date in bad ground.

The Tarsacci to me, falls between a TDI and GPX in depth. I think both the pulses are overall more stable and less subjective to ground changes but if we're talking about depth, then it for sure falls in between those two. The Equinox gets compared because its a waterproof machine. Nobody in their right mind is going to get a GPX near water lol There for a while the Tarsacci was being pushed into the direction of a niche beach machine and thus beach hunters were doing all the talk. Coil size for coil size (11 vs 11 inch) the Tarsacci will beat an Equinox by about 2 inches in my soil on coin size objects. When I put the 15" elliptical on the Equinox, they are about the same in depth, and I would even say the Nox comes across as having a bit more stable ID on the deepest of targets. At least mine is. That is why I want a bigger coil for the Tarsacci.

I have one newer section of a test garden that I did when I moved to my new house. I did it slightly different...via digging straight down and planting my target into the sidewall of my hole as far in as I could. The objective was to have undisturbed soil above the target. In this case they are 2 dropped minie balls. One is buried at exactly 10 inches the other at 12 inches. They are in different spots, not the same hole. Anyway...a GPX can hit them all day long from every angle. No problem and beg for more. The Equinox, Park 1, Sens 20, Fe2 @ 2 will barely hit the 10 inch one with its 11 inch coil. It is a mostly iron hit with occasional chirp. The 12 inch one is just not there to it. With the 15 inch coil on, the 10 inch is all positive numbers in the mid teens and tone to accompany that. The 12 inch bullet...the 15" coil hits it well from one angle with mostly positive numbers but the numbers are all over. The other angles, it wants to read it mostly as iron with occasional jump into the positive range.

We only have the stock 8x11 for the Tarsacci but running it Sens 8, Disc 0, black sand off, -1 threshold will result in a good positive hit on the 10 inch minie all the way around. The 12 inch one only comes in on the all metal audio side with an occasional high ping (once out of every 3 or 4 sweeps across it) from one particular angle (the same angle the Equinox also responds well at). Otherwise, running Disc mode even at 0 disc would result in missing that bullet. Mix mode you can hear it well on the all metal side and can tell it is a nice smooth signal. Thus why you'll rarely catch me with the 15 inch coil OFF of the Nox when I am using it, and why I am patiently inpatient on a bigger Tarsacci coil. If it will boost it 2 or so inches like the coil does on the Nox...then we are in some uncharted territory for a non pulse machine.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
April 06, 2020 10:13PM
Hey Daniel God to see you!

Good info.

Have you tried setting your disc to 30 that will silence 28-29-30.the disc above iron settings is a notch.Where ever you set disc it cover a 2 point spread above +2 and below -2 the actual setting.Put it on 30 and 28 and 29 is also silenced.

Keith

“I don't care that they stole my idea . . I care that they don't have any of their own”
-Nikola Tesla
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
April 06, 2020 11:41PM
Does anyone know if using discrimination decreases depth performance at all?
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
April 07, 2020 12:25AM
Daniel-what Kieth said about disc. I used to disc those numbers out in my soil as I had the same issue. Everything you said mimics my experience with the Tarsacci. As you probably know I sold mine a while back so that's why nobody has heard much from me about the Tarsacci lately. As soon as this virus thing is over and I feel like I dare spend some money, I plan on picking a Tarsacci up again.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
April 07, 2020 02:20AM
Correct. Setting Disc at '30'...… will silence 28, 29, 30.
Also...………. sometimes setting Disc higher than actual Ground Balance conditions...… can minimize/mitigate 28, 29, 30 falsing.
There is also...…… Salt Balance that can also achieve the same.

Daniel Tn...…………. What coil are you primarily using on your GPX? I seem to recall it was the 15" coil.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
April 07, 2020 03:16AM
Nasa Tom - On the GPX coils I swapped over to DeTech coils. My primary coil was their 11 inch round DD because their coils are waterproof and the Minelab commander coils are not. Minelab Commander coils were having a lot of issues with coils going bad due to moisture from wet grass, snow, etc so I went to a waterproof coil. I had the 15" Spiral DD when I wanted to hunt just for extreme depth and or trying to locate a hut or trash pit to dig out. The GPX and 15 inch coil is in a whole different world as far as depth goes. Heavy as heck but DEEEPPP. I don't have a GPX any more. My hunting doesn't require a need for one. I don't go to the VA hunts any more and most of my hunting interests these days are water hunting instead of relic hunting. Of the 3 machines I have left, all are waterproof ID machines. If I relic hunted more and or still went to the Culpeper hunts, I would most definitely still have a GPX. For just an occasional relic hunt and mostly beach hunting, I am down to the Tarsacci, Nox 800, and CTX 3030. And the CTX is for sale, as I've found the other 2 to best it for what I do.

Abenson -- I wonder if no one else is having those traits out of the Tarsacci, if it is just that specific machine? As it turns out, the one I now own is your old machine.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
April 07, 2020 08:05AM
Daniel, great to have undisturbed soil in your test garden, but how do you know there isn't a bit of iron or something else in there to skew your tests?
Is it better to have metal free soil or undisturbed soil? I'd shoot for the clean, just a thought.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
April 07, 2020 10:16AM
Daniel...…….. thanks for the very comprehensive answer. Good data!
And...……….. I had forgotten that you sold the Minelab GPX. You are down to owning/using a Tarsacci and EQX only. I believe all your bases are covered.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
April 07, 2020 05:14PM
Ozzie - Before I put anything in the area that became the test garden, I ran through the area with a detector in all metal and there is no iron or other signals there. That's why I chose that particular spot. It's actually on a 4 wheeler trail I made through the woods on my property.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
April 07, 2020 09:46PM
One more test with the Tarsacci.

A horseshoe and zinc penny.

Again this should not happen.The Horseshoe is under coil at same time as the penny and is abundantly larger than the penny.

Usually we use targets of the sane size to show unmasking.like a penny and a nail.

Or a horseshoe and a belt plate.

Not so with this unit.the unit is some how overcoming the large iron halo barrier and still hitting the coin.and with not even falsing on the horseshoe.VLFs false on the horse shoe easily.that's why I have a truck load of them.

This it seems why I'm seeing so many non ferrous targets in heavy iron sites heavily hunted..and quiet easily i might add.

[www.youtube.com]

Keith

“I don't care that they stole my idea . . I care that they don't have any of their own”
-Nikola Tesla
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
April 07, 2020 09:49PM
That's impressive Keith.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
April 07, 2020 10:31PM
Wow. What happens when you put the penny in the center of the shoe space, not touching the shoe? That's asking too much, isn't it? Thanks Keith.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
April 07, 2020 10:45PM
Ozzie, the question that you and everyone else SHOULD be asking is..........

“CAN ANY OTHER METAL DETECTOR REPLICATE THIS DEMONSTRATION?”

WELCOME TO THE NEXT LEVEL IN METAL DETECTING TECHNOLOGY
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
April 08, 2020 02:15AM
Someone wanted to see same test in disc mode only not mixed mode like in first horse shoe video.

[www.youtube.com]

Keith

“I don't care that they stole my idea . . I care that they don't have any of their own”
-Nikola Tesla
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
April 08, 2020 02:17AM
ozzie Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Wow. What happens when you put the penny in the ce
> nter of the shoe space, not touching the shoe? Tha
> t's asking too much, isn't it? Thanks Keith.

Ill see Ozzie I dont think so though!

Keith

“I don't care that they stole my idea . . I care that they don't have any of their own”
-Nikola Tesla
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
April 08, 2020 02:28AM
Magus Detection Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hello From France
>
> Soon i will make a nex vidéo with small hamer. I c
> an compare Deus, Vanquish 540, Minelad Equinox 800
> , and the Tarsacci.
>
> What i would like to see from US it's a video who
> show how to make GB and Salinity balance with the
> Tarsacci. I already ask it from Dimitar.
> But no vidéo !
> May be if i now how i can do this GB, i can show t
> hat Tarsacci is better than Equinox
>
> I have a lot of sucribers and a lot of people foll
> ow what i can show.
>
> 29000 views for this video !
> [www.youtube.com]
>
> Magus.


Magnus,

Forget about the hammer, we’re up to horseshoes now, and Keith has a REALLY nice rusty one for you and your MineLabs! (-;



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/08/2020 03:21AM by Aaron.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
April 08, 2020 09:26AM
If you don't mind Keith, same test but I'd like to hear the iron and the coin.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
April 08, 2020 09:34AM
Aaron Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Ozzie, the question that you and everyone else SHO
> ULD be asking is.........
>
> “CAN ANY OTHER METAL DETECTOR REPLICATE THIS DEMON
> STRATION?”
>
> WELCOME TO THE NEXT LEVEL IN METAL DETECTING TECHN
> OLOGY

Aaron, I think most boys now the answer to that one.....none of my units will do that...and I don't recall seeing one that will....but I wouldn't bet my horse on it.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/08/2020 09:35AM by ozzie.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
April 08, 2020 10:41AM
I guess what Ozzie is saying is, go try it yourself.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
April 08, 2020 11:36AM
Steve...….. where you hear the iron AND the coin...……. is in Keith's first horseshoe/penny video. That's "MIXED" Mode...… which presents all-metal and ID audio. The predominant audio...…. is of the iron. The tiny 'high-tone "tinkle"' is the Zinc Cent.
(((If I'm understanding your question correctly)))!

Phenomenal video capture!
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
April 08, 2020 11:48AM
NASA-Tom Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Steve...….. where you hear the iron AND the coin..
> .……. is in Keith's first horseshoe/penny video. Th
> at's "MIXED" Mode...… which presents all-metal and
> ID audio. The predominant audio...…. is of the iro
> n. The tiny 'high-tone "tinkle"' is the Zinc Cent.
> (((If I'm understanding your question correctly)))
> !
>
> Phenomenal video capture!

Tom, thanks for the head smack.. ... ... occasionally, my memory is short. The coin and iron sounds are almost overlapping, they are so close. Wow!
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