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ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000

Posted by NASA-Tom 
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 17, 2020 03:53AM
Yes Keith that’s correct, Salinity is not needed under 600 Ground. However, Dimatar also said that it doesn’t hurt to leave it on. Hence, I always leave my on as my ground varies from high 500’s to high 700’s.

FYI....Dimatar also said that you should try experimenting w the Black sand on & off in various situations as it may help.

Finally got out in the water today for the first time this year. I didnt really use the Tarsacci that much in the water last year as I was focusing on relic hunting. I was out for 6hrs in a lake in a State Park today that has over a hundred years of history and ALOT of iron.

This lake is hunted hard by guys every week and usually on Monday mornings. There is a area where a old canoe dock used to be over 50yrs ago, and with lots of old nails. I hit this spot hard last year w the GMP and Equinox and found 2 gold rings and a earring. I went over some of this area again w the Tarsacci, and managed to find a antique air valve cap, a .22 short and a Wheat cent. The iron is pretty bad, and sounds like machine gun fire. In this area I am running 18khz, Salinity 21, Threshold-9, Sensitivity 4-5, Disc mode. I’m also running Salt on.

I spent most of the time in the iron areas as those are the spots most of the hunters avoid

I was also very surprised at the depth on some of the other targets like 2 brass kids rings. One is a small wire ring, diameters smaller than penny, fake stone setting, was down there around a foot and sounded very clear.

Agreed Keith, the Tarsacci’s ability to find small non-fe targets in heavy iron is uncanny. It seems the tiny targets in iron are almost easier to find because their “amplified”, also the coins that are close to the surface are “toned” down. It also seems I get less chirps and falsing in the heavier iron spots especially w the -9 Threshold.

On my way home I was thinking about the hunt and I realized a couple things. This is the first time I’ve found this many coins (most in iron) and this is the very first time I’ve detected in this lake and NEVER dug one piece of iron.....I need to get back soon and just focus specifically on the bad iron spots,

TARSACCI - “Digging deeper, BEHIND the competition!”
[www.tarsaccisales.com]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/17/2020 04:20AM by Aaron.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 21, 2020 04:24PM
Ghound No I didnt film anything Well I did but it was to show in a text video how much nails was in the hole because it had be scratching my had hitting that little cuff that deep in them.



Here's the smaller sizes even the low freq can pull in nails.


Keith

“I don't care that they stole my idea . . I care that they don't have any of their own”
-Nikola Tesla
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 21, 2020 06:53PM
Keith, if you message me your address i could send you a silver hammered to use as a test piece, i need to know if this machine can give me an edge.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 26, 2020 09:49PM
As many of you may remember I got a Tarsacci back when they were first released and had it for about 4 months. I mainly used it for relic hunting but did a little beach hunting with it as well. Never ventured into thick iron with it while I had it though.

About a month ago I picked up another one and have been testing it in the field for many hours. Also been messaging Keith, Tom, Arron and Daniel getting their settings/advice on working the Tarsacci in heavy iron/mineralized ground.
So here’s what I found. First, you are going to need to setup the Tarsacci for your ground specifically, other people’s settings don’t always work. I’ve found that my salt balance numbers are way higher than others I have compared them to, my ground salt balances at 44 and within 4 points up or down I get significant noise when pumping the coil. My ground balance is anywhere from a low of 636 to a high of 802 depending on where I’m hunting. Black sand makes a little difference in depth, but I find the best use for it is to mitigate EMI. 18 KHz seems to best in iron, 12 KHz in open ground, at least for me. I’ve been running sensitivity at 7 and threshold at -2 for the most part. I think Keith mentioned in one of his posts that running threshold at -2 keeps him from digging the small bitty stuff and I agree. In iron I like disc mode and the jury is still out as to whether I like running -30 disc or 0 disc. 0 disc sure makes for a quiet hunt but -30 disc gives a lot more information. In open ground I think I like All Metal the best. Sweep speed needs to be right especially in iron and IMO you can’t work the Tarsacci like a VLF with short choppy strokes. The Tarsacci needs to be swung side to side in a consistent manner and I like using about a 3 foot wide sweep to keep things under control.

Now in the really think iron I found that running my salt balance up to 50 which is max (I could probably use a higher range) and my ground balance up about 150 points higher than the actual GB number really starts to do some serious unmasking. Iffy signals really start to clean up.
I’ve done some hunts now where I’ve taken the Tarsacci through and area and dug every non-ferrous signal I could find. Then gone back over with the Equinox 800 11” coil and dug nothing but a few nails or bits of lead that were iffy on the Equinox but sounded good enough to dig. So the Tarsacci isn’t missing much and isn’t falsing on the iron anywhere near as bad as the Equinox. The Tarsacci isn’t a Deus killer though IMO, in shallow trashy sites, the Deus is still at the top of the list in that regard. But in areas where targets are mixed with iron down to the 12” plus range it’s a great machine and I feel can run right along side the Equinox no problem. Really the only advantage I’m seeing with the Equinox is really small low conductors like .22 brass/lead and p-caps. Small pewter button size targets and up the Tarsacci has no problem with. I does take some time to keep from chasing the few nail falses the Tarsacci has, but you soon start to recognize when you’re over a good target vs a nail/iron false.

I’ll start posting some finds and do some videos. Videos I’m finding are really hard to do with the Tarsacci in the field, the sound is really quiet and getting the sweep speed right while trying to hold a camera isn’t that easy. Might be time to get a chest mounted GoPro.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 27, 2020 02:17AM
Andrew, yes agreed regarding setting up according to you own ground. The numbers that Keith has suggested can very in my ground around 4 points.

You said: “ Now in the really thick iron I found that running my salt balance up to 50 which is max (I could probably use a higher range) and my ground balance up about 150 points higher than the actual GB number really starts to do some serious unmasking. Iffy signals really start to clean up.” What kHz are you running in w the Salt maxed out, 6.4? Sounds interesting...I’ll have to try it.

And yes, once I started running Disc at -30 in heavy iron, the picture changes...big time!

Swing speed is something that I didn’t figure till later (w Keith & Teresa’s help!), and it very important. It’s not like the FBS machines, you can’t make a bad target sound good,,,i.e. “MineLab wiggle”. However I think Keith’s right regarding sweep speed, it should be swept like a CZ or FBS.

And yes agreed. The Tarsacci does better in iron than the Equinox, I discovered that last summer. It’s hard to explain unless you’ve used it, the language is different and more informative.

Regarding videos, I here ya. I’ve got a GoPro and trying get proficient w it but it’s not easy. I’ve got a lot of respect for the guys who video live hunts. It’s NOT easy!

TARSACCI - “Digging deeper, BEHIND the competition!”
[www.tarsaccisales.com]
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 27, 2020 02:52AM
Aaron I'm running 18 KHz in the iron, I've tried other frequencies but right now I like 18 KHz seems to have the least falsing. As far as salt balance goes I only max out because my salt number is so high to start with. I would suggest going about 8 to 10 points above what you soil salt balances at as a starting point.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 27, 2020 02:59AM
Yes, 18khz is what I’ve been running in iron as well. I’m finding really tiny non-fe stuff amidst the iron. And honestly, that’s the frequency I’ve been using. Keith however claims the 6.4 is getting him even better depth.....

TARSACCI - “Digging deeper, BEHIND the competition!”
[www.tarsaccisales.com]
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 27, 2020 03:52AM
In my silica-sand mineral-free Florida dirt...… 18kHz is my best choice for unmasking in carpets of nails. Salt Balance NEEDS to be 'on'; yet, it's settings are not that critical in my low/no mineral dirt.
6.4kHz 'hi-tone' falses too much …. in this Florida dirt..... in carpets of nails.....,,,,,, regardless of Salt Balance settings. Keith's high mineral intensity.... will express different settings; yet, the range and Modes availability are there.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 27, 2020 03:55AM
I wanted to say something else about the Tarsacci that probably a lot of non-users don't know. The Tarsacci isn't going to perform well on any above ground tests like Montes nail board, etc. The Tarsacci is using the ground, salt, iron, minerals, etc to excel at both depth and unmasking targets. It's hard to explain but it becomes evident once you start testing it in different scenarios in the field. I've compared quite a few targets in the field with the Equinox and Tarsacci and found the Tarsacci audio much cleaner and more sure about itself. The key is you have to unlock your soil with the Tarsacci settings. A combination of ground balance, salt balance, threshold, KHz, sensitivity, sweep speed, etc. Is what makes the Tarsacci perform at an elevated level. It took me weeks of testing and conversing with others to figure it out. Once figured out, the Tarsacci becomes a very quiet running efficent machine compared to most VLF'S
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 27, 2020 01:42PM
Andrew...…. it really sounds like you came BACK up to speed...…. and then some! I'm just glad the detector 'has' the available adjustable tools to perform like it is...for you (and all others).
Yes..... correct. Tarsacci air-tests are (nearly) terrible! Even my test-garden..... is nearly a air-test. Tarsacci needs some minerals.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 27, 2020 03:00PM
Can i ask how forgiving the detector is when the settings aren't perfect.
I remember the AKA Signum i had was awesome when you had it set perfect, then 10ft later as the ground changed, even slightly, it was out of wack and you had to reset/balance it as the performance fell off a cliff when it wasn't perfect and you might as well have been swinging an Ace250 lol
So is the MDT a detector that your constantly having to be adjusting as the ground varies to keep it in the sweet spot, and does it's performance dramatically drop when not set perfect?
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
May 27, 2020 03:41PM
Its not like the Signum in that regard.

The Signum is a VLF and can be strung out very hot and when you do a VLF like that everything has to be exact to be intelligent.

MDT once you find what works for you and you learn the language you wont tweak it alot.And its deep and unmask with just out of the box settings.

Its very easy to run really once you adapt to the audio.There's alot going on inside that beep.

The SALT balance is really the only control that may frighten people but dont put too much concern into that at first you can even leave it off if you like till you get used to machine then start playing with it.or if you turn it on theres some suggested pre sets for each freq in an earlier post.

You'll find the salt balance will clean up signals that are iffy or all the way reduced to being called ferrous instead of non ferrous in the dirt
that happens to a vlf. When its right it helps remove the iron tinge tone of soil mineral incursion when you say hit a target and it wants to slightly have that iron tone grunt on the edges of the target from soil overpowering the edges of the signal as the audio gate opens.Well the Salt balance can remove that edge signal grunt if iron tone is turned on or if iron tone is off it will help remove the edge crackle that VLFs are prone to do.


Keith

“I don't care that they stole my idea . . I care that they don't have any of their own”
-Nikola Tesla
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
June 01, 2020 10:09AM
Its been much busier since the beaches opened ....crazy amount of hunters out there now too. People have a lot of down time and are picking up the hobby this year again. Yesterday there were hunters from up North, Ft Meyers, and Tampa out there. Just an odd year of hunting thus far at the beginning of whats normally recent drop time. Sand bars hasnt gotten much better either so with those sand bars moving in closer to shore making it more shallow people are all over the place out there. so to find much of anything you have to grind and put in some hours. I thought id post a picture from yesterday. I decided to do what i call a 'COMMUNITY SERVICE' dig, much like we do during the winter months and not really concentrate on recent drops. Besides these targets i took a lot of scoops off to ID iron targets as well. Normally im on who says .....why dont they better separate targets in the lower digits so i can tell trash from gold? But .... ive found i kind of like what this machine does. Gold seems to be very concentrated falling in the 1 to 10 digits with a few exceptions.... but not many. I like that this machine tends to upscale deep trash in the salt water. A pull tab or foil which normally reads 6 or less..... may jump to the low 20s. Bottle caps if they dont bong iron they may read 15ish..... but will jump in the 20s as well. I feel pretty comfortable when just looking for gold i could walk right over all this stuff..... and sometimes do. There were 5 other hunters out there and from what i understand talking to others an evening crew showed up as well just to tell you how many diggers we have right now. But note the number of nickels i got...... 18. Theres a lot of targets there i kept saying...... why werent these dug??? Got to be some gold here. I didnt find any. But these targets was telling me im getting a bit deeper or these guys are playing catch and release with the targets. Some do. We loose very little depth on gold in the water and they have pretty consistent digits. I was hunting in AM sensitivity 9, salt 32, threshold 0, GB 570, and disc -30 in 9Khz.

Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
June 01, 2020 12:25PM
Dew...…. you are one of the most dedicated/serious beach-hunters that I know!...……. and ……… of whom POSTS!
That is a LOT of targets...… considering you are IN the water.

HUGE (unsuspecting) intel in this photo...…… that most folks may never see. Look at (((what may "appear" to be....a disproportionate amount of))) all the earrings in this photo...…. compared to the rest of the targets. Can anyone go one step further...…… as to what I am implicating...……...and the photo (Mother Nature) alludes? Especially you beach hunters?!
(((If you can go two steps further...……. you are 'home'...….. and have reached euphoric nirvana))).

Tremendous education herein.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
June 01, 2020 12:57PM
Great post Dew. Looks like the hurricane season is starting early for you. Hopefully it will start moving that sand for you!

TARSACCI - “Digging deeper, BEHIND the competition!”
[www.tarsaccisales.com]
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
June 01, 2020 01:01PM
Tom,
not having one of your detectors .....but your earrings comment tells me Tarsacci can see the "broken" rings of earrings better than others.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
June 01, 2020 05:14PM
The shocking part im hunting a very popular beach so it gets hunted. Half of those earrings are IRON and open. I check myself by digging them on occasion....solid ROUND sound much like an iron bottle cap. I can say this machine unlike say the CTX isn’t affected by a broken gold ring and only slightly on open gold earrings... mostly the hollow ones.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
June 02, 2020 11:52AM
Rod...… the Tarsacci does do some unique things. But...… in general...… open-hoop earrings are hard to detect by most detectors/brands.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
June 02, 2020 07:40PM
The earrings are light and airy, nothing to them weight, volume wise. Same with the aluminum trash and sunglasses. The ratio of heaver coins compared to all the other items looks like 4 or 5 to 1. There are no solid heavy gold items or gold rings in the picture. They may be beyond detector range because of sink rate. Or nobody wears expensive jewelry to the beach anymore.

The glasses and the ear rings (female) come off the head, involuntarily,. ... coins from male swimwear, involuntarily. Trash voluntarily tossed.

My 1-1/2 cents and only a beach hunter 1/4 of a % of the time, maybe less.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
June 02, 2020 08:12PM
The trash was deeper than you may think. Why..... because during the winter we had storms that pushed in a ton of seaweed that dug deep and moved a lot of this toward shore. This is one of the most popular beaches in the US.... in fact has been rated the no. one beach in the US several times. Most all of these we call floaters....... light weight and targets with a surface. Those sunglasses .......15" at least deep. Theres no gold because i didnt go over it, didnt know it was gold, as you say its to deep, people didnt loose it, OR.... other hunters got there first. A lot of beaches here in Fl especially this time of the year have 3 shifts of hunter. Every thing you see there MOVES.

Here is todays beach which has been replenished and much smaller...... less people... less hunters. The ring is 3.4 grams size 6 14K, bracelet is 6.1 grams 14K, and the silver chain is italian 925. The silver chain was a wierd tone. I went over it then just set the coil over it......it had a vibrating sound. I assume the water was moving it under the coil and it was laying straight. Not deep but quick tone. The ring was about 6 to 8" it appeared to be on its side..... very round weak SMALL tone. the bracelet i thought was foil at first but it was a solid tone. Note all those 50 cals. They came from about 1/2 mile out. I dug this many and could have dug at least a dozen more....... but they were nearly 2' down and sounded good. By time you get done you have a hole as large as a man hole cover..... but the target remained right in the middle.

I added a pic of my ear protector. One of my friends did it as a project for me. Unfortunately he got the virus.... so never heard much about him or the project which started at the beginning of Feb. Been trying to check on him with no response. So i hope him and his family are well.

picture host



Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
June 02, 2020 08:20PM
Very nice finds dew, glad to see your back at it!

TARSACCI - “Digging deeper, BEHIND the competition!”
[www.tarsaccisales.com]
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
June 02, 2020 08:32PM
Very nice.......looks like you and mdt8000 gettin' along just fine. Really like that ear protector....hope your friend and fly. are all ok...gl and hh!
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
June 02, 2020 08:57PM
Aaron .... that was 4 hours and just ran out of gas in the tank. i covered the area i felt would be the most productive and might not have gotten hit. So i hope i didnt miss all the better stuff lol. Ive had some issues slowing my hunting days and hours down. So right now its hit and miss on days out there. We all know the more time you can get in the better..... especially with this being recent drop time. You can tell by the faded buttons..... my machine isnt setting in the closet.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
June 02, 2020 09:09PM
Dew...… nice finds. Congrats on the gold!. Glad you are finding chains with the Tarsacci. Yes...…. I'm still seeing shifting sandbars on my East Coast beach.
You should patent that coil ear strengthener!
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
June 02, 2020 09:09PM
I’d say that 9.5grms of yellow metal was very productive 4hrs!
I was wondering about the faded face plate, however considering the hundreds of hours of intense sunlight and salt you’ve put on the Tarsacci, I’m sure most other machines would fair about the same. From 30+ years of water hunting, Ive found it to put the most wear on a machine.

TARSACCI - “Digging deeper, BEHIND the competition!”
[www.tarsaccisales.com]
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
June 02, 2020 09:14PM
dewcon4414 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
Note all those 50 cals. They came from about 1/2 mile out. I dug this ma
> ny and could have dug at least a dozen more.......
> but they were nearly 2' down and sounded good. By
> time you get done you have a hole as large as a ma
> n hole cover..... but the target remained right in
> the middle.


Are you saying the 50 cal. shells came from 1/2 mile out to sea? How did they get way out there? Were they dumping perfectly good brass offshore?

We get the same shells up here from when the beaches were set up in preparation for a possible German invasion. Lots of target practice going on I guess.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/02/2020 10:32PM by Badger in NH.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
June 02, 2020 09:21PM
Tom..... im trying to contact the guy who did um for me for a few more. I have them on my Nox as well. Id like to see if hes interested in selling them to those who want um. He was doing them for the Nox.... for cheap. Once the 3D printer program is there its fairly cheap and easy to do from what he said. Tom..... i found 5 or 6 last year i think. they are a little tricky to hear you can not be flying down the beach especially in the water. Like you said when you helped introduce the machine...... there is a right sweep speed. To slow and it dont get deep... to fast and it tends to filter out the small gold... but ya get some great depth. Now .... what was it you were going to tell us about those finds???
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
June 03, 2020 02:11AM
Part 1 (of 2) is...…… earrings are lost ….. in volumes (large numbers)!
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
June 03, 2020 09:04AM
Badger Venice is a man made town.... it used to be an air base. They did training runs down the beach. Normally these appear when we get deeper cuts. But this beach was re-nurished and the sand was all pumped in from about a 1/2 out. So we were finding a LOT of these in the dry sand initially ... now as it settles in the water and we begin hunting it we are getting slowly cleaning these out. Yes these came from wayyyy out there.

Thank Tom. I suspect i left some earring studs out there because if it fell thru the scoop a couple of times....... i consider them LEAVER-RIGHTS.
Re: ON THE HORIZON = MDT-8000
June 03, 2020 05:22PM
Hello just my 2 cents but the buttons seems to have discoloured greatly.How old is this machine.


Thanks

RR
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