The EQX is heavily designed around the 11" coil. The 15" coil does not express quite the same attributes as the 11" coil (although there is some).

NASA Tom,

Thank you for your in-depth explanation. I would like some clarification on one thing you mention. Does F2 have to be on '0' in order to see the difference in target ID numbers? You use the example of tilted coins may have ID'd as 15-17,now they tend / want to ID as 18-20 (IH penny ID's). If I increase F2 above '0' does this increase stop the tilted coin from correctly ID'ing? Thanks - Jim



TomD Wrote:
PART-1

This particular thread appears to be the least 'battled' …. so I shall post a few EQX MUU-2 data here. The new EQX upgrade (MUU-2) makes the EQX a 3rd Generation EQX.
1. Original EQX
2. EQX with MUU-1
3. EQX with MUU-2
I'm not seeing enough data advertised/on social media..... or otherwise...………….. about this update. Soooooooo……….. let me impart/convey: Target Recovery Response settings remain exactly the same. Press (and hold) TRR and TRR becomes 'underlined'. You now enter into FE Mode/Option. IT TOO.... remains exactly the same. You can test FE 0-9 settings head-to-head..... with a non-upgraded EQX...…. to verify it is exactly the same. Now press the accept/reject button. You will see the EQX now flip over to the new F2 Mode. This is where 'new life' begins.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Part-2

Let's get into the nuts/bolts of F2. . . . . . and with the shortest words/wordings possible. F2 = 7, 8 & 9 are VERY aggressive for making steel bottlecaps ID as 'iron' ….. and this function is highly successful. . . . . . . except for the most shiny, brand-new, non-oxidized steel bottlecaps. Please understand: steel bottlecaps are 'round' …. so they want to ID as non-ferrous. Please understand: steel bottlecaps are NON-ferrous coated (zinc, nickel, sometimes even copper coated)…. and metal detector eddy-currents travel on the outer skin of the object..... soooooooo ….. a detector WANTS to ID the bottlecap as a 'non-ferrous' object. ALL Mfr's struggle with this. Principles/laws of physics rule! F2 = 7, 8, and especially 9 are VERY aggressive..... BUT...… at a cost. You now can open doors and hunt sites that were previously unhuntable…. due to excessive steel bottlecap litter. At the cost of: much reduced ability to 'unmask'. This is a trade-off. This is reality. You cannot have both (yet). (((We are looking at double-stacked/dual-core electronic options))). FE '9' is equivalent to F2 '6'.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Part 3

New life. New chapter.

FE '0' = F2 '4'
But...…. this is to say:
F2 '3' would be equivalent to FE -1/4
F2 '2' would be equivalent to FE -2/4 (negative 1/2)
F2 '1' would be equivalent to FE -3/4
F2 '0' would be equivalent to FE -4/4 (negative 1)
You have to have a 'vision' (…… a dream..... a concept)……… in order to launch. You must have the end-in-mind..... in order to begin. Here is the thought-process (my rationale)…. for what I did. FE '0' is a fairly aggressive 'unmasker'. Probably about the maximum.... that most normal folks could handle. FE '0' is a fairly steep learning-curve; yet, can be mastered..... to the point that it becomes YOUR 'new norm'...… even considering the size of the coil (11" standard.... by no accident). Sooooooooo. I was certain that introducing/inducing a FE -1, -2, -3, and -4 would be excessively overboard (with a audible disaster of falsing in iron); hence, the rationale was to have a reduced-scaling decremented linear graduation.... that would be more GP-masses acceptable. . . . . . but..... yes..... only to the experienced EQX users..... especially the experienced EQX FE '0' users.
Because life is short..... RAPIDLY expediting (and enhancing) your learning-curve is paramount. Do not overspeed the human brain..... or you will fail the new technological enhancement...… ultimately; failing yourself. IF you feel you are a experienced FE '0' user..... and have mastered FE '0'..... THEN proceed to F2 '2'. Don't go any further.... or you will fatigue-out.... and in short order.
F2 '0' (which is equiv to FE '-1') is where (ultimately) your new EQX life will begin. Unmasking in carpets of nails..... is now enhanced by approx. 2%. This may not be much; yet, if you have found... say..... 400 key era implements in a particular spot.... the 2% enhancement will afford you another 8 items. Iron will 'false' a bit more. But...… (here will be your learning-curve)…… the increased falses are MUCH more audibly intelligible as a 'false'. You will see. You will learn. You will understand exactly why I say this. The EQX audio will teach you. It is auto-intuitive.
I knew with this new F2 '0' intent-to-implementation.... that there was a additive side-benefit (which was primary....to me). I was not intelligent enough to impart/convey my 'gut' (and my thoughts) to the rest of the team at ML.... so I had to "force to success" this conceptual notion. 'Gut'..... has now come to fruition. In a nutshell: place F2 on '0' and go back to your EQX-pounded coin hunting sites.... and see what happens. Your best ratio of results will come from high trashy sites.... with both a mix of ferrous and (preferably) non-ferrous trash. You will see/witness finding more tilted coins. It will generate the (correct) epiphany that most coins are tilted. . . . . . . via exposing you to: "you don't know..... what you don't know"...…. by showing you more tilted flat objects. Previously.... these tilted coins may have ID'd as 15-17. Now.... they tend/want to ID as 18-20 (Indian Head penny ID's). There's very little 'negative' side-effects to F2 '0'...… except for the rapid learning-curve of a different type/amount of falsing. Still...… DO initiate your learning-curve with F2 on '2'....…. until you get use to this. THEN you can jump to F2 '0'. Do not (unsuspectingly) fatigue yourself out...… prematurely.

Jim...… yes. The deeper you go into F2...…. the better it will ID tilted coins in trash. F2 '0' being the best.

One additional thing I need to say is:

Example:
The EQX employs (what I call) 'bleed audio'.
The CZ employs (what I call) 'lock-out audio'.

I choose these two detectors as examples...……. as they are popular/common detectors.
Bleed audio = a detector that starts to audibly report a target..... then will immediately change/switch to a "different/new target" audio..... because the coil is immediately swept over another (very close) in succession.... target.
Lock-out audio = When the detector is reporting the audio of a detected target...…. the detection of another target is impossible …. as the detector is 'busy' reporting the first target ….. and not processing another detected target...…. until the audio of the first detected target....is complete. After the audio report is complete...… the detector is THEN capable of reporting the next detected target (((which may mean that several targets in succession go: audibly "missed"...…… because the coil was still in motion after the first detected target))).

Thank you NASA - Tom. I appreciate all your assistance. - Jim

Three of us decided to go to a old park we have been pounding with our Equinox's. This Park has lots of trash and iron. My brother and friend Mike hunted using F2 4 and F2 9. I went with F2 0. We hunted a area that has produced wheats and silvers. At the end of the hunt my brother had found 0 wheats 0 silver and my friend Mike found 1 wheat. I ended up with 5 wheats and 1 Barber dime. Did I find more because I chose to go with F2 0 or was it just luck? All I can say is when I dug that Barber dime it was standing almost straight up and down in the side of the hole about 7 inches down. I had no problem telling iron from non ferrous targets. They chose to block out some of the iron to hear the good targets and I chose to unblock the iron as much as the Equinox would let me so I could hear good targets as close to iron as possible. Now it's got me wondering if using less iron bias will help me find more.

Mccrorysjewelry2 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Three of us decided to go to a old park we have be
> en pounding with our Equinox's. This Park has lots
> of trash and iron. My brother and friend Mike hunt
> ed using F2 4 and F2 9. I went with F2 0. We hunte
> d a area that has produced wheats and silvers. At
> the end of the hunt my brother had found 0 wheats
> 0 silver and my friend Mike found 1 wheat. I ended
> up with 5 wheats and 1 Barber dime. Did I find mor
> e because I chose to go with F2 0 or was it just l
> uck? All I can say is when I dug that Barber dime
> it was standing almost straight up and down in the
> side of the hole about 7 inches down. I had no pro
> blem telling iron from non ferrous targets. They c
> hose to block out some of the iron to hear the goo
> d targets and I chose to unblock the iron as much
> as the Equinox would let me so I could hear good t
> argets as close to iron as possible. Now it's got
> me wondering if using less iron bias will help me
> find more.

nice report! couple things, how did the dime id/sound? what TRR did you use to go along with F2 0? thanks,
I've only tried F2=4 on my single outing with the new update, F2=0 coming up, lol
oh, and did the ID's for wheats ring up higher than before, ie into the 30's?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/29/2019 09:30PM by canslawhero.

I went on a short Park hunt today trying out the new firmware update..
No back to back settings checking.. Just hunted as usual..
Started in FE-2-2 since I am used to running FE 0.
Plan was to stay there for the first hunt but after a couple minutes I dropped down to FE-2-0 because the Nox was running so well.

Is it just my imagination or has the falsing been improved even running in negative FE?
I expected MORE iron falsing but this was not the case..

Also, the detector seems to be able to analyze much better and faster as you sweep the coil over the target.
The Iron falsing tones seemed easier to understand as actual falsing.
Iron falsing would just melt away after a couple sweeps more often the usual.
It was much easier for me to make dig decisions.

One of my Wheat Cents and one of my V Nickels were with iron and both were able to lock on with tight IDs once I isolated them.

So far Im am very happy with the update and am anxious to put more time on it.

Bryan

Very interesting report, Bryan. NASA-Tom alluded to the "falsing" being easier to "discern" when running F2 less than 4...

Hmm...

Steve

Bryan-I noticed what you're talking about at F2-4 hadn't noticed it at 0 but my soil is different I'm sure.

One observation I've made and maybe it's always been this way and not the upgrade, but never noticed it until now. It seems like I can tell when I'm going to dig shotgun brass. The tone is more hollow sounding, dug like 7 or 8 tonight and was thinking before I dug each one that it was going to be a shotgun shell. I'm talking the old stuff that usually sounds good not the mixed alloy ones that are newer, they are really easy to tell.

There are some different tonal nuances with this update for sure. Especially with iron.
Coins sounded the same but seemed to run tighter then normal ID wise.
Too short of a hunt to see if this is new or just a coincidence.

My small pistol brass I dug today was not hollow sounding like you mentioned but the only rusty crown cap
I did dig was very hollow sounding. It really caught my attention and had a very unique, hollow ring to it.
I don’t remember anything ever sounding quite like that.

Bryan

Yes, concur, there is more tonal nuance with this update. I only hunted 2 hours with it, and iron never tricked me. I dug a little but just to put into a visual what I was hearing.
You know, the think about 50 tones here that is so valuable is that you can hear adjacent targets blend into the initial hit. (Tom D talked about this form of information transmission, as opposed to a CZ I think.)
Definitely opens up the ability to sort of "Put you hands into the Earth and feel what it is you hear." - If you know what I mean.

EMS

I had 8hrs on mine at a dig on Saturday, jumped on deep and ran f2 on 0.
I dug a few deep big round iron items as you do, and i dug plenty of iffy signals, but to be honest i'd no bother discerning small nail size iron, thumbs up from me.

canslawhero, my setting were Park 1, 50 tones, recovery 3, bias F2-0, Sens 25 and All metal. Some what slow swing speed. The wheats came in in the low to mide 20's. Bottle caps hit 22 almost every time. The silver dime was a very high tone. Upper 20's to mid 30's. Seemed to jump around some as I tried to isolate it. Was in with some iron. All I can say is I could tell when I was hitting on iron vs a non ferrous target. I first started out questioning myself and dug some high tones that I knew were iron but, I wanted to see for myself. The Equinox ran so smooth and every non ferrous target seemed to come in so crisp. I had no problem telling the iron from the non ferrous. I also noticed if I had several targets under the coil as I moved I had no problem isolating each target. I could really tell when I hit a high conductive target mixed in with all the low and mid tones and iron. I really enjoyed running the Equinox wide open. That was the first time I have run the Equinox using F2-0. Look forward hunting in some of my other spots to see if I can pull some goodies using F2-0. Being able to see more instead of less has really opened my eyes in how I will hunt in trashy and iron sites. That silver dime standing on edge was a true eye opener. Don't know if the Equinox would have seen it using a much higher F2 number and would it have come in as high as it did.

McCJ2 = Your 3 textbook examples...….. give three classic (design intent) textbook resultants of F2 '0'.

Cabin Fever & ghound = You should be experiencing about 10% greater 'falsing'; yet, at a audible human intelligibility enhancement of 70%...…… WHICH...…. (in turn) ….. can easily override any perceived (or otherwise) notion of 10% additional actual falsing.

Bad dirt (like Andrew)…….. and all-bets-are-off!

A lot of this audio stuff is hard to put into words. I run my detector hot and noisy. ( probably too noisy)
Most of my dig decisions are audio based and what ever was changed in this update worked well for me
and made the hunt easier and more pleasant for sure.

Bryan

Have you guys noticed there are two main though processes going on out there (mostly outside this forum) concerning F2 iron bias. One is how much more trash can I avoid digging and the other is what possibilities is this opening up for more and better finds. Some people are so scared of digging a little trash LOL.

Myself I'm excited for more and better finds, I've always enjoyed pushing detectors to the limit to see what they can do.

Abenson Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Have you guys noticed there are two main though pr
> ocesses going on out there (mostly outside this fo
> rum) concerning F2 iron bias. One is how much more
> trash can I avoid digging and the other is what po
> ssibilities is this opening up for more and better
> finds. Some people are so scared of digging a litt
> le trash LOL.
>
> Myself I'm excited for more and better finds, I've
> always enjoyed pushing detectors to the limit to s
> ee what they can do.

I’m not afraid to dig trash. I hunt very nice public parks for old coins.
I can’t bring a shovel in and start tearing it up for every iffy signal I hear as much as I would like to.
I have to be selective and analyze signals before I decide to break ground.
This is why I am happy with the new firmware.. The new audio definitely helped with signal analysis..

Bryan

Bryan-I get where you're coming from, best use of time is another factor. A lot of cities and the county here have banned metal detecting in parks because too many people leave the lawn torn up. I also analyze targets a lot before I dig even though I have the luxury of digging big holes with a shovel. Time is limited and digging holes takes time.

My first go-round with the new build today was only about an hour and a half, but I am pleased with it so far. As I mentioned before, up until 2 weeks ago, I had ALWAYS been at FE=2, since day 1 of swinging the EQX, but had just started experimenting with FE=0 over the past couple of hunts. So, being "new" to that setting, I was definitely digging more deep rusty nails than normal.

Today, after loading version 2.1.12, I started off at F2=4, but before long I "jumped in the deep end," and set it at F2=0. In doing so, I correspondingly set my "mental discriminator" high, expecting to be overloaded with falsing iron. Instead of "trying to find a reason not to dig" the deep chirps, I instead "tried to make the deep chirps FORCE me to dig." It was just a bit of a "mindset" change, but my reasoning was that I expected that the falsing was really going to try to fool me, running F2 at 0, and so I was going to try my best NOT to end up with a pouch full of nails, and just see if I could manage to separate the ferrous from the non-ferrous, based on the audio I was hearing.

Well, my early impressions are -- it was nowhere near as bad as I expected. The park I was at, is one that I've just about cleaned out (to the best of my ability, anyway), after hunting it HARD for 8 years. It's not a "carpet of nails," by any stretch, but there are plenty of deep rusty nails, and anytime at this park when I set my mind on trying to nab just one more coin, which I expect will often be at the very depth limit of the machine, I'm usually running my "mental discrimination" extra low, and really "reaching" for the deep chirps that are almost certain to be nails, but just barely "good enough" not to pass on. Today however, though I set my "mental discriminator" much higher, I can say that I didn't dig but two nails, and one was right at the beginning of the hunt. And now, reading what NASA-Tom said a few posts back -- that the "audio intelligibility" of the "falsing" is much greater with F2, and others also alluding to this -- I can really see what is meant by that.

Many nail falses only took about 10 to 20 degrees of "rotation" of my body around the target, before the signal went completely to iron tones. In other words, obvious nails. Others, I was able to "hold" the high tones for a larger arc of rotation around the target, but still eventually was able to identify it as "likely iron." Finally, I hit a high tone that, while I could hear a bit of iron toning mixed in, this target was "different." In fact, I said to myself, "now, there's a non-ferrous down there, this time." Sure enough, it was a wheat cent from about 6" to 7" deep. Finding a wheat in this park -- and it was in a spot I've been over MANY times -- is a real victory! I dug several other non-ferrous (but junk) targets thereafter, each with a bit of iron tone mixed in, but only that 1 additional nail. My takeaway is -- for the first time using F2=0, and expecting to dig a bunch of nails, and expecting to suffer from mental fatigue, I instead ended the hunt with a sense of confidence that it won't be as hard to become skillful at weeding out the falsing iron using F2=0 as I had thought. And again, after forming these initial "first hunt" impressions, and then seeing these posts about F2 giving more intelligent audio, in terms of allowing mental discrimination of the falsing iron, it adds credence to my initial impressions, and thus builds confidence even more.

Steve

Steve------How did the E-800 act/perform in your ground when you were in F2-4?-----Did you try F2-2 before "jumping off the deep end" into F2-0?----Mainly interested in hearing why you departed from F2-4 so quickly?--------Del

Did a quick 1 hour hunt yesterday at the church camp. Spent most of that time in the nail pit where the original frame church burnt to the ground. On a previous hunt there using FE 0, 2 shallow wheat cents were found (2-4" deep) and the TID smeared with extremes of 20 to 30 but mostly a little better. The 6" coil of a friends 800 narrowed the TID range down considerably.

I did some comparisons yesterday but those were mostly to see the difference in audio intelligibility between FE 0 and F2 0. I noted a big difference here. with FE 0 it's the iron grunt and high tone falseing. F2 0 breaks things up with choppy responses mixed in with the grunt indicating to me that it is responding quicker between targets and by a lot. Seemed more so to my ear than the -1 FE equivalent that Tom stated should be. Subjective for sure but I really like that choppy sound, it's reassuring in an old analog (think Fisher 1236) kind of way.

Now I have to admit that I did get fooled quite a bit digging the iffies, Soo many sounded too good to my ear not to go after them. Part of the learning curve and I feel with more time it will get better.

Did I find anything? well yeah I got a 1916 wheat penny. A bit of luck really but it showed what the new F2 settings can do. A nice softer high tone came up that was only repeatable in a narrow window but with a decently steady TID of 17 (22-24 TID in the dirt pile) So extremely lucky that I hit it just right on the initial pass. Depth was 7-8" and in that mess pretty astounding.
So you know I run a 3 tone modification of the 5 tone that just so happens to have everything 17 and above giving a high tone response.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/01/2019 11:49AM by Jackpine.

Curious Tom...... how GOOD headphones might come into play with the audio and settings? I know an excellent pair of phones can give you a lot more response even to minerals.

Abenson..... not sure the city is as concerned with our digging as receiving and having to address a persons complaint. Seems easier to just put a sign out and say no detecting. MOST of us do far less damage than the mowers used.

Now for water hunting Tom. I see they suggested F2 at 6.... was hunting in the water considered or is this just the wet/dry sand? Things do change out there. Is our goal in the water to run...... say Recovery around 4, sensitivity about 18, THEN adjust the F2 upward until surface minerals/salt is ELIMINATED? What kind of depth/sensitivity to GOLD are we loosing? Im interested to know how these adjustments in F2 will affect searching for gold in the water. Before this added adjustment...... this machine can get pretty chatty and you are trying to hear a tone right there near the sound of iron if hunting in 50 tones in some cases. You do a lot of second guessing about what you just heard. If we use to much of an aggressive F2 setting ..... we may gain more silence to surface minerals but at what cost? On beaches i hunt at least bottle caps IN the water arent that big of a pain. The bigger issue for me would be that reduced sensitivity...... and of course REDUCED POWER in beach 2. Would 5 tones be a better option for an 800 user with the ability to adjust them for water hunting? For me its those lower tones in say the 9 and below where that iron falsing creaps in. Some people have adjusted that second tone to say 25..... but that drives me nuts with the falsing. I assume i have more adaptability to move some of this noise or eliminate it completely? Its not really about the bottle caps in the water.

Dew...……… collectively...……. we do not have enough IN the water data...…. to be able to 'clearly' answer. On my East Coast..... the waves are (nominal) 6-foot waves...….. making it difficult for me to go any more than waist-deep.
Your conditions are going to vary...….. and a 'norm' has not been established (as a 'bench')….. for IN the water … wet-saltwater hunting. I surmise a F2 '3' setting should be (approximately) most beneficial for you...…. and without the loss of small gold jewelry.

Steve & Tom...….. VERY well stated (and documented). I would love to see/hear more (and from other folks) about the new F2...…. so as to have a greater aggregate database of data...…. to be able to (more easier) move forward...….. with continued technological advancements.

NASA-Tom Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Jim...… yes. The deeper you go into F2...…. the be
> tter it will ID tilted coins in trash. F2 '0' bein
> g the best.
>


Tom... does the same apply to tilted or on edge gold rings on wet beach sand or does it only apply to tilted coins?
Also, do we still use full sensitivity or do we reduce sensitivity for a better audio report?

Mike



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/01/2019 02:26PM by DiggaMke.

Mike...….. there's some unique physics employed here.
First...….. gold rings and aluminum flip-tabs are lower conductors to begin with. When they are tilted (and most are.... to some degree)……. they will ID even lower. But...…. ironically...… F2 '0' will only (marginally) 'up-average' the ID...… a small amount.....(((to answer your question))). The items/targets that attribute the most..... are the higher conductor items..... such as brass/bronze/copper/silver coins. BUT...…. you are on a wet-salt beach...….. so you are going to dig anything that ID's above iron....anyway!

Sensitivity is to be PRIMARILY utilized …. as a EMI mitigation tool. Run the Sens as high as EMI/local conditions allow. Weak/deep/tilted targets will generate a greater signal-strength...… with a higher Sens/gain setting; subsequently, ...… present a better target (conductivity) ID. (Unless you have really bad dirt...… which will give too much feedback/blowback...… if Sens is too high))).

NASA-Tom Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Mike...….. there's some unique physics employed he
> re.
> First...….. gold rings and aluminum flip-tabs are
> lower conductors to begin with. When they are tilt
> ed (and most are.... to some degree)……. they will
> ID even lower. But...…. ironically...… F2 '0' will
> only (marginally) 'up-average' the ID...… a small
> amount.....(((to answer your question))). The item
> s/targets that attribute the most..... are the hig
> her conductor items..... such as brass/bronze/copp
> er/silver coins. BUT...…. you are on a wet-salt
> beach...….. so you are going to dig anything that
> ID's above iron....anyway!
>
> Sensitivity is to be PRIMARILY utilized …. as a EM
> I mitigation tool. Run the Sens as high as EMI/loc
> al conditions allow. Weak/deep/tilted targets will
> generate a greater signal-strength...… with a high
> er Sens/gain setting; subsequently, ...… present a
> better target (conductivity) ID. (Unless you have
> really bad dirt...… which will give too much feedb
> ack/blowback...… if Sens is too high))).

Tom... thanks for the in-depth explanation. Much appreciated.

Mike

You brought up new tech advancement...... even MLs going to have to step it up significantly with the price tag, warranty, and improvement the Nox has. I think its great they are making/giving us these updates to tweak this detector. For most ....... its going to have to be something special to even consider spending money on another machine.

Tom, nice report on on the burned church and f2 0.

D&P-OR Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Steve------How did the E-800 act/perform in your g
> round when you were in F2-4?-----Did you try F2-2
> before "jumping off the deep end" into F2-0?----Ma
> inly interested in hearing why you departed from F
> 2-4 so quickly?--------Del


Del,

Thanks for asking!

In answer to "how did it act" when in F2=4, my answer is that I didn't stick with it long enough to know for sure. What I can say, is that I worked through an area of the park, right at the beginning of the hunt, in F2=4, where there is a particular abundance of nails/rusty iron. Working through there, at F2=4, I found out rather quickly that I wasn't particularly inclined to dig more nails than usual, when listening to the F2=4 audio. Remember, I'm "new" to FE=0, and I have been tending to dig more nails, with that setting. So, I was thinking/expecting that F2=4 would be "the same," such that I'd be digging some nails. But, after a short while through that irony patch, I discovered, as I mentioned, that I was NOT having all that much trouble with the nail falses (was it because the "audio" is better, in F2 compared to FE, thus helping me out, or was it just because maybe I've gotten a bit better over the past couple of hunts, hunting with less iron bias applied...I was not sure). So, since F2=4 wasn't proving to be an issue, and since this park is NOT a "carpet of nails," I moved out of that more "irony" area, into an area with less iron, and basically just thought to myself "OK, I know that the iron in this part of the park isn't TOO thick, let's see how bad F2=0 really is, falsing-wise."

In other words, instead of taking a "baby step" by bumping down only part way, to F2=2, I took a "different" baby step -- i.e. going all the way to F2=0 --but-- moving to a place where the iron is less thick, to where I could sort of interrogate/work each "ferrous/non-ferrous blended signal" individually, and really listen, and think about what I was hearing.

Not sure if I explained myself real well; hopefully that made some sense, and answered your questions, Del!

Steve

Thanks for your response to my question(s) Steve.------Personally, I think some of the ongoing info on this update & how to set it is a little confusing.-----I'm sure it is very heavily based/dependent on a persons ground conditions (also on an individuals expertise--and patience).------When I had a E-800, I ran it (mostly but not always) in FE-0 & ended up getting rid of it, mainly because of all that lousy iron falseing in the nail riddled sites I hunt.----I am getting another one to give it a try based on Toms recommendation to "set & forget" F2-4.-----Then eventually go to F2-2 & finally F2-0----as the learning process evolves.----I may want to go as high as F2-6 with proper recovery--we'll see.-------Sounds like you really took the short cut.-----It appears that it could really get down in there & get targets in the iron (if run properly).-------There was a guy that did a video with the 6" coil on board & square nails give him "fits" with the new update.----Maybe he didn't have it set up right & it was because of that rather than the coil.-----I know I'm going to be using the 11" stock coil first as Tom says that is what this new update is "based" on.---------Del